Harvard Team Captains Can No Longer Be From Unrecognized Frats

[Lehigh Football Nation]

http://www.thecrimson.com/article/2016/5/6/college-sanctions-clubs-greeklife/


Starting with Harvard’s Class of 2021, undergraduate members of unrecognized single-gender social organizations will be banned from holding athletic team captaincies and leadership positions in all recognized student groups. They will also be ineligible for College endorsement for top fellowships like the Rhodes and Marshall scholarships.

Jesus, discriminate much?

A football player could carry a 4.0, be valedictorian of his class, but Harvard won't endorse him for the Rhodes scholarship if he's a part of a frat? xeyebrowx

[aceinthehole]

How many "unrecognized single-gender social organizations" are there at Harvard?

[PantherRob82]

http://www.thecrimson.com/article/2016/5/6/college-sanctions-clubs-greeklife/



Jesus, discriminate much?

A football player could carry a 4.0, be valedictorian of his class, but Harvard won't endorse him for the Rhodes scholarship if he's a part of a frat? xeyebrowx

Isn't the key word "unrecognized"?

[DFW HOYA]

Seems like a lawsuit in the making. Would like to be the lawyer who finds out that Harvard scuttled a candidate's Rhodes interview for belonging to the Knights Of Columbus.

[aceinthehole]

Doesn't KOC have a Women's Auxiliary? ;)

I assume they are targeting 'Skull and Bones'-type organizations.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Isn't the key word "unrecognized"?

“Although the fraternities, sororities, and final clubs are not formally recognized by the College, they play an unmistakable and growing role in student life, in many cases enacting forms of privilege and exclusion at odds with our deepest values,” Faust wrote. “The College cannot ignore these organizations if it is to advance our shared commitment to broadening opportunity and making Harvard a campus for all of its students.”

[DFW HOYA]

““The College cannot ignore these organizations if it is to advance our shared commitment to broadening opportunity..."

Opportunity in post-season football does not count.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Opportunities in post-season football do not count.[/FONT][/COLOR]

You must spread reputation around....

[344Johnson]

Doesn't KOC have a Women's Auxiliary? ;)

I assume they are targeting 'Skull and Bones'-type organizations.

My first thought was this as well. Secret societies...

[Nickels]

This is absurd. Remember when Harvard was a respected institution? They're Berkley stupid these days.

[Go Green]

How many "unrecognized single-gender social organizations" are there at Harvard?

There are a handful at Dartmouth. One of which was the inspiration for Animal House, and usually has several football players as members.

[RichH2]

Seems like a lawsuit in the making. Would like to be the lawyer who finds out that Harvard scuttled a candidate's Rhodes interview for belonging to the Knights Of Columbus.

+1 :)

[RichH2]

“Although the fraternities, sororities, and final clubs are not formally recognized by the College, they play an unmistakable and growing role in student life, in many cases enacting forms of privilege and exclusion at odds with our deepest values,” Faust wrote. “The College cannot ignore these organizations if it is to advance our shared commitment to broadening opportunity and making Harvard a campus for all of its students.”
Hopefully one of our Harvard posters will clarify which and how many groups the Administation is targetting.

[RichH2]

So the football team captain can belong to a S and M Bondage Club as long as it isn't single gender??

[Bill]

So the football team captain can belong to a S and M Bondage Club as long as it isn't single gender??
Is that club formally recognized? xthumbsupx

[dbackjon]

Is that club formally recognized? xthumbsupx

As long as it isn't single gender, they are ok

[dbackjon]

So what happens if a Transgender joins a unrecognized single gender club (say, a men's fraternity, but the new member is biologically male, identifies as female).

What does Harvard do then?

[kdinva]

Opportunity in post-season football does not count.

xlolx xsmashx

[andthehomeofthe-BIZON-]

So what happens if a Transgender joins a unrecognized single gender club (say, a men's fraternity, but the new member is biologically male, identifies as female).

What does Harvard do then?

We'll call that an exclusivity paradox..

