MVFC 2015 Edition

[frozennorth]

I'll take the Valley except uni and wiu.

[Bison Fan in NW MN]

He'd be floored to find out I left NDSU #1 on my ballot for the AGS poll..

BUT DEATH TO NDSU IS IMMINENT.


Since I'm such a homer according to, why would I be "floored" if you had them #1 still?

I think I had them 4th, iirc.

The FCS looks wide open this year.

[Sycamore62]

I'd be more surprised if ISUb beat PU than if WIU beat Illinois. I hope to be surprised.

I think the 1 day delay hurt Kent St way more than Illinois last week. I don't believe in that final score.

[frozennorth]

I'd be more surprised if ISUb beat PU than if WIU beat Illinois. I hope to be surprised.

I think the 1 day delay hurt Kent St way more than Illinois last week. I don't believe in that final score.

I would've gone with WIU otherwise.

[ST_Lawson]

I'd be more surprised if ISUb beat PU than if WIU beat Illinois. I hope to be surprised.

I think the 1 day delay hurt Kent St way more than Illinois last week. I don't believe in that final score.

I'd love to see us both surprised. I'm hoping Kent State is really just that bad. If Sagarin is to be believed, they're worse than Eastern IL (our first opponent).

I'd love for us to catch them looking past us, but really, if we're able to keep it within single digits by halftime and under 20 point spread by the finish and not have any major injuries...I'd be ok with that.

[underdawg]

I still don't believe that SIU put up 660 yds of offense on a D1 opponent. Must be a misprint.

And they still haven't played their best OT IMOxcoffeex

[Lehigh'98]

This place is so much more entertaining when you guys actually lose a few ooc games!!!

[Bison Fan in NW MN]

NDSU vs Weber State

Been up for an hour already waiting to go to Fargo...xnodx

Hope to see the defense make some needed improvements and to see the OL establish the line of scrimmage. Oregon State's QB ran for a ton of yards against Weber but hopefully CW doesn't have to do that with his ankle not being 100%.

Looking forward to an awesome atmosphere and seeing another banner being raised......AGAIN!! Man, this never gets old!!!!


GO BISON

[Sycamore62]

This is the earliest ive been up on purpose for a while. Dang Eastern daylight time.

Probably gonna take great game vs a bad game to beat the Boilermakers.

[RabidRabbit]

Good success for the MVFC teams today. Hope to see a couple of B1G scalps added today. Need some Big sky W's today too.

[frozennorth]

I'm tempted to switch my pick to Weber. I have little faith in Carson ankle.

[The Yo Show]

I still think the Bison take it. Would be surprised if they didn't.

[skinny_uncle]

I still think the Bison take it. Would be surprised if they didn't.

It looks like you will be right.

[X-Factor]

Yes. And that is exactly why one week doesn't make a season. Bison back in NC form.

[Bison Fan in NW MN]

I'm tempted to switch my pick to Weber. I have little faith in Carson ankle.


Might want to rethink this one now....

[Bisonwinagn]

SIU QB is a complete idiot and lost the game for them. Incredible.

[Yote 53]

Coyotes get the win out in Davis, CA. Good weekend for the Valley.

[BisonTru]

Coyotes get the win out in Davis, CA. Good weekend for the Valley.

Nice Job. 4-0 MVFC vs. BSC this week. Much better than week 0.

[The Yo Show]

I was pretty disgusted with YSU's game. I attended and that had to be the worst YSU game I've ever seen. YSU won, but beat Robert Morris in OT 21-14. Looked like a completely different team than last week. xsmhx I am at a complete loss xconfusedx

[Drblankstare]

I was pretty disgusted with YSU's game. I attended and that had to be the worst YSU game I've ever seen. YSU won, but beat Robert Morris in OT 21-14. Looked like a completely different team than last week. xsmhx I am at a complete loss xconfusedx

I just saw the score and I was suprised. What happened?

