Bill to force Iowa and Iowa State to pay for UNI Athletics

[IBleedYellow]

There is no way this could ever pass. Right?

...right? (http://www.press-citizen.com/story/news/education/college/2016/02/11/university-of-iowa-iowa-state-university-northern-iowa-athletics-money/80239092)


An Iowa lawmaker introduced a bill this week calling on the University of Iowa and Iowa State University to share athletic funding with the University of Northern Iowa.The bill, Senate File 2119, would require the Iowa City- and Ames-based universities, respectively, collectively to set aside $4 million annually for the next five years from the universities' athletic departments and transfer that money to their Cedar Falls-based sister institution.

[clenz]

No.

The guy that posed this isn't a UNI alum. He isn't associated with UNI at all. It's not in his district.

Just...no.

[IBleedYellow]

I mean, I wouldn't think so.

But it's a pretty funny bill, especially considering the fact he's not associated with UNI. xnodx

I guess we know where you guys can get FCOA starting soon. xthumbsupx

[clenz]

The meaning behind this, though, is correct but this isn't the way to do it. The way the state universities in Iowa are funded is jacked up and UNI has been bent over for about 40 years on it.

It's been changing slowly and the U of I is fighting every single change as hard as they can.

This is something that needs to happen, but this is a piss poor way to go about it.

What really sucks is this isn't UNI backed at all, but makes UNI look real bad in the process.

[clenz]

I mean, I wouldn't think so.

But it's a pretty funny bill, especially considering the fact he's not associated with UNI. xnodx

I guess we know where you guys can get FCOA starting soon. xthumbsupx
That money is already in place.

The state has cut UNI funding by an ungodly amount since about 07 or 08, meanwhile the funding the U of I gets continues to sky rocket...never mind the amount of money they get from the B10 and BTN.

The issue is that UI and ISU get the tens of millions, a couple times over, of dollars each year from outside sources but the BOR continues to fund them at 3-4 times the rate they fund UNI. Any attempt UNI makes at getting a dollar here or there is met with the full wrath of every single UI alum, faculty member, coach, fan, etc...

Iowa has a big law school. Guess were most lawmakers in the state went to law school....

[IBleedYellow]

From what I can tell doing research on the Rep:

The fact that the Hawkeyes actually are in the black, he could force them to give money to UNI, thus bringing UNI out of the red, without actual money having to come from the State Gov.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Johnson described UNI's ongoing athletics deficit as a problem "that the regents could have taken care of by now."

The regents worked out an agreement in 2010 to cap UNI's use of state money for athletics to 2.4 percent of the university's general fund. The issue has not been added to a regent meeting agenda since then.

This seems to be the real issue.

[clenz]

From what I can tell doing research on the Rep:

The fact that the Hawkeyes actually are in the black, he could force them to give money to UNI, thus bringing UNI out of the red, without actual money having to come from the State Gov.
Or...


OR....


The state could stop sending millions of extra dollars to the U of I and cutting what UNI gets.

Don't have to take a penny from either UI or ISU. Just fairly fund each school.

Fair doesn't mean equal. Fair means UNI is made up of 90-95% Iowa students. More UNI students stay in the state to work than any other university. Thus UNI graduates continue to produce for Iowa. That's been the biggest fight UNI has been trying to fight and where the fight "belongs".

This...while well intended...is misguided and doomed to fail from the second he started the part about taking money out of the pockets of UI and ISU.

[clenz]

This seems to be the real issue.
Because the U of I (and it's cronies on the BOR) won't let it happen. The funding that UNI is allowed to use is something like 75% lower now than it was in 2008.

The argument made on that is "Iowa State was using state money on athletics and now they aren't and UI never was, so neither should UNI". Sounds good in theory until you think about that sentence. A ****ing B12 school was using state money to fund their 70m budget until 2011 or 2012. It wasn't until Texas agreed to pay each B12 school something like 24m per year that Iowa State got off state funding.

UI has gotten 24m a year from the BTN since 2006, and it's now in the mid 40m per year.

Yet both of those schools continue to see more institutional support, across the entire university, than UNI.

The joke of it all is that any money UNI uses for athletics is paid right back to the state. It's all just an accounting game. It goes towards scholarships, books, room/board.

The BOR just refuses to ever let UNI even talk about it.

[BisonFan02]

That money is already in place.

The state has cut UNI funding by an ungodly amount since about 07 or 08, meanwhile the funding the U of I gets continues to sky rocket...never mind the amount of money they get from the B10 and BTN.

The issue is that UI and ISU get the tens of millions, a couple times over, of dollars each year from outside sources but the BOR continues to fund them at 3-4 times the rate they fund UNI. Any attempt UNI makes at getting a dollar here or there is met with the full wrath of every single UI alum, faculty member, coach, fan, etc...

