Irony or Hypocrisy?

[BucBisonAtLarge]

Congratulations to the Columbia Lions, winners of the 2016 CIT, a third-tier post-season men's basketball tournament. Tell me again why the Ivy League chooses not to participate in post-season NCAA playoffs in football. What are the shared high values and principles?

I vote 'irony'. Somehow the opportunity for a post-season for those football student-athletes is distinct from the rest of the student-athletes. How is playing Norfolk State, Ball State, NJIT and Cal-Irvine a fully sanctioned affair in hoops while football lacks such sterling opportunities?

I will put the soapbox back where I found it.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Congratulations to the Columbia Lions, winners of the 2016 CIT, a third-tier post-season men's basketball tournament. Tell me again why the Ivy League chooses not to participate in post-season NCAA playoffs in football. What are the shared high values and principles?

I will put the soapbox back where I found it.

High Values And Principles *

* unless a buck is there to be made

[Sycamore62]

It would only be 1 extra game per year for 1 team in their conference.

[BucBisonAtLarge]

It would only be 1 extra game per year for 1 team in their conference.


How would we know? There could have been arguments for three Ivy League schools last year-- Dartmouth, Harvard and Penn.

[Sycamore62]

How would we know? There could have been arguments for three Ivy League schools last year-- Dartmouth, Harvard and Penn.

ok you got me there. 1 extra game for 3 teams

[KPSUL]

I'd say one team, maybe two on a real good year for the league - like last season. I think Harvard or Dartmouth might have won a 1st round game, depending on their draw.

[RootinFerDukes]

The CIT is the fourth tier tournament. You're giving it way too much credit.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

The CIT is the fourth tier tournament. You're giving it way too much credit.

I think the point was that the Ivy League supposedly didn't have time for any postseason tournament that 1) wasn't the "top tier", and 2) wasn't an official NCAA competition. The CIT is neither. The FCS playoffs is both.

The original Ivy agreement stated:


The members of the Group shall not engage in post-season games or any other contests designed to settle sectional or other championships. (NOTE: National Collegiate Athletic Association, Eastern College Athletic Conference, A.A.U., competitions and international competitions such as the games, meets and matches with Oxford and Cambridge Universities shall not be considered as post-season games or contests within the meaning of the above rule.)

This puts the needle squarely on "hypocrisy" instead of "irony", but I don't think we're saying anything that everyone doesn't know already.

[RichH2]

The CIT is the fourth tier tournament. You're giving it way too much credit.
Missing the real point. CIT is a 4th tier pay to play tourney. OK for IL to lower itself to play in that but not in a real postseason tournament for a national championship in football. Thevusual reasons have been analyzed and critiqued here for years. Why? Dont really care. But , participation in the CIT is hypocritical.irony in full bloom.

[RootinFerDukes]

I got the point. I was just further obscuring the CIT. The Ivy thinks their **** doesn't stink and don't want to subject themselves to a lower tier football championship. You wouldn't want people to realize they voluntarily demoted themselves to I-AA back in the 80s.

[RichH2]

I got the point. I was just further obscuring the CIT. The Ivy thinks their **** doesn't stink and don't want to subject themselves to a lower tier football championship. You wouldn't want people to realize they voluntarily demoted themselves to I-AA back in the 80s.
Gotcha. :)

[Winindy]

22305

[OhioHen]

High Values And Principles *

* unless a buck is there to be made

No buck to be made with the CIT - pay to play and there's no way gate receipts for the games exceed the fee.

[Daytripper]

No buck to be made with the CIT - pay to play and there's no way gate receipts for the games exceed the fee.

Trust me, I know. Sam Houston ponied up about $30-40K to host a first round and had just a few hundred show up. Waste of f***ing money.

[BucBisonAtLarge]

OK, the CIT is 'last-tier'.

I am interested in what the Ivy League guys on the board have to say. You are closest to this position. This is beginning to feel like the Patriot League's position on football scholarships a few years ago. Just as in that case, it feels like football athletes are being denied an opportunity being afforded every other program in intercollegiate athletics, inside the NCAA and beyond. (Princeton has a simply smashing squash team, always playing in the post-season) Why is football so different?

[BisonFan02]

http://www.anygivensaturday.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=22305&stc=1

Which is worse...because that is even lower tier than the CIT. :D

[RootinFerDukes]

Not to be a technical pain in the butt, but there's a new tournament this year called the Vegas 16 (with only 8 teams willing to participate).
They are a fifth and final tier to this pointless college basketball postseason charade.

[Sycamore62]

They should just make a tournament that lets everybody in and plays consolations until they figure out the 1st through 351st. you could start in November and have it played out by may

[Go Green]

Why is football so different?

The short version is that the football post-season ban had historical justifications that could be construed as noble. Those justifications generally didn't apply to other sports.

Of course, those historical justifications no longer are relevant. Hence, the hypocrisy.

[Sader87]

Football (at the collegiate and hs level) just doesn't lend itself as a good "playoff sport." It's too drawn out/time-consuming.

The fact that an FCS school has to win 4 or 5 playoff games, after an 11 or 12 game regulahh season, is kind of absurd on its face.

The Ancient VIII, I hate to say, are correct in their thinking here imo.

[Go Green]

The fact that an FCS school has to win 4 or 5 playoff games, after an 11 or 12 game regulahh season, is kind of absurd on its face
.

The Ivy presidents have been very adept at coming up with new "justifications" for the football post-season ban. I suspect that if they had to come up with something else soon, it would probably be along the lines of wanting to prevent concussions and citing your numbers above...

[Lehigh Football Nation]

The Ivy presidents have been very adept at coming up with new "justifications" for the football post-season ban. I suspect that if they had to come up with something else soon, it would probably be along the lines of wanting to prevent concussions and citing your numbers above...

I think the current justification is, "We've always done it this way," which has been used to justify everything from denying same-sex marriage to poll taxes

[Go Green]

I think the current justification is, "We've always done it this way," which has been used to justify everything from denying same-sex marriage to poll taxes

That is indeed the current justification, although I don't think that will last forever. They'll come up with something new at some point (again my guess: concussions).

Then again, miracles do happen. Many never thought we'd live to see an Ivy basketball tournament. Yet it's debuting next year.

The key is Harvard. If Harvard gets bored with kicking Yale's ass every year at the end of the season and wants new challenges, we will get post-season football. What Harvard wants, Harvard gets. If they are content with winning The Game every year, then we will continue to watch the post-season like we always have....

[andthehomeofthe-BIZON-]

I vote Hypocrisy! "We've always done it this way" is the worst excuse. Which is too bad as a couple teams are decent. But we'll never really know.