[RichH2]

So football team wants Bill Fratboy as its captain. Harvard says NONO. Why cant team pick Billy as their Leader pro tem?

[bulldog10jw]

My first thought was this as well. Secret societies...

If they're secret societies, who will know?

[dbackjon]

If they're secret societies, who will know?



Great Point!

[PantherRob82]

So does Harvard have "recognized" single gender organizations?

[bonarae]

The current and the forthcoming Harvard undergraduate students (up to the Class of 2020) thankfully are still exempt. But for the future students, they may probably think twice about their organizations that they will join.

This decision will probably pave the way for other universities to ban all single-gender organizations, i.e. most fraternities and sororities. Some D-III's and NAIA's have banned all Greek-named organizations from campus. Lawsuits, however, still seem likely.

But Harvard is trying to reduce sexual abuse prevalence among its students, mostly in the form of assault. Is this decision a double standard? xdontknowx

[RichH2]

So does Harvard have "recognized" single gender organizations?

Quick research indicates they do not. Harvard has frats ,sororities,final clubs and a Panhellanic Council. None of whom are" recognized". Such single dender groups may apply for recognition if they adopt a gender neutral policy. Apparently this policy is aimed at sexual harassment.

[POD Knows]

This is political correctness run amok. Freedom of association is dead in this country. This is clearly an attempt to degenderize the species. Liberalism is a mental disorder, get some ****ing help

[Laker]

Who are they going forced to elect next- Captain Obvious?

[UNHWildcat18]

This is political correctness run amok. Freedom of association is dead in this country. This is clearly an attempt to degenderize the species. Liberalism is a mental disorder, get some ****ing help

I absolutely agree the fact that Harvard doesn't recognize fraternities or sororities because they aren't gender neutral is the biggest crock of pussy **** I've ever heard. Reducing sexual harassment on campus lol not recognizing organizations makes it harder for the school to monitor that "problem".

[dbackjon]

This is political correctness run amok. Freedom of association is dead in this country. This is clearly an attempt to degenderize the species. Liberalism is a mental disorder, get some ****ing help


As a PRIVATE University, Harvard is free to make rules of this nature if they choose. This does not hinder the ability of Harvard Students to associate in same-sex clubs, but Harvard is reserving the right to choose what type of leaders it wants.

As for the rest of your post, LOL

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This is political correctness run amok. Freedom of association is dead in this country. This is clearly an attempt to degenderize the species. Liberalism is a mental disorder, get some ****ing help


BTW - you aren't related to Alpha (or maybe even him) are ya?

[RichH2]

The current and the forthcoming Harvard undergraduate students (up to the Class of 2020) thankfully are still exempt. But for the future students, they may probably think twice about their organizations that they will join.

This decision will probably pave the way for other universities to ban all single-gender organizations, i.e. most fraternities and sororities. Some D-III's and NAIA's have banned all Greek-named organizations from campus. Lawsuits, however, still seem likely.

But Harvard is trying to reduce sexual abuse prevalence among its students, mostly in the form of assault. Is this decision a double standard? xdontknowx
A rather simplistic attempt to address an admittedly serious situation. The implication is that frats are the primary cause of sexual assault and that removing them will solve the problem. Of course, the policy ignores co ed dorms and just the mere fact of men and women on the same campus. There is no cure all. Better practice would be to recognize frats and regulate them. The obvious double standard here is including sororities for the same treatment. Surely, forcing a sorority to admit young men will not engender the same issue. Idiotic.
Harvard as a private institution has a wider latitude to impose rules. Dont see any legal issue here just one of common sense.
Clearly students can still join those groups as lonng as they dont play sports or wont need a fellowship later. How this penalty impacts on preventing sexual assault is fuzzy. Ah,but then I didn't go to Harvard :)

[PantherRob82]

Quick research indicates they do not. Harvard has frats ,sororities,final clubs and a Panhellanic Council. None of whom are" recognized". Such single dender groups may apply for recognition if they adopt a gender neutral policy. Apparently this policy is aimed at sexual harassment.