Iowa has a big law school. Guess were most lawmakers in the state went to law school....

Where have I heard this before..... xlolx

[Bisonator]

Where have I heard this before..... xlolx

xnodx

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

When I see the financial troubles some of these smaller state schools face it's apparent why Pennsylvania does not have a state school that's D1 and plays FCS football. While I'd love to see Bloomsburg or IUP give it a go it's so hard to make the financials work.

The University of Iowa, on the surface, seems to be an extremely wealthy school. Iowa State has some serious coin as well. ISU does some tremendous research iirc. Why is UNI lagging so far behind these two? There's obviously a pecking order that exists in every state when it comes to institutional wealth. But the drastic difference in Iowa seems unusual. Especially since I consider Iowa a reasonably well off state economically. Or at least a fiscally responsible state. That doesn't mean the state knows how to handle and allocate money properly though. That's clear in far too many states. Even so, UNI shouldn't face such a disparity imo..

[clenz]

When I see the financial troubles some of these smaller state schools face it's apparent why Pennsylvania does not have a state school that's D1 and plays FCS football. While I'd love to see Bloomsburg or IUP give it a go it's so hard to make the financials work.

The University of Iowa, on the surface, seems to be an extremely wealthy school. Iowa State has some serious coin as well. ISU does some tremendous research iirc. Why is UNI lagging so far behind these two? There's obviously a pecking order that exists in every state when it comes to institutional wealth. But the drastic difference in Iowa seems unusual. Especially since I consider Iowa a reasonably well off state economically. Or at least a fiscally responsible state. That doesn't mean the state knows how to handle and allocate money properly though. That's clear in far too many states. Even so, UNI shouldn't face such a disparity imo..
It's not that UNI is having financial issues right now. Finances, like at 99% of state schools, run on a rather tight budget.

UNI wasn't D1 until 1981. Until 1967 it was known as State College of Iowa for 6 years and before that it spent 80 years as the Iowa State Normal School and Iowa State Teachers College. Meanwhile UI and ISU were both always large research universities. The state never saw fit to fund a teacher school.

As much as UI and ISU like to call everything UNI does "little brother syndrome" they are scared ****less everytime UNI shows that, even with a century head start on being a "large college", they are more than capable of competing academically or athletically they do what they can to put a stop to it.

It all comes back to UNI having never been funded "fairly". The BOR and "big brother" don't understand that basic concept. They think that since the B10 gives them enough money to have tens of millions of extra funds laying around then UNI doesn't need any money either.

UI gets state money for a massive new video board or IPF, even though they don't need it from the state, but UNI asks for a fraction of that amount and it gets met with "Nope, we are actually taking money from you for asking"

[Laker]

I'm old enough to have watched UNI play in the NCC against Mankato State when the Mavs joined the NCC. They didn't even call it D2 at the time- the Mavs played two teams that at D3 level now in the basketball playoffs in 1979. UNI made the jump and built the UNI Dome and the rest is history. Meanwhile in Minnesota there is only ONE D1 school. Divide and conquer- that is what several states have done. UNI is always going to trail Iowa and Iowa State because those two have the power.

[BisonBacker]

Where have I heard this before..... xlolx

Yup I think this happens in a lot of places. Iowa isn't the only place that's for sure. The turds in Bismarck are guilty as sin of this.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

It's not that UNI is having financial issues right now. Finances, like at 99% of state schools, run on a rather tight budget.

UNI wasn't D1 until 1981. Until 1967 it was known as State College of Iowa for 6 years and before that it spent 80 years as the Iowa State Normal School and Iowa State Teachers College. Meanwhile UI and ISU were both always large research universities. The state never saw fit to fund a teacher school.

As much as UI and ISU like to call everything UNI does "little brother syndrome" they are scared ****less everytime UNI shows that, even with a century head start on being a "large college", they are more than capable of competing academically or athletically they do what they can to put a stop to it.

It all comes back to UNI having never been funded "fairly". The BOR and "big brother" don't understand that basic concept. They think that since the B10 gives them enough money to have tens of millions of extra funds laying around then UNI doesn't need any money either.

UI gets state money for a massive new video board or IPF, even though they don't need it from the state, but UNI asks for a fraction of that amount and it gets met with "Nope, we are actually taking money from you for asking"

Is it true that Iowa has 3 public/state supported 4 year universities? If so it is absurd that UNI is not supported better. Their endowment, spending level, research grants etc should be significantly higher, 4-5x higher. Having three well funded universities would only strengthen the state of Iowa. It's not like U of I or ISU would have to see any decrease in academics, athletics or monetary wealthy. The pecking order would be maintained but UNI becomes a stronger #3.

If the school was off in the hinterlands or had a small student body, less than 5-6k, then I could see why some would be hesitant to dump money into it. But UNI has 11k+ students plus a decent size graduate population. It's located in a well populated area of the state that's in relative close proximity to other larger metro areas.

