AP: Montana to pay ex-QB $245K over rape investigation

[BisonFan02]

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/ncaafb/montana-to-pay-ex-qb-dollar245k-over-rape-investigation/ar-BBpB2l4?li=BBnbfcL&ocid=iehp


''Any student accused of wrongdoing deserves a fair and impartial hearing of the facts of his or her case,'' Johnson said in the statement. ''Officials at the University of Montana - people who were in positions of great power - were unfair and biased. Their misconduct made my family and me suffer unnecessarily, both emotionally and financially.''

Thoughts?

[Bison Fan in NW MN]

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/ncaafb/montana-to-pay-ex-qb-dollar245k-over-rape-investigation/ar-BBpB2l4?li=BBnbfcL&ocid=iehp



Thoughts?


He was found innocent. Sure seemed like the U of M rushed to judgment with JJ. Pay now or potentially pay more with a court case.

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

The only bad part is that UM has to pay out of pocket and not the people that put schools on a tight rope between getting in federal trouble or throwing out any sensible policies of adjudicating sexual assault.

[IBleedYellow]

He was found innocent. Sure seemed like the U of M rushed to judgment with JJ. Pay now or potentially pay more with a court case.

My thoughts exactly. Seems like there are only two sides to this coin these days: The Baylors of the world, or the Montanas.

Although I think a balance between the two is required.

[Grizalltheway]

The only bad part is that UM has to pay out of pocket and not the people that put schools on a tight rope between getting in federal trouble or throwing out any sensible policies of adjudicating sexual assault.

Yep. This is essentially taxpayers footing the bill for a private attorney defending a case that should never have been charged.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/ncaafb/montana-to-pay-ex-qb-dollar245k-over-rape-investigation/ar-BBpB2l4?li=BBnbfcL&ocid=iehp



Thoughts?

This is exactly what I was saying would happen back when some of the fans were acting like idiots and saying **** like "You just get rid of all of them". When the Trumaine Johnson thing happened also saw this same crap without waiting to see how things shake out.

Not waiting to get the courts opinion is for dullards that have an inability to see how outcomes will occur. If we had gotten rid of Trumaine and it screwed his NFL career UM would be wishing it was a judgment this small I'd bet.

You got no skin in the game you can rush to judgment all you want to but I knew this was gonna be the outcome and it is what should have happened.

[BisonFan02]

This is exactly what I was saying would happen back when some of the fans were acting like idiots and saying **** like "You just get rid of all of them". When the Trumaine Johnson thing happened also saw this same crap without waiting to see how things shake out.

Not waiting to get the courts opinion is for dullards that have an inability to see how outcomes will occur. If we had gotten rid of Trumaine and it screwed his NFL career UM would be wishing it was a judgment this small I'd bet.

You got no skin in the game you can rush to judgment all you want to but I knew this was gonna be the outcome and it is what should have happened.

This whole thing ****ing reeks, but hopefully it is a learning experience for many. By the way, I had thought about just putting this in the lounge, but I figured it was FCS relevant considering how we see things like this across the subdivision. Feel free to move if I'm out of line.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

This whole thing ****ing reeks, but hopefully it is a learning experience for many. By the way, I had thought about just putting this in the lounge, but I figured it was FCS relevant considering how we see things like this across the subdivision. Feel free to move if I'm out of line.

Ah, I usually leave things here for a day or two and then move em' if need be. You're good, it's relevant.

[walliver]

Unfortunately, it's a no-win situation.
Expel a player and he sues you.
Fail to expel and the feds come after you.
xcrazyx

[Herder]

Innocent? That's not the appropriate term. He was "not convicted" or "was aquitted" would be a more appropriate reference.

The amount of damage that JJ did to the university and the football program at Montana does not leave me feeling a lot of sympathy for the guy. Now, he was not convicted, but None of his actions were the the fault of anyone else other than him. His situation threw the football program in a tailspin, and tarnished the university for a period of time. He's not sqeeky clean on this. Was he falsely accused, or just not convicted? Pretty gray, but damaging None the less.

I remember the Jacks BB player who was accused in a similar situation a few years back. No conviction either, but no one there blamed the university from distancing themselves and cutting the guy loose before any due process. Hey, the damage was done, guilty or not.

[Sycamore62]

Innocent? That's not the appropriate term. He was "not convicted" or "was aquitted" would be a more appropriate reference.