So why so much use of the word "unrecognized" when none are recognized? Goofy.

[POD Knows]

As a PRIVATE University, Harvard is free to make rules of this nature if they choose. This does not hinder the ability of Harvard Students to associate in same-sex clubs, but Harvard is reserving the right to choose what type of leaders it wants.

As for the rest of your post, LOL

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BTW - you aren't related to Alpha (or maybe even him) are ya?

Nope, don't know who he is, I am just a commie hating, right wing libertarian nut job from the upper Midwest.

[JayJ79]

So why so much use of the word "unrecognized" when none are recognized? Goofy.

theoretically, the university could formally recognize organizations in the future.
perhaps if an organization keeps a clean track record for a certain amount of time, they could apply to be officially recognized or something. That could encourage the members of such organizations to police themselves in order to maintain recognition.

[KPSUL]

This policy is completely crazy. The membership rolls of the all male "Final Clubs" which I believe this rule is to a great extent directed, include US Presidents, generals, medal of honor recipients, and a large number of Senators and Governors.

[PAllen]

As a PRIVATE University, Harvard is free to make rules of this nature if they choose. This does not hinder the ability of Harvard Students to associate in same-sex clubs, but Harvard is reserving the right to choose what type of leaders it wants.

As for the rest of your post, LOL

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BTW - you aren't related to Alpha (or maybe even him) are ya?

Except of course that they receive federal funding and are therefore subject to federal civil rights regulations which include those covering the freedom of association. Just like the current far left justice department is going after anybody and everybody who does something they don't like, a far right department could come after Harvard hard for things like this. The big kicker though will come from pressure from influential alumni.

[POD Knows]

Except of course that they receive federal funding and are therefore subject to federal civil rights regulations which include those covering the freedom of association. Just like the current far left justice department is going after anybody and everybody who does something they don't like, a far right department could come after Harvard hard for things like this. The big kicker though will come from pressure from influential alumni.

Using a word like Freedom in a conversation with a leftist tool is a waste of time. They simply do not know what it is, they can't define it, they can't deal with it because it involves personal responsibility and accountability. Freedom of association is seen as non-inclusive and therefore it is anti-freedom because one of their delicate snowflakes might not be "free" to part of something for which they weren't invited. The leftists are the scuttling masses, requiring governmental and authoritarian discipline in order to be allowed to play the game.

[Bill]

If Harvard would just impose Sharia law on campus, none of this would be a problem.xdrunkyx

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By the way, where's Citdog to comment on all this Yankee scum PC stuff???

[Laker]

This policy is completely crazy. The membership rolls of the all male "Final Clubs" which I believe this rule is to a great extent directed, include US Presidents, generals, medal of honor recipients, and a large number of Senators and Governors.

A few months ago on Sunday Morning I watched a guy say that the Constitution was written by a bunch of old white men, and therefore it needed to be scrapped. He happened to be an old white man, but that was the only connection that he had with the Founding Fathers. Of course he didn't say what would be a better alternative. Just scrap everything.

I tried to find the email for Sunday Morning to ask what his credentials were and why he was allowed to give hie spiel. I finally found something in the ball park but was never given an answer. Can't get an answer if they don't have one.

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If Harvard would just impose Sharia law on campus, none of this would be a problem.xdrunkyx

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By the way, where's Citdog to comment on all this Yankee scum PC stuff???

I don't know- he was strangely absent from a Civil War discussion. He may be on special assignment.

[ElCid]

This policy is completely crazy. The membership rolls of the all male "Final Clubs" which I believe this rule is to a great extent directed, include US Presidents, generals, medal of honor recipients, and a large number of Senators and Governors.

Nobody else has mentioned this but I believe that this is directly applicable to the finals clubs and not the run of the mill frats. These clubs are very secret apparently and mostly/all(?) male. A few gals wanted to join and were turned back so this is a specific attack on these clubs. They are not recognized. I heard this on a news story but I wish some Harvard grad would expand so we get the bottom line on these clubs.