I get the politics that are involved with wrestling money away when there's a pecking order. Every state faces those issues. Penn State runs the show in PA despite Pitt and Temple having major influences in the state's two largest cities. At least Temple and Pitt are stable financially and able to do major capital improvements, maintain research levels and pay faculty/staff. Pitt by some accounts has more overall "wealth" than PSU but they don't hold much power when it comes to decision making.

[IBleedYellow]

There are 11 State supported Universities in North Dakota.

The fact that UNI isn't getting as much funding isn't anything new to us here.

While UNI is a directional school vs us being one of the big two, our perspective is much different, I will say.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Is it true that Iowa has 3 public/state supported 4 year universities? If so it is absurd that UNI is not supported better. Their endowment, spending level, research grants etc should be significantly higher, 4-5x higher. Having three well funded universities would only strengthen the state of Iowa. It's not like U of I or ISU would have to see any decrease in academics, athletics or monetary wealthy. The pecking order would be maintained but UNI becomes a stronger #3.

Iowa and Iowa State don't want a stronger No. 3. They like to implement policies that keep the pecking order exactly the way it is.

[clenz]

There are 11 State supported Universities in North Dakota.

The fact that UNI isn't getting as much funding isn't anything new to us here.

While UNI is a directional school vs us being one of the big two, our perspective is much different, I will say.

Iowa has 22 public schools.

Directional school doesn't matter. I don't know why people think it doesn't

UNI could be called anything and the issue would be the same and it's exactly the reason LFN listed - UI and ISU don't want UNI to continue to grow and succeed.

It's not a complete coincidence this all started going down when UNI started dominating Iowa State physically on the field in the mid 00s, when UNI started beating Iowa and Iowa State in basketball. Having more success in volleyball. Having a wrestling team that was nationally competitive.

The Big 4 Basketball Classic exists because UNI had a H/H for decades with both and went 8-2 against ISU and beat Iowa by 20 a few years ago. Fran Mcaffery went vowed his team would never play on Cedar Falls again right after that game. Now UNI only gets one of them per year and it's a neutral court in Des Moines

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

Iowa has 22 public schools.

Directional school doesn't matter. I don't know why people think it doesn't

UNI could be called anything and the issue would be the same and it's exactly the reason LFN listed - UI and ISU don't want UNI to continue to grow and succeed.

It's not a complete coincidence this all started going down when UNI started dominating Iowa State physically on the field in the mid 00s, when UNI started beating Iowa and Iowa State in basketball. Having more success in volleyball. Having a wrestling team that was nationally competitive.

The Big 4 Basketball Classic exists because UNI had a H/H for decades with both and went 8-2 against ISU and beat Iowa by 20 a few years ago. Fran Mcaffery went vowed his team would never play on Cedar Falls again right after that game. Now UNI only gets one of them per year and it's a neutral court in Des Moines

That's so strange. UNI could grow by leaps and bounds and still be "well behind" their instate brethren. UNI should simply be a better version of themselves which will not threaten ISU and the U of I in anyway. If nothing else it would only strengthen the state of Iowa's academic reputation.

I don't get the fear with athletics. It's like the Temple people who feel like there's a Villanova boogieman. Ultimately, ISU and Iowa have far different agendas and goals than UNI. So to take one game or match an feel threatened of lessened by a result is absurd. The Iowa or Iowa State people who feel the need to repress UNI to make themselves feel stronger are insecure losers. If you're the Hawkeye's you've had some really good FBS (Big 10!!) football teams over the last 25-30 years and some pretty good Big 10(!!) hoops teams. Is losing a game or two a decade to UNI that terrible? Iowa State football generally sucks but they have "Hilton Magic". Both are still synonymous with wrestling greatness.

[Bisonoline]

I'm old enough to have watched UNI play in the NCC against Mankato State when the Mavs joined the NCC. They didn't even call it D2 at the time- the Mavs played two teams that at D3 level now in the basketball playoffs in 1979. UNI made the jump and built the UNI Dome and the rest is history. Meanwhile in Minnesota there is only ONE D1 school. Divide and conquer- that is what several states have done. UNI is always going to trail Iowa and Iowa State because those two have the power.

University and Small College.

[Bisonoline]

I'm old enough to have watched UNI play in the NCC against Mankato State when the Mavs joined the NCC. They didn't even call it D2 at the time- the Mavs played two teams that at D3 level now in the basketball playoffs in 1979. UNI made the jump and built the UNI Dome and the rest is history. Meanwhile in Minnesota there is only ONE D1 school. Divide and conquer- that is what several states have done. UNI is always going to trail Iowa and Iowa State because those two have the power.

University and Small College.



