AUTO-BIDS STINK!

[FUspirit]

I am new to this forum so I thought I would give and get opinions on the Auto-bids in CS Playoffs. If you have not guessed, I do not like auto-bids. I believe this season is the perfect example of why auto-bids skew a true picture of who is the playoff champs. I would love to see a straight top 16 team playoff using the GPI poll. This year the Southland and Patriot league champs probably don't belong in the playoffs, especially a 6-5 lafayette team. No offense but I really believe other teams like San Diego and Wofford deserve those spots. It has got to be hard to go undefeated and not make the playoffs.Undefeated should be respected.

[FlyYtown]

I am new to this forum so I thought I would give and get opinions on the Auto-bids in CS Playoffs. If you have not guessed, I do not like auto-bids. I believe this season is the perfect example of why auto-bids skew a true picture of who is the playoff champs. I would love to see a straight top 16 team playoff using the GPI poll. This year the Southland and Patriot league champs probably don't belong in the playoffs, especially a 6-5 lafayette team. No offense but I really believe other teams like San Diego and Wofford deserve those spots. It has got to be hard to go undefeated and not make the playoffs.Undefeated should be respected.
LMFAO--- San Diego.... I am with you that the Patriot shouldn't get an auto-bid; but I disagree with you saying the SAN DIEGO TOREROS do!!! HAHAHAHHAHAAH

[th0m]

LMFAO--- San Diego.... I am with you that the Patriot shouldn't get an auto-bid; but I disagree with you saying the SAN DIEGO TOREROS do!!! HAHAHAHHAHAAH

Or Wofford for that matter.

[JohnStOnge]

I like automatic bids because what it means is that every team in a playoff eligible conference starts the season in control of its own destiny and what power ratings, polls, and ratings have to say do not affect that. In fact, if it were up to me I'd expand the tournament to 24 teams (with the top 8 seeds given a first round bye) and give every I-AA league an automatic bid just for that reason. Set the standards for what a I-AA league is then go with it.

I like power ratings, but I like the idea of everybody controlling their own destiny better. Couldn't make it perfect because Independents will have to make it via at large bids no matter what. But I like a system in which every team starts the season knowing that if it does certain things on the field it will definitely be in the playoffs and not have to rely on some opinion or estimate of some sort.

[BrevardMountaineer03]

In fact, if it were up to me I'd expand the tournament to 24 teams (with the top 8 seeds given a first round bye) and give every I-AA league an automatic bid just for that reason.

I wouldn't mind seeing the tournamnet expand....but I think no matter what some leagues need the Auto Bid....Who knows, some powerhouse conferences might get a shackup in the future, but at least their champion would be in the playoffs. (Look at the Big East this year.) Each year brings different things.

[*****]

... if it were up to me I'd expand the tournament to 24 teams (with the top 8 seeds given a first round bye) and give every I-AA league an automatic bid just for that reason. Set the standards for what a I-AA league is then go with it...24 teams is too many, not enough time for a tourney that size and not enough teams meet the standards. As for every league getting an AQ, that would work if the CS was a level playing field, but it is not. If the current proposed legislation defining who can be eligible for an AQ goes through then every league that meets that would be fine.

[JohnStOnge]

LMFAO--- San Diego.... I am with you that the Patriot shouldn't get an auto-bid; but I disagree with you saying the SAN DIEGO TOREROS do!!! HAHAHAHHAHAAH

Why shouldn't the Patriot get an automatic bid? It's had a respectable performance in the playoffs since the NCAA gave it won. It had a team in the national championship game in 2003 and its champion played pretty darned well against the eventual national champion in last season's first round.

If you want to talk about leagues that shouldn't get an automatic bid you ought to be talking about the OVC.. Unless I missed something in looking at the I-AA history no team from that league has won a playoff game since 2000. And that was Western Kentucky. No current OVC program has won a playoff game since 1995.

No, that doesn't mean I want to see the OVC lose its bid. Who knows? This year could be different and, again, I like the fact that the champ from that league gets its shot. But it's not like the Patriot has been the worst league when it comes to playoff performance.

[*****]

Is YSU in the MAC yet? :rolleyes:

[LarryBoy]

It makes perfect sense to me to give preference to those who win the eight toughest conferences, if you ask me.

If the PL auto-bid was stripped, and say, given to San Diego, we suddenly would have a new problem on our hands. PL teams will cry that they should fill their schedule with AAA high school teams (no offense, smaller schools, but exaggeration helps) in order to make the playoffs. To ensure solid records, bigger schools will seek out every pansy they can find to fill their non-conference schedule.

If you give the benefit of the doubt to a team like San Diego, there will be some backlash. In order to be among the 16 top teams in the country, you need to play the top teams in the country. If the Torreos are truly good enough, they should schedule a tougher schedule and prove it on the field.

Ok, so yeah, that was only halfway on-topic. Just ignore that.

[FUspirit]

I did not say that the Patriot league should not get a auto-bid, I was just saying that this year they fell short of deserving to go to the tounament. If you are going to have auto-bids then I agree with the 24 team tournament so that every qualifying conference gets a bid. I know that Div II went to this format this year and it appears to be going smoothly and does not seem to be to many games.

