PATSY Ratings - Colgate's Class of 2020

[Lehigh Football Nation]

http://lehighfootballnation.blogspot.com/2016/02/the-2016-patsy-ratings-no-5-colgate.html

The rankings (with 3 to go):

HOLY CROSS - 49 (http://lehighfootballnation.blogspot.com/2016/02/the-2016-patsy-ratings-no-5-holy-cross.html)
COLGATE - 47
GEORGETOWN - 37 (http://lehighfootballnation.blogspot.com/2016/02/the-2016-patsy-ratings-no-6-georgetown.html)
FORDHAM - 34 (http://lehighfootballnation.blogspot.com/2016/02/the-2016-patsy-ratings-no-7-fordham.html)

[RichH2]

Forsee some unhappy campers :). Did very well on linemen tho and some skill players.

[ngineer]

Agree with the comment about expectations for class size. It would appear that most classes will be between 15-20.

[Gater]

Colgate seemed to have very few offers out to ** recruits. There were some *** guys and a lot of guys with no stars but almost no ** guys. Colgate ended up with fewer ** recruits than anytime since I started paying entirely too much attention to this. Are there fewer ** guys out there in general? Tried to find any info on numbers of starred players out there but any info on ** guys is hard to find.

I do think the Colgate posters (myself included) didn't help Colgate's score by not having RB be one of the needs. The team only has one RB on scholarship and Colgate obviously loves to run the ball. I think DL is probably the strongest position on the team right now--there are four all league guys returning and a bunch of young guys good enough to be in the rotation.

As for last-minute stars lost, Colgate's ** QB spent two years as a *** QB before being downgraded once the season ended and Colgate lost its *** punter to Michigan a few days before signing day (he went from a 4.5* punter to a 5* punter the day Michigan signed him--which seems a little cheesy).

Heard Colgate had 14 scholarships to offer when the season started. Two senior starters got red shirted and are coming back so maybe need-based numbers took scholarships down to 12. Don't know.

All of that being said, I was surprised that there wasn't a flourish of signees at the last minute that were multiple star guys. Not sure if there is any difference in actual talent or just how the talent was rated. The class seems pretty solid. We shall see.

Thanks much to the good people behind the Patsy's for doing these.

[RichH2]

Gater
Stars are movable feast for Rivals. We've had players go up and down depending on where they signed. Unlikely there are fewer * recruits in the pool.. With 4 services rating recruits, if anything there are more. Poaching recruits is part of the system up until NSD. Pre schollie, we would lose them to Ivies, the academies and occasionally to the CAA. More common now to lose them to FBS also.

[bison137]

Agree with the comment about expectations for class size. It would appear that most classes will be between 15-20.



Probably depends on how you categorize walk-ons. Bucknell currently has 21 recruited players, one of whom came on a Posse Scholarship. Also has three who appear to be recruited walk-ons: two kickers and a QB. The one kicker was 1st team AAA all-state as a punter (Sam Trapuzzano from the WPIAL), so it is possible he got some money as a late signee.

For LFN. Bucknell has not put out a new press release as more signing day recruits have been fully vetted. However there are now blurbs on 18 of them on the official Bucknell football twitter page: https://twitter.com/bucknellfb That page has official announcements on four recruits who weren't in the signing day release: OL Josh Yoder (Southern Columbia PA), OL Charles Sanders (North Allegheny PA), LB Sam Chitty (Oregon), and DE Blake Fletcher. Sanders was 2nd team all-state AAAA, Yoder was 1st team all-state AA, Chitty was 1st team all-state 6A and DPOY, and Fletcher was 6A all-state.

There are now three players who had signing day ceremonies, announcing they had signed with Bucknell, who haven't been officially given an announcement yet: DE Tavion Vassar (MA), CB Mike Caruso (Rumson Fair Haven NJ), and WR Mike Balzofiore (Red Bank Catholic NJ). Not sure when they will be announced.

[DFW HOYA]

Agree with the comment about expectations for class size. It would appear that most classes will be between 15-20.

Question for the group: Why is Georgetown subject to roster controls clearly built for scholarships?

[Gater]

Agree that it seems like there are more stars to go around but I'm talking about specifically the ** guys. Eight of the 25 guys on 247 Colgate went out to were ** guys. Maybe Colgate overreached on *** guys. I have absolutely no idea, just seems like the ** guys are in the sweet spot and Colgate didn't go out to that many of them (on the 247 site at least). That being said, coaches obviously know a lot more about players at the ** and below level.