Remember a guy named Barry VanSickle

Or the NDSU Mankato game on the frozen field in 1971 where they had to wear tennis shoes.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

There are 11 State supported Universities in North Dakota.

The fact that UNI isn't getting as much funding isn't anything new to us here.

While UNI is a directional school vs us being one of the big two, our perspective is much different, I will say.

That stat would surprise most people imo. Although, not all of them are 4 years institutions iirc. Having researched UND in depth I got to learn quite about the state in general.

The sales manager at my former club in MT was a Minot State grad. He spoke highly of it.

[Laker]

University and Small College.



Remember a guy named Barry VanSickle

Or the NDSU Mankato game on the frozen field in 1971 where they had to wear tennis shoes.

I remember a Van Sickle from Lake Crystal who played basketball for MSU when I was in grad school. I believe that both he and his wife became teachers.

Didn't know about the frozen game. Was that up in Fargo?

[Bisonoline]

I remember a Van Sickle from Lake Crystal who played basketball for MSU when I was in grad school. I believe that both he and his wife became teachers.

Didn't know about the frozen game. Was that up in Fargo?

At Mankato.

What happened was the High school had used their field either the night before or the week before and it was really muddy. So there were all of these very deep footprints in the mud when it froze up. So they needed a playable field so they trird to roll it but itdidnt work very well so the scraped it with heavy equipment. It was smooth but frozen so it was like playing in a parking lot.

From what I understand Barry was a line backer and knew a bunch of the guys at NDSU. When we played you one year our O came on the field and Barry was snorting and acting crazy shouting formations etc while every one was getting set when our QB Donny Sieverson looks over the the line and says---"Hey Barry--How the hell you doing" I guess everyone on both sides of the ball started laughing.

[clenz]

That's so strange. UNI could grow by leaps and bounds and still be "well behind" their instate brethren. UNI should simply be a better version of themselves which will not threaten ISU and the U of I in anyway. If nothing else it would only strengthen the state of Iowa's academic reputation.

I don't get the fear with athletics. It's like the Temple people who feel like there's a Villanova boogieman. Ultimately, ISU and Iowa have far different agendas and goals than UNI. So to take one game or match an feel threatened of lessened by a result is absurd. The Iowa or Iowa State people who feel the need to repress UNI to make themselves feel stronger are insecure losers. If you're the Hawkeye's you've had some really good FBS (Big 10!!) football teams over the last 25-30 years and some pretty good Big 10(!!) hoops teams. Is losing a game or two a decade to UNI that terrible? Iowa State football generally sucks but they have "Hilton Magic". Both are still synonymous with wrestling greatness.

It's just a strange strange complex out of IC and Ames.

UNI hasn't lost in Ames since about 03 in basketball. UNI beat Iowa by double digits in 2 of the last three basketball games.

It's not about UNI becoming a better university. It's about UI and ISU doing everything they can to shut anyone else in the state out

[Laker]

At Mankato.

What happened was the High school had used their field either the night before or the week before and it was really muddy. So there were all of these very deep footprints in the mud when it froze up. So they needed a playable field so they trird to roll it but itdidnt work very well so the scraped it with heavy equipment. It was smooth but frozen so it was like playing in a parking lot.

From what I understand Barry was a line backer and knew a bunch of the guys at NDSU. When we played you one year our O came on the field and Barry was snorting and acting crazy shouting formations etc while every one was getting set when our QB Donny Sieverson looks over the the line and says---"Hey Barry--How the hell you doing" I guess everyone on both sides of the ball started laughing.

Great story! Mankato East and West used to play each other up there until they were in a terrible rainstorm and it wrecked the field for the next day. It is still a grass field but they do a tremendous job of taking care of it. Even with all of the postseason play it has been great.

[JayJ79]

Bill sounds like an influential guy

[NDSU_grad]

That stat would surprise most people imo. Although, not all of them are 4 years institutions iirc. Having researched UND in depth I got to learn quite about the state in general.

The sales manager at my former club in MT was a Minot State grad. He spoke highly of it.
There are 6 4-year public institutions in North Dakota. One liberal arts university, one land grant university, and 4 'normal' schools. The state would have been much better off to institute a system like Wisconsin, with one flagship and a few satellite campuses.

[Yote 53]

Clenz, you realize there are people in Iowa that would just as soon shut UNI down than fund it any more than it already is being funded. U of I and ISU are the two major research institutions in the state and it takes funding to keep them at the top. Funding that pays dividends. You can complain about UNI's funding but I would argue UNI is trying to be something it was not meant to be and shouldn't receive the funding it does and should probably have its scope cut back. In a state the size of Iowa, two major schools is enough. Having UNI is a duplication of resources that makes it more expensive to educate the state's students. You can't even use a location argument because you are right down the road from Iowa City and not out in western Iowa.