The amount of damage that JJ did to the university and the football program at Montana does not leave me feeling a lot of sympathy for the guy. Now, he was not convicted, but None of his actions were the the fault of anyone else other than him. His situation threw the football program in a tailspin, and tarnished the university for a period of time. He's not sqeeky clean on this. Was he falsely accused, or just not convicted? Pretty gray, but damaging None the less.

I remember the Jacks BB player who was accused in a similar situation a few years back. No conviction either, but no one there blamed the university from distancing themselves and cutting the guy loose before any due process. Hey, the damage was done, guilty or not.

I think in some situations a person can be found innocent. I dont know if this applies in this case and im not going to read an article to find out.

[centennial]

Innocent? That's not the appropriate term. He was "not convicted" or "was aquitted" would be a more appropriate reference.

The amount of damage that JJ did to the university and the football program at Montana does not leave me feeling a lot of sympathy for the guy. Now, he was not convicted, but None of his actions were the the fault of anyone else other than him. His situation threw the football program in a tailspin, and tarnished the university for a period of time. He's not sqeeky clean on this. Was he falsely accused, or just not convicted? Pretty gray, but damaging None the less.

I remember the Jacks BB player who was accused in a similar situation a few years back. No conviction either, but no one there blamed the university from distancing themselves and cutting the guy loose before any due process. Hey, the damage was done, guilty or not.
I followed the case. Let me stop you. Stop writing about stuff you have no idea about.

[mvemjsunpx]

I followed the case. Let me stop you. Stop writing about stuff you have no idea about.

No kidding. The trial showed the girl had virtually no credibility and there was reason to believe she planned on accusing him of rape before she had sex with him.

There are a lot of things that Griz fans incorrectly feel the football program was unfairly punished for (O'Day & Pflugrad's firing, the NCAA sanctions, etc.). This is NOT one of those things. Johnson definitely got screwed over… until now, anyway.

[Twentysix]

For those that follow the case, was the girl arrested for false testimony about being raped? Or was it really complicated? Give me the cliff notes!

[Bisonoline]

The problem is is a knee jerk society that wants it pound of flesh with out the person getting their day in court first. There was a time when this or any other incident would be hashed out internally. Depending on the severity and evidence they would make a decision while also taking in to account that the kid hasnt had his day in court. But as time progressed people started accusing schools of cover ups and started screaming that they should be dealt with before their day in court because they schools only cared about keeping the players on the field etc etc etc. It has now progressed to the point to where we are now. Now idiot fans and dogooder anti sports knobs call for a kids head if he gets an MIP. (minor in possession) Any transgression is magnified by the media. Its gotten past the point of ridiculousness. But then you have coaches(florida state) for example who had a problem child and didnt deal with it as a coach should. That in turn makes people not in the know think all programs are run the same way and gives the sport and all athletics a black eye.xbangx

[Herder]

The problem is is a knee jerk society that wants it pound of flesh with out the person getting their day in court first. There was a time when this or any other incident would be hashed out internally. Depending on the severity and evidence they would make a decision while also taking in to account that the kid hasnt had his day in court. But as time progressed people started accusing schools of cover ups and started screaming that they should be dealt with before their day in court because they schools only cared about keeping the players on the field etc etc etc. It has now progressed to the point to where we are now. Now idiot fans and dogooder anti sports knobs call for a kids head if he gets an MIP. (minor in possession) Its gotten past the point of ridiculousness.


Hey, maybe in this case the school should have backed the kid more. But that's a very dangerous and exposed position for a university to be in. Montana did what most schools do, distance themselves and hope for the best. I can't blame the university at all. They backed the kid enough to bring him back after due process. The kid in SD was completely cut loose before due process, and no one really disagreed there either. Let's face it, massive damage done to university, regardless of due process outcome.

[Bisonoline]

Hey, maybe in this case the school should have backed the kid more. But that's a very dangerous and exposed position for a university to be in. Montana did what most schools do, distance themselves and hope for the best. I can't blame the university at all. They backed the kid enough to bring him back after due process. The kid in SD was completely cut loose before due process, and no one really disagreed there either. Let's face it, massive damage done to university, regardless of due process outcome.

The schools are bending from the pressure from the media, the general public, alumni and donors. Its really being stuck between a rock and a hard place. They make it hard for them to do the right thing in many cases.