As for DFW's question, seems like it should be that you either use scholarships and have a cap or don't use scholarships and don't have a specific PL cap. Pretty sure the Ivies get giant rosters for this reason. Georgetown should at least be on equal recruiting footing with the ancients (especially considering how they have manipulated the system into giving more athletic scholarships than any FBS schools). Saw where Stanford is now free tuition for all students whose parents make under $125,000. Should make for some pretty good "walk-ons".

[bison137]

Agree that it seems like there are more stars to go around but I'm talking about specifically the ** guys. Eight of the 25 guys on 247 Colgate went out to were ** guys. Maybe Colgate overreached on *** guys. I have absolutely no idea, just seems like the ** guys are in the sweet spot and Colgate didn't go out to that many of them (on the 247 site at least). That being said, coaches obviously know a lot more about players at the ** and below level.




I don't know about Colgate, but for Bucknell there has been virtually no difference between two star players and unranked players. In fact, the unranked ones may have done better. Many of their All-PL players, including the 2014 DPOY, had no ranking from anyone.

[RichH2]

3* players are usually scouted by one or more of the sites. 2* s and unrated are IMO basically thr same. For those it is each staffs ability to evaluate talent, Atour level all of the ratings are hit or miss. From various team prospect lists, we all chathe3*s but rarely get them. Singles and doubles are our base but nice to get an occasional HR.
Agree roster cap unfair to Hoyas. Only sense it makes to me is as a lever to push GU to schollies.

[Fordham]

Probably depends on how you categorize walk-ons. Bucknell currently has 21 recruited players, one of whom came on a Posse Scholarship. Also has three who appear to be recruited walk-ons: two kickers and a QB. The one kicker was 1st team AAA all-state as a punter (Sam Trapuzzano from the WPIAL), so it is possible he got some money as a late signee.

For LFN. Bucknell has not put out a new press release as more signing day recruits have been fully vetted. However there are now blurbs on 18 of them on the official Bucknell football twitter page: https://twitter.com/bucknellfb That page has official announcements on four recruits who weren't in the signing day release: OL Josh Yoder (Southern Columbia PA), OL Charles Sanders (North Allegheny PA), LB Sam Chitty (Oregon), and DE Blake Fletcher. Sanders was 2nd team all-state AAAA, Yoder was 1st team all-state AA, Chitty was 1st team all-state 6A and DPOY, and Fletcher was 6A all-state.

There are now three players who had signing day ceremonies, announcing they had signed with Bucknell, who haven't been officially given an announcement yet: DE Tavion Vassar (MA), CB Mike Caruso (Rumson Fair Haven NJ), and WR Mike Balzofiore (Red Bank Catholic NJ). Not sure when they will be announced.what's a 'posse scholarship?'

[DFW HOYA]

what's a 'posse scholarship?'

Two PL schools are participants.

https://www.possefoundation.org/our-university-partners/participating-schools

[Fordham]

Two PL schools are participants.

https://www.possefoundation.org/our-university-partners/participating-schools

the old "leadership scholarship loophole" again?

[bison137]

the old "leadership scholarship loophole" again?


Not sure if the Posse Scholarship counts against the limit, since Bucknell doesn't determine which recipients go to which schools. However, it is irrelevant because Bucknell is not giving out 60 scholarships anyway.

[Franks Tanks]

the old "leadership scholarship loophole" again?

Lafayette also participates in the posse program. It is my understanding that under current PL rules, all aid is counted toward the scholarship cap. So for example if a posse kids get a half or full ride to attend Lafayette or Bucknell, and plays football, that half or full ride counts toward one of our 60. Now if Bucknell is only giving out say 53 football scholarships, this doesn't really matter as even if the kid counts against the 60 cap, Bucknell has wiggle room.

I highly doubt Bucknell is using the posse program for kids they really want. They would just offer a normal ride in such cases, and not have to hope that the posse stuff comes through. Now if a kids is pretty decent player, maybe borderline PL player, but can contribute it makes sense to recruit the kids who may have already qualified for the posse program.

That is my take on how it may work anyway. Others can point out any flaws.