It's just like South Dakota, too many schools. We really only need U, State, and Tech out there in the Black Hills but for some reason we feel the need to have these duplicate campuses all over the state. It holds the flagship schools back from becoming even more of a player on the national level.

[Yote 53]

Clenz, FWIW I grew up in Iowa and have worked here all my life. I just live across the border in SoDak. My state taxes go to support these schools as well. I'm just saying there is your opinion and there are opposing opinions.

[clenz]

You really think UNI has held Iowa and Iowa State back?

Holy ****

UNI enrolls 90+% Iowa kids. UNI students stay in state at an exponentially higher rate than the other two.

It's the thought process of "duplication of anything" that's the issue and the reason UNI gets ducked over

[BisonFan02]

Clenz, you realize there are people in Iowa that would just as soon shut UNI down than fund it any more than it already is being funded. U of I and ISU are the two major research institutions in the state and it takes funding to keep them at the top. Funding that pays dividends. You can complain about UNI's funding but I would argue UNI is trying to be something it was not meant to be and shouldn't receive the funding it does and should probably have its scope cut back. In a state the size of Iowa, two major schools is enough. Having UNI is a duplication of resources that makes it more expensive to educate the state's students. You can't even use a location argument because you are right down the road from Iowa City and not out in western Iowa.

It's just like South Dakota, too many schools. We really only need U, State, and Tech out there in the Black Hills but for some reason we feel the need to have these duplicate campuses all over the state. It holds the flagship schools back from becoming even more of a player on the national level.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_colleges_and_universities_in_Iowa

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_colleges_and_universities_in_North_Dakota
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_colleges_and_universities_in_South_Dakota
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_colleges_and_universities_in_Wyoming

Iowa has 3 public 4 year schools...SD has 5....ND has 6....WY has.....1.

By your thoughts, maybe ND and SD should close all public 4 year schools outside of the Land Grant institutions like Wyoming. Sounds like a plan to me! xlolx

[doolittledog]

ISU and Iowa were the major research universities and UNI was the normal school. ISU and Iowa got the bulk of the funding. In a lot of ways, UNI can feel fortunate Iowa doesn't follow the Minnesota or Wisconsin models. Wisconsin forbids any state schools from having a football program that isn't D3. Minnesota doesn't allow another school to be D1. UNI doesn't get the funding of ISU or Iowa, but they are on more equal footing than other neighboring states. One thing currently in favor of UNI is finally getting their alumni base vocal and demanding more from the state. As recently as 5-6 years ago there were a number of D3 schools in the state with higher endowments and more annual giving than UNI was getting from their alumni base. And UNI has 10 times the alumni base as the D3 schools. I don't want to hear about all the poor UNI grad teachers and accountants...UNI should have been doing a better job of bringing in alumni donations. They are now, and their alumni base is active in supporting their schools cause at the state house. Things are improving.

[IBleedYellow]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_colleges_and_universities_in_Iowa

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_colleges_and_universities_in_North_Dakota
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_colleges_and_universities_in_South_Dakota
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_colleges_and_universities_in_Wyoming

Iowa has 3 public 4 year schools...SD has 5....ND has 6....WY has.....1.

By your thoughts, maybe ND and SD should close all public 4 year schools outside of the Land Grant institutions like Wyoming. Sounds like a plan to me! xlolx

Close all schools in ND and SD minus the Land Grants? COUNT ME IN!

[BisonFan02]

Close all schools in ND and SD minus the Land Grants? COUNT ME IN!

PUBLIC! :D Leave my lil private 4 year school alone. xlolx

Schools have their mission....each state can run them as they choose. Someone from USD (a school in a smaller state....with more numerous state institutions and an enrollment of a shade less/around 10k) telling a UNI fan (13k+ enrollment in a larger state with less institutions) about duplication of resources had me rolling.

[clenz]

PUBLIC! :D Leave my lil private 4 year school alone. xlolx

Schools have their mission....each state can run them as they choose. Someone from USD (a school in a smaller state....with more numerous state institutions and an enrollment of a shade less/around 10k) telling a UNI fan (13k+ enrollment in a larger state with less institutions) about duplication of resources had me rolling.
What's funny is the primary focus of each insititution in Iowa is different

Iowa - law/medicine
Iowa State - ag/engineering
UNI - education/business-accounting

[BisonFan02]

What's funny is the primary focus of each insititution in Iowa is different

Iowa - law/medicine
Iowa State - ag/engineering
UNI - education/business-accounting

OH, shove it clenzy....Iowa can take the business school and ISU can add an education program....resources and ****. xlolx

[IBleedYellow]

Imagine how much better/bigger and more funded USD would be if they didn't put it in Vermilion?

Silly Sioux Falls politicians wanting the state pen instead of the the University.

Same goes for UND and Bismarck.