[FUspirit]

With San Deigo and Wofford I was just giving some examples... But I do believe if you go undefeated that you should be given the benefit of the doubt. Even if your schedule is somewhat weak you still made it through a I-AA conference without a loss.

[The Dude]

With San Deigo and Wofford I was just giving some examples... But I do believe if you go undefeated that you should be given the benefit of the doubt. Even if your schedule is somewhat weak you still made it through a I-AA conference without a loss.

Not all I-AA is created equal. Giving preference to an undefeated team with a weak schedule would give every team the incentive to "schedule down," thus reducing the quality of future play in this subdivision.

[FUspirit]

That's true, and you have a good point... but like I said, I just can not justify a 6-5 auto-bid over a 10-0 weak schedule.

[FUspirit]

Or even better a 7-4 wofford team who had some pretty good showings against some strong teams.

[BrevardMountaineer03]

Going to 24 teams would just add 1 more week to the schedule and allow the top 8 teams to have a weeks rest. It would allow people outside the top 8 to host 1 round of playoffs. I know I said earlier that I wouldn't mind seeing it go to 24, but when will adding teams to the tournament stop. If we allow 24 then we will hear we need 32, because that wouldn't add anymore weeks to the schedule.

[FUspirit]

I think 24 is good because it could cover all qualifying auto-bids. I don't believe you would hear to many people asking for more than 24 that would water down the tournament like it is in college basketball now. But I have to admit that some of those early underdog wins are exciting to watch.

[The Dude]

That's true, and you have a good point... but like I said, I just can not justify a 6-5 auto-bid over a 10-0 weak schedule.

I agree that a 6-5 autobid team has a tough time justifying its place in the playoffs. And maybe scrapping the autobid system is the answer. Personally, I like the autobids because they ensure that there are a variety of teams in the playoffs and they reward the winners of the 8 toughest conferences. Even if a conference is having a down year, there is still an autobid to play for. But I do understand how they could be a source of frustration.

[Mr. C]

And where are you going to get that extra week? Are you going to start the season a week early? That's what Division II does. I can tell you from conversations I've had with coaches and ADs, there is no desire to start the season earlier, because of the increased costs. And you have to have the playoffs done the weekend before Christmas, or ESPN won't televise the championship game.

[furpal87]

I can't believe anyone on this board feels that way about the auto bids. Most of us are in basketball conferences that benefit a lot from the same thing in basketball. Except for maybe Villanova and Georgetown, and the Gateway teams in the MVC, we hear the same argument against us every March. I love seeing the Patriot get bids. The OVC has been lucky to have that bid in the past, but it's now a two-bid league again. We all know it's cyclical. As long as we stay at 16 teams, 8 should be the maximum number of auto-bids.

[BigApp]

Are you DETROITFLYER in disguise?

[UAalum72]

And where are you going to get that extra week? ... I can tell you from conversations I've had with coaches and ADs, there is no desire to start the season earlier, because of the increased costs.
So, cut a week from the end of the season to decrease costs at the same time. Everybody's happy!

[thirdgendin]

So, cut a week from the end of the season to decrease costs at the same time. Everybody's happy!

Hardly! :eyebrow:

[FormerPokeCenter]

The earlier comment about the Southland is pretty ignorant, from where I sit. The Southland had a much tougher OOC schedule, collectively, than any other conference..

Southland (7 members), 15 I-A games, 9 BCS schools, Avg 2.14/I-A, 1.29/BCS
Big Sky (9 members), 13 I-A games, 7 BCS schools, Avg 1.44/I-A, .78/BCS
Gateway (8 members), 9 I-A games, 8 BCS schools, Avg 1.13/I-A, 1.0/BCS
Atlantic 10 (12 members), 9 I-A games, 6 BCS schools, Avg .75/I-A, .5/BCS
Ohio Valley (9 members), 8 I-A games, 5 BCS schools, Avg .89/I-A, .56/BCS
Southern (8 members), 7 I-A games, 6 BCS schools, Avg .88/I-A, .75/BCS
Great West (5 members), 5 I-A games, 1 BCS school, Avg 1.0/I-A, .2/BCS
SWAC (10 members), 4 I-A games, 0 BCS schools, Avg .4/I-A, 0/BCS
MEAC (9 members), 3 I-A games, 2 BCS schools, Avg .33/I-A, .22/BCS
Big South (5 members), 1 I-A games, 0 BCS schools, Avg .2/I-A, 0/BCS
Ivy League (8 members), 0 I-A games, 0 BCS schools, Avg 0/I-A, 0/BCS
Patriot (7 members), 0 I-A games, 0 BCS schools, Avg 0/I-A, 0/BCS
Northeast, MAA, Pioneer 0 I-A games, Avg 0/I-A, 0/BCS

Some of the schools we played this year included (this is from memory, I'm sure I'm leaving somebody out):

The University of Texas
Texas Tech
Baylor
Kansas
Kansas State
Nebraska
Ole Miss
Southern Miss
Arizona
Oklahoma State
New Mexico State
South Florida
Toledo

You'd have to be a complete moron to believe that the Southland's composite won/loss record should keep them out of the playoffs..