[The Yo Show]

Well, it was 55 degrees, and it was raining from like 4 hours before gametime, and is still raining now actually hours after the game. But bad weather is no excuse to play bad. Its not like robert morris really could move the ball on us at all. They had 16 total passing yards, and like barely over 100 rushing yards. Until the 4th quarter, they were 1-10 on third down too. The tone was set when Martin Ruiz fumbled on the first play. The very next play, Robert Morris's first with the ball and on offense, was a broken play and their RB scored a 30 some yard rushing TD. They didn't get back on the board until the second half in the 4th quarter, but YSU missed two field goals, dropped a bazillion passes that were right in numerous different receivers chests, our RB got hurt again multiple times but kept coming back in? And then we kept trying to run it up the middle with our backup who is smaller and faster and less of a between the tackles runner.

[centennial]

I just saw the score and I was suprised. What happened?

Hard to throw when raining. Robert Morris stacked the box and YSU couldn't throw. Helps when your QB loses one of his lenses and doesn't bring a backup.

[JayJ79]

Pelini left his cat outside when leaving the house, and he was too worried about how it was handling the rain to concentrate on the game

[Hammersmith]

After the first week of the season the MVFC has dropped from 12th in conference standing to 18th, but that may be understandable based upon one game...xrolleyesx


12 MWC-MOUNTAIN ..............(A) = 65.96 65.65 ( 12) 6 65.74 ( 12)
13 MWC-WEST .....................(A) = 64.73 64.32 ( 13) 6 64.40 ( 13)
14 AAC WEST .......................(A) = 63.49 63.89 ( 14) 6 63.75 ( 14)
15 MAC-WEST.......................(A) = 61.10 60.29 ( 16) 6 60.73 ( 16)
16 CONFERENCE USA-EAST .. (A) = 60.53 60.21 ( 17) 7 60.40 ( 17)
17 CONFERENCE USA-WEST .(A) = 60.31 61.27 ( 15) 6 61.09 ( 15)
18 MISSOURI VALLEY ...... (AA)= 60.24 59.50 ( 18) 10 59.78 ( 18)
19 MAC-EAST ..................... (A) = 56.50 56.33 ( 19) 7 56.38 ( 19)
20 SUN BELT ..................... (A) = 54.90 54.67 ( 20) 11 54.76 ( 20)
21 BIG SKY ........................(AA)= 51.40 51.40 ( 21) 13 51.40 ( 21)
22 SOUTHERN ....................(AA)= 48.84 47.84 ( 23) 9 48.52 ( 22)
23 COLONIAL .....................(AA)= 48.54 47.99 ( 22) 12 48.23 ( 23)
24 OHIO VALLEY .................(AA)= 45.45 45.46 ( 24) 9 45.60 ( 24)
25 SOUTHLAND ..................(AA)= 43.47 42.70 ( 25) 11 43.32 ( 25)
26 BIG SOUTH ...................(AA)= 40.71 41.78 ( 26) 7 41.23 ( 26)
27 PATRIOT .......................(AA)= 40.16 40.14 ( 27) 7 40.12 ( 27)
28 IVY LEAGUE ..................(AA)= 38.84 38.56 ( 28) 8 38.68 ( 28)
29 NORTHEAST ..................(AA)= 36.68 36.21 ( 29) 7 36.31 ( 29)
30 MID-EASTERN ...............(AA)= 33.42 33.90 ( 30) 11 33.76 ( 30)
31 SWAC-EAST ..................(AA)= 29.85 29.04 ( 31) 5 29.44 ( 31)
32 SWAC-WEST .................(AA)= 28.01 27.55 ( 32) 5 27.67 ( 32)
33 PIONEER ......................(AA)= 23.63 23.95 ( 33) 11 23.83 ( 33)

Just want to say it really wasn't that much of a drop. The Valley was ranked 8th among all conferences pre-season and after week 0(NDSU/Mont). After week 1, the Valley slipped to 9th place and stayed there after week 2. We're still above the MAC and Sun Belt, and only 0.9 behind CUSA(we slipped a bit as we were only 0.29 behind CUSA after week 1).

*methodology: I threw out the FBS independents category because we're only comparing conferences. Also, I combined all multi-division conferences into single-division and used the same central mean method Sagarin uses for everything else.


Take this all for what it's worth (not much). It's still very early in the season and most of Sagarin's calculations are still based on last year's results. It's around weeks 6-8 where the ratings start being based completely on the current season.