[Franks Tanks]

Not sure if the Posse Scholarship counts against the limit, since Bucknell doesn't determine which recipients go to which schools. However, it is irrelevant because Bucknell is not giving out 60 scholarships anyway.

I believe when a kid is accepted into the posse program, they can essentially enroll at any participating school correct? So if a coach knows a kid has qualified, and thinks the kid can play, he may then recruit the young man to Bucknell to play football. Once the kid is on the team the aid he is receiving from the posse program will be counted toward the 60 cap.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

I think all the PL schools have some sort of endowed academic/leadership scholarships of this sort, counting against the cap. Lehigh does.

[Andy]

From the LC board back in 2008 regarding the only Posse football player we've had, AFAIK. Revealing about the process.

DESTINATIONS: North County football player Kyvory Henderson has received a full academic scholarship from the Posse Foundation, which will allow him to play football at Lafayette College next year, coach Gary Liddick said. Henderson was a three-year starter for the Knights at defensive end/outside linebacker and was a two-year team captain. He sustained a season-ending knee injury during North County's third game but will continue to pursue football and he wants to study engineering.

"Kyvory is one of the best players I have ever coached on or off the field," Liddick said. "He won the Iron Knight Award this year in football for his hard work and dedication in the weight room and also in the classroom."

http://www.hometownannapolis.com/...n/gazette/view/2008G/01/09-19.HTM (http://www.hometownannapolis.com/vault/cgi-bin/gazette/view/2008G/01/09-19.HTM)

Henderson, 17, of Glen Burnie said he will study engineering and hopes to play football at Lafayette, although a "heartbreaking" knee injury in the third game of the season sidelined him for the rest of the year. His schedule is full with five Advanced Placement classes, as well as the Hispanic Honors Society, Student Government Association and the STEM (Science Technology Engineering Math) Club....

In September, guidance counselors and community-based organizations recommended 1,100 students from Northern Virginia, Washington and three counties in Maryland -- Anne Arundel, Montgomery and Prince George's.

The foundation selected 41 students from that list through a three-month process that involved a group evaluation and one-on-one interviews. They looked at academics, leadership abilities and interpersonal skills.

Students expressed their preferences for one of four colleges -- Lafayette, Sewanee, Bucknell University in Lewisburg, Pa., and Grinnell College in Grinnell, Iowa. The colleges interviewed the students and after they applied, offered 10 scholarships each. Lafayette offered an additional scholarship because of extra funding.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/...06jan06,0,7954347.story?track=rss (http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/local/annearundel/bal-ar.posse06jan06,0,7954347.story?track=rss)

[ngineer]

Probably depends on how you categorize walk-ons. Bucknell currently has 21 recruited players, one of whom came on a Posse Scholarship. Also has three who appear to be recruited walk-ons: two kickers and a QB. The one kicker was 1st team AAA all-state as a punter (Sam Trapuzzano from the WPIAL), so it is possible he got some money as a late signee.

For LFN. Bucknell has not put out a new press release as more signing day recruits have been fully vetted. However there are now blurbs on 18 of them on the official Bucknell football twitter page: https://twitter.com/bucknellfb That page has official announcements on four recruits who weren't in the signing day release: OL Josh Yoder (Southern Columbia PA), OL Charles Sanders (North Allegheny PA), LB Sam Chitty (Oregon), and DE Blake Fletcher. Sanders was 2nd team all-state AAAA, Yoder was 1st team all-state AA, Chitty was 1st team all-state 6A and DPOY, and Fletcher was 6A all-state.

There are now three players who had signing day ceremonies, announcing they had signed with Bucknell, who haven't been officially given an announcement yet: DE Tavion Vassar (MA), CB Mike Caruso (Rumson Fair Haven NJ), and WR Mike Balzofiore (Red Bank Catholic NJ). Not sure when they will be announced.

Now THERE is a name. Lehigh's great three-time national champion in wrestling of the same name in 1967-69. Wonder if there is a relation as Mike was from NJ, too.

[DFW HOYA]

I think all the PL schools have some sort of endowed academic/leadership scholarships of this sort, counting against the cap. Lehigh does.

Not at Georgetown. You could be #1 in your class and have a 1600 SAT, but it you don't have need you aren't getting any aid.

[Go...gate]

Two PL schools are participants.

https://www.possefoundation.org/our-university-partners/participating-schools

As are Penn, Dartmouth and Cornell.