They are not even on campus apparently so it makes this action a bit of a stretch. Does that mean that they could also ban those with affiliations to any other organization they feel like? That is kind of scary. Because once this precedent is set in more and more institutions, then it is open season for ANYONE to decide what is acceptable and nothing can be said by any political persuasion.

[RichH2]

While I agree with PAllen's post on freedom of association, that SCOTUS has limited it somewhat in college goernance cases. Here, Harvard in bounds legally in its approach to the recognition of student groups. They are not banning them justcwarning students of the university consequences of joinu g a single gender group. Policy still makes no sense in accomplishing its stated purpose. An idiotic academic exercise acomplishing nothing worthwhile.

[Ivytalk]

This is a crock of egalitarian ****. Drew Faust should be impeached and ridden out of town on a rail. Fact is, Harvard has had a number of all-male final clubs for years. Some are snobbish; some aren't. Some are more exclusive than others. FDR was blackballed from Porcellian (TR got in) and had to settle for the Fly. There are even several women's final clubs now, plus a few frats. All in all, they're harmless vestiges of a bygone era, and not influential. This is just another reason why I haven't given to my alma mater in over 10 years.

[chattownmocs]

This policy is completely crazy. The membership rolls of the all male "Final Clubs" which I believe this rule is to a great extent directed, include US Presidents, generals, medal of honor recipients, and a large number of Senators and Governors.

Is that a surprise? Most of those were/are white guys.

[JayJ79]

can KKK members hold athletic team captaincies and leadership positions in all recognized student groups?

[Twentysix]

can KKK members hold athletic team captaincies and leadership positions in all recognized student groups?

Does the KKK allow women?

[KPSUL]

Is that a surprise? Most of those were/are white guys.

And your point is what?

[Go Green]

This decision will probably pave the way for other universities to ban all single-gender organizations, i.e. most fraternities and sororities. .



There have been several efforts to make that happen at Dartmouth. All have failed. I expect frats and sororities to exist at Dartmouth for a long while.

[dgtw]

Does the KKK allow women?

I found an application on line and it said you had to be a white Christian and 18 years old. It did not say it was limited to men.

[UNHWildcat18]

There have been several efforts to make that happen at Dartmouth. All have failed. I expect frats and sororities to exist at Dartmouth for a long while.

I sure hope so, I'm a sigma chi alumni and UNH and the amount of hate Greek life gets from people who have A have no involvement with it and B have no idea what actually goes on in it, is ridiculous. Glad the leaders at Dartmouth still have some sense unlike. I think Harvards situation is simple, they just don't want kids joining unrecognized groups and by telling the small percentage of the student body who are athletes that they can't be captains is to help persuade them from joining. Honestly though D-1 athletes don't have time for Greek life, I doubt the numbers of d-1 athletes in recognized or unrecognized Greek houses are very high

[Twentysix]

I found an application on line and it said you had to be a white Christian and 18 years old. It did not say it was limited to men.

Thanks, you are now on an FBI watchlist, but it seems that a member could captain the Hahvahd football team.

[dgtw]

Thanks, you are now on an FBI watchlist, but it seems that a member could captain the Hahvahd football team.


I deleted my Google search for it as soon as I was done reading it. Hopefully it didn't send up any red flags.

[Bisonoline]

I sure hope so, I'm a sigma chi alumni and UNH and the amount of hate Greek life gets from people who have A have no involvement with it and B have no idea what actually goes on in it, is ridiculous. Glad the leaders at Dartmouth still have some sense unlike. I think Harvards situation is simple, they just don't want kids joining unrecognized groups and by telling the small percentage of the student body who are athletes that they can't be captains is to help persuade them from joining. Honestly though D-1 athletes don't have time for Greek life, I doubt the numbers of d-1 athletes in recognized or unrecognized Greek houses are very high

My question is what is an unrecognized group? Because there are fraternities that are recognized by the university like SAE, TKE etc. Now there are other frats that have no national home office and arent a member of the greek system. Is that what they are meaning?

[RichH2]

No frats,final clubs or sororities are "recognized" by Harvard. Affiliation or lack thereof is irrelevant to Harvard.