[Go Green]

Not FCS or athletics related, but a similar story going down at Indiana. This time involving school administrators.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2016/02/campus-sexual-assault-administrators-title-ix-asca

[centennial]

For those that follow the case, was the girl arrested for false testimony about being raped? Or was it really complicated? Give me the cliff notes!
Mostly a case of foot in mouth. Girl and guy went out, had sex after. Then the guy decided he didn't like the girl, girl cries rape. There were texts leaked by the media that were pretty damning. Should have been thrown out much before it became a media circus.

[Go Green]

Mostly a case of foot in mouth. Girl and guy went out, had sex after. Then the guy decided he didn't like the girl, girl cries rape. There were texts leaked by the media that were pretty damning. Should have been thrown out much before it became a media circus.

This type of situation is factually rare. But when it happens, it gets all the headlines.

Best of luck to all involved moving forward...

[Sycamore62]

This type of situation is factually rare. But when it happens, it gets all the headlines.

Best of luck to all involved moving forward...

What parts are rare and compared to what?

[Go Green]

What parts are rare and compared to what?

According to what I've read, most experts agree that false claims of rape are rare. The overwhelming majority of times when there's a hookup and the guy doesn't call the girl the next morning, the girl chalks it up to experience.

A fairly similar situation happened at Dartmouth two years ago. The local district attorney actually brought charges against the guy, but he was acquitted when evidence tended to support his story. The guy was a cad, but not a rapist.

http://thedartmouth.com/2014/03/28/parker-gilbert-16-found-not-guilty-of-rape/

[srgrizizen]

The only good aspect to this story is that it should be the end of it. A jury was unwilling to sentence a young man to many years of imprisonment based on a less than airtight case. He was found not guilty, not innocent, as I believe he should have been. The settlement, however, refers to the procedure in a so-called "student court." I am skeptical that such "courts" are capable of affording the accused all of their rights and proper procedures. Even though the maximum penalty was expulsion and not loss of freedom, such "courts" all too often beg for the appellation "Kangaroo."

[LeopardBall10]

I think a lot of people are hitting on some good points in the thread, but I think the larger issue (and the thing that creates the tight rope the schools have to walk) is the inefficiency of the court system is rape/sexual assault cases and the "in-house" mentality of most schools. Some things can't be fixed because the victims can wait for years before bringing allegations, a majority of the evidence is hearsay, etc.

But when these allegations are brought against a student a school needs to have a defined course of action, that IMO should include immediately contacting the authorities instead of trying to keep the situation in-house with an inexperienced investigator that is almost always biased.

[Uncle Rico's Clan]

The only good aspect to this story is that it should be the end of it. A jury was unwilling to sentence a young man to many years of imprisonment based on a less than airtight case. He was found not guilty, not innocent, as I believe he should have been. The settlement, however, refers to the procedure in a so-called "student court." I am skeptical that such "courts" are capable of affording the accused all of their rights and proper procedures. Even though the maximum penalty was expulsion and not loss of freedom, such "courts" all too often beg for the appellation "Kangaroo."

Unfortunately, Jon Krakauer still has a case that will be heard before the MT Supreme Court. He is trying to get access to JJ's private files. I think the case will be heard in April which means everything will be re-hashed again shortly.

[Go Green]

The Ivy Board is reporting that Yale's basketball captain abruptly left school two weeks ago even though his team is tied for first (with Princeton) because he was facing a sexual assault charge.

[veinup]

man, the JJ legacy continues ... jesus christ.

what a ****show this whole thing has been for our school.

[paward]

I do not want to get specific but this problem has an elephant in the room. Rape does occur no doubt but sometimes the female sees an opportunity or its a case of scorn. Embarrassment an opportunity does prompt some strange results. Good judgement has to be two fold.

[walliver]

False rape allegations are rare, but rarity does not allow us to simply disregard the issues.

If airplanes had a 1% chance of crashing, civilian air travel would cease to exist.
If driving a car had a 0.1% chance of death with each trip, most of us on this board would already have died.

False rape convictions are probably much rarer than false allegations. Unfortunately, the federal government has encouraged student courts where the accused is not allowed to confront his accuser, is not allowed legal representation, may have no appeals mechanism, and is held to a very low standard or guilt (essentially "more likely than not").

In the Yale case, for example, for the rest of his life, this expelled, but not criminally charged, student will have to explain his expulsion from Yale.

I don't mind an extra-judicial enquiry into events in the hope of achieving a mutually beneficial resolution to claims of sexual misconduct, but such procedures should be mindful of the basic human rights of both the accuser and the accused.