[Bisonator]

You really think UNI has held Iowa and Iowa State back?

Holy ****

UNI enrolls 90+% Iowa kids. UNI students stay in state at an exponentially higher rate than the other two.

It's the thought process of "duplication of anything" that's the issue and the reason UNI gets ducked over
Well what else would explain their mediocrity? You're not suggesting that they are doing that all on their own are you??xlolx

[BisonFan02]

Well what else would explain their mediocrity? You're not suggesting that they are doing that all on their own are you??xlolx

What's ****ing Minnesota's excuse? xlolx

[Bisonator]

What's ****ing Minnesota's excuse? xlolx

It's Minnesota. Need I say more?xlolx

[BisonFan02]

It's Minnesota. Need I say more?xlolx

Contact failure with Twin Cities sports franchises.... :D xrotatehx

[Yote 53]

Both Iowa and Iowa State could be much bigger schools and do even more. Take Iowa, for example, in relation to it's peer schools in the Big Ten. Iowa is one of the smaller public institutions in the Big Ten. If UNI didn't exist just a few miles up the road and a majority of its programs shifted to Iowa it would be a much larger school, a much larger force, and command more research grants, etc. My point here in all this is that everything is relative. A poster mentioned if Iowa felt it was being held back, relatively speaking compared to its peers, yes, the claim could be made they are being held back. Another poster mentioned how UNI should not complain about the funding the are able to get, relative to similar schools in neighboring states he makes an excellent point. UNI would be a satellite school under the Wisconsin model, U of Iowa - Cedar Falls. Actually, given how close Iowa City and Cedar Falls are UNI wouldn't even exist under that system.

As for a USD person commenting about duplication of resources, it is laughable the State of South Dakota has so many public schools. There should be only 3 public schools, U, State, and Tech, and Tech only due to its location out west and in the Black Hills because many of its programs could be handled at SDSU. I thought I was clear I wasn't thrilled with the waste that goes on in higher education in this state.

[clenz]

UI has the 4th largest athletic department in terms of revenue in the B10, 106 all time conference championships, over 1 billion in endowments.

I doubt the amount UNI uses from the state (less than Iowa pays their football coach, by the way) would make a difference as to how much bigger UI would be.

Michigan has EMU literally in viewing distance from the top row of the Big House. Has that held them back?

[uni88]

Clenz, FWIW I grew up in Iowa and have worked here all my life.
You're having grown up in Iowa and worked there all your life gives you some credibility because of your knowledge of the state but it also begs a question - Did you grow up a Hawkeye or Cyclone fan? If yes, you lose credibility because you could just as easily be trying to advance the interests of a favorite school to the detriment of another.


Both Iowa and Iowa State could be much bigger schools and do even more. Take Iowa, for example, in relation to it's peer schools in the Big Ten. Iowa is one of the smaller public institutions in the Big Ten. If UNI didn't exist just a few miles up the road and a majority of its programs shifted to Iowa it would be a much larger school, a much larger force, and command more research grants, etc. My point here in all this is that everything is relative. A poster mentioned if Iowa felt it was being held back, relatively speaking compared to its peers, yes, the claim could be made they are being held back. Another poster mentioned how UNI should not complain about the funding the are able to get, relative to similar schools in neighboring states he makes an excellent point. UNI would be a satellite school under the Wisconsin model, U of Iowa - Cedar Falls. Actually, given how close Iowa City and Cedar Falls are UNI wouldn't even exist under that system.
I call BS ...

First, is UNI really holding Iowa back? As Clenz mentioned, UNI's forte is in education and business/accounting. How much research money is spent on those disciplines? UNI's educational focus is on more hands-on, real world degrees which do little to take away from a research institution's high-minded pursuits. Academically, UNI has it's niche and fills it very well. Iowa and Iowa State hurt each other much more than UNI hurts either. If you want to shut something down in order to improve the state's two flagship schools than Iowa should shut down their engineering program (an Indiana/Purdue approach) because it detracts from Iowa State's program.

Second, as Clenz also mentioned, a higher percentage of UNI students are from the state of Iowa and a higher percentage of UNI graduates will stay in the state of Iowa than those of Iowa or Iowa State. State taxpayer dollars are better spent underwriting the education of Iowans than out of staters and they are also a better investment in the future of the state if the students stay in state upon graduation.

Third, have you taken a look at the Wisconsin satellite schools? UW Whitewater and UW Plattville are both closer to Madison than UNI is to Iowa.

You are correct that Iowa is a much smaller school academically in relation to other B1G0 schools but is that UNI's fault? UNI was a Normal school and teachers college until 1961 and simply the State College of Iowa until 1967. The reality that UNI has a better business school than Iowa with such a recent start isn't because UNI is holding Iowa back. It's because Iowa wet the bed and missed out on the opportunity which UNI took advantage of when it became a full fledged university in 1967. Why should I believe that Iowa would step up and succeed if UNI didn't exist when they didn't do anything when UNI was simply a teachers college. They blew the opportunity and now you want to turn back the clock and give them another chance?