[Professor Chaos]

Allow me to be my own magic 8 ball.


A lot of interesting MVFC games this week. There's some big questions that'll be answered. Is WIU for real? Outlook not so good. Will NDSU re-assert themselves as a dominant team? Signs point to yes. Is UNI's offense really that bad? My sources say no. Does SIU rebound or crash and burn after an FBS near miss? Without a doubt [on the latter].

[The Yo Show]

Professor, thought it was nice to see you go and answer your questions going into the week after the fact.

[Professor Chaos]

Professor, thought it was nice to see you go and answer your questions going into the week after the fact.
I know, how clairvoyant of me :D

[MSUBear42]

MSU may not win a single MVFC game this year.

[IBleedYellow]

MSU may not win a single MVFC game this year.

That terrible on defense, or offense, or all?

[ysubigred]

Pelini left his cat outside when leaving the house, and he was too worried about how it was handling the rain to concentrate on the game

No.. I think the "O" coordinator was worried about it LOL!!

[AmsterBison]

YSU is the worst bad weather team I've ever seen. They should play their games in their practice facility.

[The Yo Show]

YSU is the worst bad weather team I've ever seen. They should play their games in their practice facility.

I hope this changes over the course of the year. Hopefully they learn from this game.

[Sycamore62]

we are losing players like it's our job

[Kemo]

we are losing players like it's our job

Who's all down for the count for ISU-Blue? Saw the first half of the game against Purdue and thought your defense looked solid, but the offense... not so much.

[Sycamore62]

Who's all down for the count for ISU-Blue? Saw the first half of the game against Purdue and thought your defense looked solid, but the offense... not so much.

4 year starting DB (i think he was a strong safety). 1 Linebacker. 1 running back (one of the 2 main time splitters). then we have some question marks for this week too.

I thought the offense did some good things but we stepped on our dicks too much. big plays killed our defense too.

[Professor Chaos]

4 year starting DB (i think he was a strong safety). 1 Linebacker. 1 running back (one of the 2 main time splitters). then we have some question marks for this week too.

I thought the offense did some good things but we stepped on our dicks too much. big plays killed our defense too.
Sewall? That's too bad, he had All-American potential.

[Sycamore62]

Sewall? That's too bad, he had All-American potential.

yes. that one stings. broken ankle
they said he might be back by the end of the season.

[Bison Fan in NW MN]

9/19:

SEMO @ Ind State
Drake @ USD
St Francis @ YSU
WIU @ CCU
MSU @ Arkansas State
Ill State @ EIU
UND @ NDSU
UNI @ CAL Poly


IND State
USD
YSU
CCU
Arkansas State
Ill State
NDSU
UNI

[BisonTru]

SEMO @ Ind State
Drake @ USD
St Francis @ YSU
WIU @ CCU
MSU @ Arkansas State
Ill State @ EIU
UND @ NDSU
UNI @ CAL Poly

[eiu1999]

SEMO @ Ind State
Drake @ USD
St Francis @ YSU
WIU @ CCU
MSU @ Arkansas State
Ill State @ EIU
UND @ NDSU
UNI @ CAL Poly

[The Yo Show]

SEMO @ Ind State
Drake @ USD
St Francis @ YSU
WIU @ CCU
MSU @ Arkansas State
Ill State @ EIU
UND @ NDSU
UNI @ Cal Poly

toughest game to pick on that was between UNI or Cal Poly. This outcome of this game should help me answer questions like this the rest of the season lol.

[BisonTru]

SEMO @ Ind State
Drake @ USD
St Francis @ YSU
WIU @ CCU
MSU @ Arkansas State
Ill State @ EIU
UND @ NDSU
UNI @ Cal Poly

toughest game to pick on that was between UNI or Cal Poly. This outcome of this game should help me answer questions like this the rest of the season lol.

You seam to be having more trouble with the Coastal Chickens and the Leathernecks.

[The Yo Show]

You seam to be having more trouble with the Coastal Chickens and the Leathernecks.

Whoops, forgot to put the answer in bold. I fixed it now xlolx. Thanks for the heads up!