[Laker]

No frats,final clubs or sororities are "recognized" by Harvard. Affiliation or lack thereof is irrelevant to Harvard.

So why does Harvard care about which organizations that an athlete might belong to? This whole thing is confusing and reeks of nannyism. I realize as a private school they can make the rules that they want to but does anyone know what it is that they are trying to do?

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Where it goes from "that's bad" to "that's cold" is the idea that somehow a sponsorship to a Rhodes Scholarship might be withheld as a result of fraternity membership. To withhold that from a kid with the academics to qualify is fifty shades of awful.

[Go Green]

Glad the leaders at Dartmouth still have some sense

The "leaders" are the ones trying to get rid of the Greek System in Hanover. It's the grassroots that are preventing the change.

To the extent the "leaders" have sense, it's that they realize that they'd have a mutiny on their hands if they went forward with banning the Greeks.

[walliver]

How many women are on the Harvard football team?


What are the loonies going to do about that?

[chattownmocs]

And your point is what?

Wake up!

[JSUSoutherner]

I deleted my Google search for it as soon as I was done reading it. Hopefully it didn't send up any red flags.
Incognito mode.

[clenz]

Incognito mode.

After playing GTA I now call that griefer mode

[ASU33]

Wow! This is so senseless.

[RichH2]

Wow! This is so senseless.
You,have summed up this thread perfectly. :)

[KPSUL]

Wake up!

Thanks for confirming what we all knew anyways; as usual, you have nothing worthwhile to contribute.

[chattownmocs]

Thanks for confirming what we all knew anyways; as usual, you have nothing worthwhile to contribute.

If you think that people who make policies like this have any reverence or even respect for the founding fathers, or former president, or congressman, or anything else white men have ever done, you are in denial. They despise every thing this country has ever stood for. Get that through your moronic head.

[aceinthehole]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/05/09/harvard-wants-secretive-male-clubs-to-go-co-ed-but-all-female-groups-are-being-punished-in-their-wake/?hpid=hp_no-name_morning-mix-story-v%3Ahomepage%2Fstory


For the 225 years that the Porcellian Club has existed, this exclusion has applied to all women — a fact that has increasingly been condemned by the Harvard administration. After a university task force found (http://www.thecrimson.com/article/2016/3/9/report-lambasts-final-clubs/) that the Porcellian Club and its ilk (there are eight all-male final clubs, according to the Harvard Crimson (http://www.thecrimson.com/article/2015/3/30/final-club-administration-khurana/)) held “deeply misogynistic attitudes” that contribute to an unsafe sexual environment, pressure mounted for the clubs to either admit women or risk sanctions.

Last Friday, university officials took their strongest action yet, announcing that new college students who join “unrecognized single-gender organizations” will not be eligible for leadership positions in recognized student groups, including sports teams, nor will they be recommended by the Harvard College dean for prestigious academic awards such as the Rhodes Scholarship.

...

The unexpected consequence of the penalties, then, is to prevent women from associating under their gender as well, prompting all-female groups to ask the administration to consider them in a different vein from their all-male counterparts.

“Basking in the praise of the national press for its efforts to make all-male final clubs go co-ed, Harvard has left out an important piece of the story: female final clubs,” three female students wrote in an op-ed (http://www.thecrimson.com/article/2016/5/4/female-final-clubs-opinion/) for the Harvard Crimson.

They argued that while women would remain disenfranchised within the hierarchies of historically male clubs, the act of making historically female clubs go co-ed would effectively cause them to “die out,” as they lack the resources to compete.

The students further accused Harvard of pushing for “hasty, symbolic victories” as a “form of damage control” after negative media attention on final clubs.

[Laker]

Interesting. You can't have all male clubs, but they want all female clubs protected. Are they realizing that there are differences between the sexes?

"They argued that while women would remain disenfranchised within the hierarchies of historically male clubs, the act of making historically female clubs go co-ed would effectively cause them to “die out,” as they lack the resources to compete."