[Kemo]

As for a USD person commenting about duplication of resources, it is laughable the State of South Dakota has so many public schools. There should be only 3 public schools, U, State, and Tech, and Tech only due to its location out west and in the Black Hills because many of its programs could be handled at SDSU. I thought I was clear I wasn't thrilled with the waste that goes on in higher education in this state.

I agree with this, though I think there could be a good case made for keeping Northern State based on location and its tradition in producing educators. Having state supported 4 year colleges in Madison and Spearfish doesn't make a whole lot of sense outside propping up those communities.

[Laker]

I agree with this, though I think there could be a good case made for keeping Northern State based on location and its tradition in producing educators. Having state supported 4 year colleges in Madison and Spearfish doesn't make a whole lot of sense outside propping up those communities.

South Dakota closed down the Springfield campus years ago. Minnesota started the Waseca two year school in 1972- that lasted about 20 years. Then they changed the Crookston school from two to four years, mostly because of political pull. Winona doesn't want the U of M to expand more into Rochester. Every move to expand or contract leads to great political tussles. I think that there is too much duplication of effort but no legislator will be very popular if a college closes in his/her district.

[Kemo]

South Dakota closed down the Springfield campus years ago. Minnesota started the Waseca two year school in 1972- that lasted about 20 years. Then they changed the Crookston school from two to four years, mostly because of political pull. Winona doesn't want the U of M to expand more into Rochester. Every move to expand or contract leads to great political tussles. I think that there is too much duplication of effort but no legislator will be very popular if a college closes in his/her district.

It takes a really powerful political figure to be able to pull off closing a school without committing political suicide. Janklow, love him or hate him, had the clout to do so when it came to closing Springfield and turning it into a prison.

My dad was a graduate of Springfield back in the day, so you'd think he'd be upset about the schools closing, but he was fine with it because there were legitimate fiscal reasons to do so. Plus, he now just tells people he is alumnus of Penn State :)

[Laker]

It takes a really powerful political figure to be able to pull off closing a school without committing political suicide. Janklow, love him or hate him, had the clout to do so when it came to closing Springfield and turning it into a prison.

My dad was a graduate of Springfield back in the day, so you'd think he'd be upset about the schools closing, but he was fine with it because there were legitimate fiscal reasons to do so. Plus, he now just tells people he is alumnus of Penn State :)

I'm so old I remember when Dakota State was called General Beadle State College.

[doolittledog]

Third, have you taken a look at the Wisconsin satellite schools? UW Whitewater and UW Plattville are both closer to Madison than UNI is to Iowa.



Wisconsin mandates that any state school with football other than UW-Madison be a D3 school.

Be thankful Iowa doesn't try to do the same thing. Simpson College won more football titles than UNI did during the Panthers years in the Iowa Conference xsmiley_wix

[clenz]

UNI isn't in a UI system. They couldn't mandate anything remotely close to that.

So "be thankful" is a pretty ****ing dumb sentiment

[doolittledog]

My point is, UNI fans complaining about the treatment they receive from the BOR seems kind of silly when you see how the directional type state schools are treated in neighboring states.

[uni88]

Wisconsin mandates that any state school with football other than UW-Madison be a D3 school. Be thankful Iowa doesn't try to do the same thing.
I was debunking YoteHawk 53's argument that UNI wouldn't exist in a Wisconsin system because Cedar Falls is too close to Iowa City.


My point is, UNI fans complaining about the treatment they receive from the BOR seems kind of silly when you see how the directional type state schools are treated in cherrypicked neighboring states.
FIFY

Iowa isn't Wisconsin (UW has 12 other colleges besides Madison) so you're comparing apples and oranges. Iowa has 3 major public universities each of which has its niches and purposes. Being a "directional" school should be irrelevant and UNI should be funded based on the value it provides and what is best for Iowa taxpayers.

[clenz]

My point is, UNI fans complaining about the treatment they receive from the BOR seems kind of silly when you see how the directional type state schools are treated in neighboring states.
Still not good comparisons

Illinois has 14 state run 4 year institutions.....14.
Illinois also has 41 prive 4 year institutions
Illinois also has about 38 for-profit 4 year insitutions institutions that operate in it's state
Illinois also has 51 or 52 community colleges - I didn't track which were state funded and which weren't
Illinois has budget issues that are so far beyond anything Iowa is even remotely close too

Illinois, outside of the Chicago Metro, has a population smaller than Iowa. Iowa has 3 state run 4 year institutions
Iowa barely has more total institutions running (2 year, 4 year, private, public, for-profit) than Illinois has community colleges. Illinois has nearly 2.25 times as many colleges open as the state of Iowa.