[JohnStOnge]

Right now it's looking like the weaker auto bid teams belonged in the playoffs more than a certain at large bid team from South Carolina did.

[thirdgendin]

Right now it's looking like the weaker auto bid teams belonged in the playoffs more than a certain at large bid team from South Carolina did.

As long as the regular season still determines who belongs, we're fine. Our play today has been terrible though while MSU has been great.

[JohnStOnge]

As long as the regular season still determines who belongs, we're fine. Our play today has been terrible though while MSU has been great.

Well, McNeese ended up losing worse! But what the heck. From the start it was believed to be a "next year" team. Gotta get a heck of a lot better of defense between now and then though. Montana's announcers talked a lot about how Montana's offense was looking so much better than it usually does. I think McNeese's defense had something to do with that.

[putter]

It's all subjective anyway. How many people were complaining about MSU (Montana St.) getting in at 7-4 playing in a weak league? A weak team would not have beat Furman today, regardless if they were at home.
Every team has the opportunity to have an OOC schedule and can offset a subpar conference schedule by stepping up in the type of teams they play. This would set teams up for the playoffs..

[Catbooster]

I find it interesting that people think we should move to 24 teams when there have been arguments that the "bottom" at large teams don't deserve a berth, and there have been arguments that the "worst" automatic berth teams don't "deserve" a berth. This year is somewhat an aberration, but I almost think a better argument could be made for reducing the field rather than increasing it with the selections we have, based on the complaining I have seen on threads here. I thought this year, with the records of teams selected for the playoffs, the annual arguing for a larger field would not happen. Guess not.

[JohnStOnge]

I find it interesting that people think we should move to 24 teams when there have been arguments that the "bottom" at large teams don't deserve a berth, and there have been arguments that the "worst" automatic berth teams don't "deserve" a berth. This year is somewhat an aberration, but I almost think a better argument could be made for reducing the field rather than increasing it with the selections we have, based on the complaining I have seen on threads here. I thought this year, with the records of teams selected for the playoffs, the annual arguing for a larger field would not happen. Guess not.

Those who have read my posts over the years know that I never have been fixated on records. I think who a team plays has to be taken into account. I think teams in our subdivision generally play tougher non conference schedules than they used to. In particular they play more BCS league teams.

Only reason I'd like a larger field is that I'd like to see a situation in which, if you're a I-AA conference, your champion is in the tournament. To me there should be criteria for being a I-AA league but if you meet those criteria your champion is in. That's for the purpose of creating a situation where as many teams as possible start the season controlling their own destiny. But I'd also like to leave room for about as many at-large selectons as there are now.

Course maybe that could be done with 20 and letting 12 sit out the first round. I think there is time for that. The college football season lasts into January and right now the "CS" season ends in mid December. Whatever their reason is for not wanting to extend it one more week, it's not something so compelling that the idea that they can't do it has to be etched in stone.

[89Hen]

It has got to be hard to go undefeated and not make the playoffs.Undefeated should be respected.
Did somebody go 11-0 and not make the playoffs this year? :confused: :cool:

[carney2]

Without autobids the playoffs would not only be dominated by, but would be almost exclusively populated with, large state universities who don't have the guts to go play with the big kids.

[ngineer]

Without autobids the playoffs would not only be dominated by, but would be almost exclusively populated with, large state universities who don't have the guts to go play with the big kids.

Boda-bing!:thumbsup: Plus, there are plenty of at-large spots available to give to those worthy of such laudable consideration.

[kardplayer]

It's all subjective anyway. How many people were complaining about MSU (Montana St.) getting in at 7-4 playing in a weak league? A weak team would not have beat Furman today, regardless if they were at home.
Every team has the opportunity to have an OOC schedule and can offset a subpar conference schedule by stepping up in the type of teams they play. This would set teams up for the playoffs..

I don't disagree with Montana State making the playoffs, but I'm not so sure the SoCon was all that powerful this year either and so I don't know that yesterday proved anything.

- Only had 2 good teams, as traditional power Ga. Southern dropped off
- OOC I-AA wins (incl. playoffs): Coastal Carolina (3x), James Madison, SC State, Gardner-Webb (2x), NC A&T, VMI, Eastern Kentucky, Tennessee Tech, Jacksonville State - the top 3 teams only had one OOC game against a top conference prior to the playoffs, although they did win it (App State over JMU)
- OOC I-AA losses (top 3 teams, incl. playoffs): Coastal Carolina (2x), Montana State

[McNeese75]

I am new to this forum so I thought I would give and get opinions on the Auto-bids in CS Playoffs. If you have not guessed, I do not like auto-bids. I believe this season is the perfect example of why auto-bids skew a true picture of who is the playoff champs. I would love to see a straight top 16 team playoff using the GPI poll. This year the Southland and Patriot league champs probably don't belong in the playoffs, especially a 6-5 lafayette team. No offense but I really believe other teams like San Diego and Wofford deserve those spots. It has got to be hard to go undefeated and not make the playoffs.Undefeated should be respected.

Based on results from Montana yesterday it appears if McNeese did not deserve to be in the playoff, neither did Furman xcoffeex