[PAllen]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/05/09/harvard-wants-secretive-male-clubs-to-go-co-ed-but-all-female-groups-are-being-punished-in-their-wake/?hpid=hp_no-name_morning-mix-story-v%3Ahomepage%2Fstory

Leftist agendas suck for all involved, when they are applied to all, suddenly they suck for all. How does the justice department not come down with a Title IX demand if they apply these rules only to all-male clubs?

[Lehigh Football Nation]

This whole fiasco pretty much sums up the Ivy League leadership in a nutshell, including their hasty, condescending, and discriminatory response to the "issue" that actually makes matters worse for the people they purport to serve.

[Thumper 76]

Interesting. You can't have all male clubs, but they want all female clubs protected. Are they realizing that there are differences between the sexes?

"They argued that while women would remain disenfranchised within the hierarchies of historically male clubs, the act of making historically female clubs go co-ed would effectively cause them to “die out,” as they lack the resources to compete."

I expected nothing less, everybody wants equality until it starts to take away their own special privileges.

[Laker]

Leftist agendas suck for all involved, when they are applied to all, suddenly they suck for all. How does the justice department not come down with a Title IX demand if they apply these rules only to all-male clubs?

Consistently inconsistent.

[ASU33]

There's no way this can go in to effect. This is truly stupidity at it's finest.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Body blow! Body blow!

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/harvards-clueless-illiberalism/2016/05/11/c1cdbc34-16d6-11e6-9e16-2e5a123aac62_story.html

[PAllen]

So when do the final clubs and fraternities simply make their membership secret? Don't admit you are a member.

[KPSUL]

If you think that people who make policies like this have any reverence or even respect for the founding fathers, or former president, or congressman, or anything else white men have ever done, you are in denial. They despise every thing this country has ever stood for. Get that through your moronic head.

Go back and read my original post, you have misunderstood the intent my friend. I am fully supportive of the "unrecognized fraternities, sororities and clubs" and only pointed out how ridiculous it was to prohibit members of men or women only fraternities, sororities and final clubs from leadership positions in recognized Harvard organizations such as athletic teams. In fact I think I made the same point you may be trying to express here.
The two presidents who led the country through two challenging time periods , Teddy and Franklin, were actually members of male only final clubs. Robert Gould Shaw, Commander of the 54th Massachusetts in the Civil War (Glory Movie) was also a member of a final club. It is beyond absurd to disparage the legacy of these men by prohibiting members of the same clubs from becoming team captains.

I actually have small amount of personal experience with these Harvard unrecognized clubs. Many, many years ago during my undergraduate days at UNH I was an invited guest to activities at both Harvard's SAE and the Pi Eta Club, which was closed a couple decades ago.

I hope this helps you understand the issue and the point I made.

[UNHWildcat18]

So when do the final clubs and fraternities simply make their membership secret? Don't admit you are a member.

Sorry but one no one should have to. Also go ahead and try kids not to wear their letters in public and see how it goes lol. This is social justice warrior bull****, where are the ****ing adults at Harvard to say **** off to the people proposing this.

[PAllen]

Sorry but one no one should have to. Also go ahead and try kids not to wear their letters in public and see how it goes lol. This is social justice warrior bull****, where are the ****ing adults at Harvard to say **** off to the people proposing this.

Oh sure they'll wear their letters in public, but go ahead and try proving that they're a member. Start blackballing kids because they wear cloths in support of nationally recognized social groups that you as a college administrator don't particularly like, and your endowment will disappear in legal settlements real quick.

[dgtw]

What is a final club?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Ivytalk]

What is a final club?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
It's the result of two semifinal clubs playing each other.xnodx

[Ivytalk]

Go back and read my original post, you have misunderstood the intent my friend. I am fully supportive of the "unrecognized fraternities, sororities and clubs" and only pointed out how ridiculous it was to prohibit members of men or women only fraternities, sororities and final clubs from leadership positions in recognized Harvard organizations such as athletic teams. In fact I think I made the same point you may be trying to express here.
The two presidents who led the country through two challenging time periods , Teddy and Franklin, were actually members of male only final clubs. Robert Gould Shaw, Commander of the 54th Massachusetts in the Civil War (Glory Movie) was also a member of a final club. It is beyond absurd to disparage the legacy of these men by prohibiting members of the same clubs from becoming team captains.