[frozennorth]

9/19:

Ind State
USD
YSU
WIU
Arkansas State
Ill State
NDSU
UNI

Straight homerism.

[The Yo Show]

I dont know. I did consider a WIU upset. Im not convinced that it is impossible yet. I just havent seen enough of WIU to be really confident about it yet. Had they done better against the illinois... i would have picked them.

[penguinpower]

I dont know. I did consider a III WIU upset. Im not convinced that it is impossible yet. I just havent seen enough of WIU to be really confident about it yet. Had they done better against the illinois... i would have picked them.

WIU is going to be a problem for a lot of teams this year. They don't get much attention but the have an excellent defense. And their offense is better than last year. I am concerned that they will upset us.

[Sycamore62]

WIU is going to be a problem for a lot of teams this year. They don't get much attention but the have an excellent defense. And their offense is better than last year. I am concerned that they will upset us.

we have them next to last game. I hope by then it would be considered an upset because of how well we do.

then I hope it doesnt happen.

I think the P5 FBS losses are just wild cards. I think a win is a big deal but a loss is meaningless.

That being said I think 8 teams in our conference are top 3 in a lot of fcs conferences right now.

[The Yo Show]

WIU is going to be a problem for a lot of teams this year. They don't get much attention but the have an excellent defense. And their offense is better than last year. I am concerned that they will upset us.

I get concerned every MVFC conference game. There are no easy games in the valley. But back to WIU, I do believe they have a decent shot to win. Im not convinced they will though. CCU has looked good so far. Still, I would not be suprised if they did beat WIU

[dewey]

Here is an article from the Fargo Forum titled MVFC Notebook. It talks about WIU taking on Coastal Carolina and also Youngstown States results from the first 2 weeks.

http://www.inforum.com/sports/3841476-mvfc-notebook-leathernecks-look-best-top-ranked-chanticleers

Good luck Leathernecks!

Go Bison!

Dewey

[The Yo Show]

Nice article!

[Sycamore62]

I saw the attendance notes in a couple places. for the outside stadiums in the conference, do other teams notice a steep drop off in attendance? I realize we have a couple other things going against us, such as history and reputation, but the first time it gets cold people dont come out.

[ST_Lawson]

I saw the attendance notes in a couple places. for the outside stadiums in the conference, do other teams notice a steep drop off in attendance? I realize we have a couple other things going against us, such as history and reputation, but the first time it gets cold people dont come out.

That's what we generally see too, unless we're doing really well. The years when we haven't had a big drop during our last game (which often happens to be the first weekend of thanksgiving break and all the students have gone home...3+ hours away) are years when we were conference champions (or co-champs)...2000, 2002. Also, those years the last home game was in early November or late October. The last time we were in the playoffs (2010), our last game of the season was during thanksgiving break. There was a huge push from the university to get people to come down on the train to see the game and there was a good visiting crowd too (was against UNI who was also competing for a playoff spot). We dropped a few thousand from our average for the rest of the season, but it wasn't horrible considering what it usually would have been.

[Sycamore62]

That's what we generally see too, unless we're doing really well. The years when we haven't had a big drop during our last game (which often happens to be the first weekend of thanksgiving break and all the students have gone home...3+ hours away) are years when we were conference champions (or co-champs)...2000, 2002. Also, those years the last home game was in early November or late October. The last time we were in the playoffs (2010), our last game of the season was during thanksgiving break. There was a huge push from the university to get people to come down on the train to see the game and there was a good visiting crowd too (was against UNI who was also competing for a playoff spot). We dropped a few thousand from our average for the rest of the season, but it wasn't horrible considering what it usually would have been.

I remember having a pretty solid crowd in 1996 at your homecoming. Maybe its my photogenic memory playing tricks on me.

[ST_Lawson]

I remember having a pretty solid crowd in 1996 at your homecoming. Maybe its my photogenic memory playing tricks on me.

That's entirely possible (would have been my freshman year in the Marching Leathernecks actually). I don't have individual game attendance data pre-1998, but we were 4-0 at that point in the season (finished 9-3), with wins over (lower division) Northwestern Oklahoma State (44-21), FBS Northern Illinois (17-0), Alcorn State (34-17), and Hofstra RIP (18-9). Probably would have been a lot of excitement on campus and among the alumni for a big homecoming crowd (which, of course, you guys ruined with a 10-7 victory ;)).