[bison137]

Not at Georgetown. You could be #1 in your class and have a 1600 SAT, but it you don't have need you aren't getting any aid.



Posse Scholarship participants by definition have a great amount of need.

[Bill]

https://encrypted-tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ_HmSdTdp0RPCP6pjmnFS84S5u0V6_g WfJjseORCP0hvep21L_iw
Yes, many posse's are always in need of something :)
https://encrypted-tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ_HmSdTdp0RPCP6pjmnFS84S5u0V6_g WfJjseORCP0hvep21L_iw

[Gater]

https://encrypted-tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ_HmSdTdp0RPCP6pjmnFS84S5u0V6_g WfJjseORCP0hvep21L_iw
Yes, many posse's are always in need of something :)
https://encrypted-tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ_HmSdTdp0RPCP6pjmnFS84S5u0V6_g WfJjseORCP0hvep21L_iw


Who are those guys?

[Bill]

Who are those guys?

It's the posse from the "Wild Bunch". Thought we could use a little something different this morning.

[Gater]

It's the posse from the "Wild Bunch". Thought we could use a little something different this morning.

Sorry. Was going for a more obscure reference no one was going to get from Butch Cassidy.

[breezy]

Gater --

I got it right away.

[Bill]

I admit - it flew right past me. No clue.

[Gater]

Colgate just brought in another recruit. Committed to Yale last year and then took a PG year at Choate.

Here is Coach Hunt's Tweet:

https://twitter.com/CoachDanHunt?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eser p%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

Abu Daramy--DB

Offers from at least nine FBS schools. *** from multiple sites. Maybe Colgate's highest rated recruit ever.

https://n.rivals.com/content/prospects/maple/159901


http://247sports.com/Player/Abu-Daramy-52065


http://www.scout.com/player/187528-abu-daramy


http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/192694/abu-daramy

Don't know if he will count towards Patsy's (all of those stars are coming from last year when he committed to Yale) but he is a great get for Colgate.

(Also, thanks Breezy. Those 46 year old references can be tricky.)

[breezy]

I agree that Daramy is a terrific get for Colgate. I followed him last year when Holy Cross was recruiting him.

[Andy]

Colgate just brought in another recruit. Committed to Yale last year and then took a PG year at Choate.

Here is Coach Hunt's Tweet:

https://twitter.com/CoachDanHunt?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eser p%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor

Abu Daramy--DB

Offers from at least nine FBS schools. *** from multiple sites. Maybe Colgate's highest rated recruit ever.

https://n.rivals.com/content/prospects/maple/159901


http://247sports.com/Player/Abu-Daramy-52065


http://www.scout.com/player/187528-abu-daramy


http://espn.go.com/college-sports/football/recruiting/player/_/id/192694/abu-daramy

Don't know if he will count towards Patsy's (all of those stars are coming from last year when he committed to Yale) but he is a great get for Colgate.

(Also, thanks Breezy. Those 46 year old references can be tricky.)

Wow, been following his twitter for months, great get, very jealous. Assume full ride got the flip from Yale done. So much for "hard commit" status.

[Andy]

More on Daramy flip - based on Ivy voy board posts, Daramy had to retake the ACT. Perhaps in the end a non-qual for Yale.

[RichH2]

My imptession also. A low band for Yale so they would've still pressdd him to retake ACT. He and his family may have decided to take the full ride and still get an excellent education.

[Andy]

Apparently his aid package amounted to a full ride. Based on this article, ACT may have been problem:

http://yaledailynews.com/blog/2016/02/04/football-class-of-2020-looks-to-make-impact/

[RichH2]

Good point. The fear may have been that on retake he still might not qualify.and loseva full year.Take the sure thing.now.

[Gater]

Assume this means Colgate had a scholarship available. Holy Cross got a great player in McBeath a few years back when he lost his ride late (Colgate apparently didn't have one to offer--not that he would have chosen Colgate over Holy Cross). Wonder what made it so Colgate had a spot open.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Surprise!

http://lehighfootballnation.blogspot.com/2016/02/the-2016-patsy-ratings-no-5-colgate.html

[RichH2]

Wasn't that long ago when we all remarked on the number of early verbals with scholly recruiting. Now post NSD commits. Is this the ongoing annual trend??