I actually have small amount of personal experience with these Harvard unrecognized clubs. Many, many years ago during my undergraduate days at UNH I was an invited guest to activities at both Harvard's SAE and the Pi Eta Club, which was closed a couple decades ago.

I hope this helps you understand the issue and the point I made.
Pi Eta closed? That group had a lot of football players in it. It used to organize an annual nude run through Harvard Yard (and the libraries).

[KPSUL]

Pi Eta closed? That group had a lot of football players in it. It used to organize an annual nude run through Harvard Yard (and the libraries).

Quietly please! I was trying to make them sound more noble and prestigious. But alas yes, they were closed due to some alleged social wrong doing like serving wine in brandy snifters. I was friends and frat brothers with several UNH hockey players who were HS friends with several Harvard players who were in Pi Eta.
http://www.thecrimson.com/article/1992/11/6/pi-eta-club-goes-dormant-after/

[Model Citizen]

Some recognized, national fraternities maintain a tradition that members only wear membership pins when they can be hidden under a jacket. This is an homage to the days when fraternities were forbidden on most college campuses.

I never thought Harvard would take us back to Victorian America.

[Ivytalk]

Some recognized, national fraternities maintain a tradition that members only wear membership pins when they can be hidden under a jacket. This is an homage to the days when fraternities were forbidden on most college campuses.

I never thought Harvard would take us back to Victorian America.
Like the era when a liberal arts education meant something? Funny, I always hoped for that very result!xlolx

To your point, Harvard had no national frats until relatively recently. My pedigree wasn't rich enough for a final club. But I wouldn't belong to any club that would have me as a member!:D

[Lehigh Football Nation]

A beautiful example of how this policy could hurt these kids:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2016/05/17/an-exercise-in-guilt-by-association-at-harvard/


Consider the recently concluded Harvard career of Jimmy Vesey, a humble kid from Massachusetts who speaks fluent Mandarin and also won the 2016 Hobey Baker Award as the best college hockey player in the nation. He could have gone pro after his junior year, but stayed, even though he needed the money. “Not many people in my family have had the chance to go to college,” Vesey wrote recently, “so I like to think that when I get my Harvard degree this spring, it’ll be a testament to all of their hard work, because I definitely know I didn’t get here by myself.” Not surprisingly, Vesey was named team captain for the 2015-2016 season.

Under the new policy, that would have been forbidden: Despite his obvious merits and his unquestioned character, Vesey would have been disqualified because he belongs to the Delphic Club, a male-only hangout long favored by Harvard jocks.


Less clear is the matter of the Hobey Baker Award. Vesey won with the help of a promotional campaign by the Harvard athletic department. It sent regular reminders of Vesey’s accomplishments to the 27 members of the Hobey Baker selection committee, and produced two Internet videos about him for the general public, according to Brock C. Malone, an assistant director of athletic communications at Harvard.

This is my point. These Rhodes scholarships and Hobey Baker awards are awarded to deserving athletes that have basically unimpeachable academic records and have gone beyond the call of duty to do even more, altogether with the sometimes crazy work-life balance of a Division I athlete. That Harvard's athletic department would deny a kid that just because he belongs to a frat seems unconscionable to me.

[Ivytalk]

A beautiful example of how this policy could hurt these kids:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2016/05/17/an-exercise-in-guilt-by-association-at-harvard/




This is my point. These Rhodes scholarships and Hobey Baker awards are awarded to deserving athletes that have basically unimpeachable academic records and have gone beyond the call of duty to do even more, altogether with the sometimes crazy work-life balance of a Division I athlete. That Harvard's athletic department would deny a kid that just because he belongs to a frat seems unconscionable to me.


Very well said, by both you and WaPo.