Minnesota, Wisconsin and Nebraska are all state systems.
South Dakota has less than a million people (850k) and 250k of them live in the Sioux Falls metro and has 12 public run institutions opens


If only we'd have kept the name "State University of Iowa" or made it Cedar Falls State University rather than Northern Iowa we'd get more access to fair funding that being a lowly directional school with a nationally recognized busieness/accounting and teaching programs

[clenz]

UI's new president is holding a town hall meeting right now. One of the first things he pointed out was data of how UI compares to other schools. US News and World Report shows UI dropping overall from 60th in 2006 to 82nd now.



So...basically, UNI is causing UI to be 20,000-30,000 students smaller than it should be and fall behind academically of it's peers all because of the 2m in general funds the athletic department uses. It's also no putting Iowa on the cusp of dropping from the top 100....nevermind the fact that UNI's funding level from the state now compared to 10 years ago is about 25-33% of what it was.

[clenz]

Also, on the directional school note, once again.

Illinois State University is, essentially, UNI in the state of Illinois. However, by doolittledog's logic, Illinois State has more right to funding than SIU, EIU, EIU or UNI in the state of Iowa...never mind that the fact that UNI actually ditched being a "Normal" school SEVEN YEARS before Illinois State did....

Oh, also forget the most popular majors at ISU are...wait for it....



Five most popular majors for 2014 graduates




Business, Management, Marketing, and Related Support Services
19%


Education
13%


Health Professions and Related Programs
8%


Communication, Journalism, and Related Programs
7%


Social Sciences
6%







http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/illinois-state-university-1692/academics

And the five most popular majors at UNI?
Five most popular majors for 2014 graduates

Business, Management, Marketing, and Related Support Services
19%


Education
18%


Social Sciences
8%


Biological and Biomedical Sciences
7%


Communication, Journalism, and Related Programs
7%





http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/uni-1890


Ho-lee ****, aren't those lists something else?

UNI's endowment is also over 15,000,000 more than Illinois State University.
UNI also offers as many/more graduate programs than ISU...

But, one is a lowly directional school that doesn't deserve money. The other is a prestigious state university that deserves twice what it's getting.

[clenz]

Herald now claims the university is, and direct quote, "being squeezed financially.. We're barely treading water."

Gosh darn it UNI....stop taking the pennies. UI's $44m TV deal isn't enough to sustain them anymore

[Yote 53]

U of I isn't fighting against UNI with these comments, they are fighting the IA BOR and their decision to adjust to a funding model that benefits ISU and throws more resources their way.

[clenz]

U of I isn't fighting against UNI with these comments, they are fighting the IA BOR and their decision to adjust to a funding model that benefits ISU and throws more resources their way.
Iowa is keeping Iowa State from being all that it could be...

[Yote 53]

The natural order of things will soon be restored when ISU is relegated to the MAC in the aftermath of the Big 12 implosion and UNI is dropped to non-scholarship FCS and joins the Pioneer with its rival Drake because UNI cannot afford to maintain the expense of its football program.

Both of those things are far more likely to happen then ISU ever getting a Big Ten invite or UNI moving to FBS.

[clenz]

The natural order of things will soon be restored when ISU is relegated to the MAC in the aftermath of the Big 12 implosion and UNI is dropped to non-scholarship FCS and joins the Pioneer with its rival Drake because UNI cannot afford to maintain the expense of its football program.

Both of those things are far more likely to happen then ISU ever getting a Big Ten invite or UNI moving to FBS.
You'd think so....but.......

Natural pecking order? Iowa State has been in the B12/B8 since 1928....






Typical Hawkeye arrogance...it's why no one likes Iowa outside of the state of Iowa. They think they are about 57 levels higher than they are in the pecking order of college athletics.

[Thumper 76]

You'd think so....but.......

Natural pecking order? Iowa State has been in the B12/B8 since 1928....






Typical Hawkeye arrogance...it's why no one likes Iowa outside of the state of Iowa. They think they are about 57 levels higher than they are in the pecking order of college athletics.

Makes sense that he's a USD guy too


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[BisonFan02]

Makes sense that he's a USD guy too


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It does....fellow neighbor to the south (originally). xlolx

[UNIFanSince1983]

Makes sense that he's a USD guy too


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This guy is a clear dual fan Hawkeye/Coyote. I think his real allegiance lies with the Hawkeyes too judging by his post.

[Yote 53]

Grew up in Iowa. USD grad. One brother and sister-in-law that are U of I grads, another brother and sister-in-law that are ISU grads.

My allegiances are to South Dakota. I'm split between Iowa and ISU but I prefer Iowa. I want ISU to be successful just not when they play Iowa.

UNI, can't stand them. Never had a good experience around a UNI person.