[Lehigh Football Nation]

This seems like a good place to drop this:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CPNnFAXUYAA5LrH.jpg:large

[ST_Lawson]

This seems like a good place to drop this:



KILL IT WITH FIRE!!!

[ST_Lawson]

Here is an article from the Fargo Forum titled MVFC Notebook. It talks about WIU taking on Coastal Carolina and also Youngstown States results from the first 2 weeks.

http://www.inforum.com/sports/3841476-mvfc-notebook-leathernecks-look-best-top-ranked-chanticleers

Good luck Leathernecks!

Go Bison!

Dewey

Thanks. Yea, I'm not worried about our defense (5 turnovers against Eastern, 4 against Illinois), but with Illinois, the offense did absolutely nothing with them. It's kinda up to the offense whether we're still in the game at the end or not.

[penguinpower]

Western Illinois is a team that is ranked too low. I have watched them play two games this year and their record is no indication of how good they are. Dangerous team that you need to bring your "A" game against every week.

The Missouri Valley is his stacked again this year and it is not even close.

Wait till you see Youngstown's retooled defense. It has a chance to be special. The safety transfer from Nebraska is a flat out stud. I wish YSU's scheduling would improve. Totally sucks until conference play (outside of the FBS games). The defense is improving weekly. As a fan I have been taken ill from watching the porous defenses perpetually lose games over the last 5 years. Always heard about the talent at Youngstown but didn't believe it. People on this board (especially the NDSU'ers) would say that YSU has the talent but can't put it together. I couldn't understand it. I thought it was a depth issue but I am starting to believe it now. I think YSU can do some serious damage in the conference this year, especially with how the defense is coming along. It is so satisfying to watch proper alignment and technique, something totally absent for 5 years.

QB play hasn't been sharp and the OL needs some more work too, but this year I don't see the late season collapse like in past years.

[clenz]

I'd wait until you a game past needing OT to beat a NEC team before bragging about how good you are....just a thought.


WIU is a mystery to me. They have the top end talent to compete, but they don't have the depth. They look real good one game, and get stomped the next. That's been their story for 2 or 3 seasons now.

[Daved]

Don't think he's bragging--only stating facts about the past--only time will tell whether they collapse again but they also played their share of horrible games vs. weak opponents back in the 90's.Playing toe-to toe vs. an ACC team on the road indicates that they can be a good team this year.I know most posters think that Pelini is a joke but believe they will end up surprised and I will be surprised if Nebraska does anything this year.

[clenz]

I'd have been shocked if they did anything with him as HC as well...

[Panther-State]

So what's the deal with ISUr? Did they struggle that much against a bad EIU team or has EIU figured it out since getting smacked around by this Leatherneck team that seems to be starting strong?

[Bison Fan in NW MN]

Valley looks tough as nails.....again!

[clenz]

So what's the deal with ISUr? Did they struggle that much against a bad EIU team or has EIU figured it out since getting smacked around by this Leatherneck team that seems to be starting strong?
No.

They had 138 total yards against Northwestern and had scored 5 points all season long

[Rollbird5]

So what's the deal with ISUr? Did they struggle that much against a bad EIU team or has EIU figured it out since getting smacked around by this Leatherneck team that seems to be starting strong?
When they played Western they had 14 penalties and 5 turnovers with at least one of those being in the redzone if I remember correctly. Against us the QB made good decisions most of the game and they didn't turn it over til OT which cost them. So I would say they are starting to figure it out, as well as playing their first home game against a rival with Shanahan in the house for hall of fame recognition they were pretty amped up. Saying all that tho we still didn't play all that well. Not having our All American DE Corwin definitely has hurt us in stopping the run game and getting to the passer. We also missed two Field goals (48,47 yarders I believe) and threw a pick 6 at end of first half. Last year we should've lost to both WIU and Indiana State on road and didn't look that good in those early games but turned out ok so that is giving me some more hope. Just my take on the game tho

[REALBird]

Whitlock seemed to play a much better game than his first two. EIU was committed to a more balanced run/pass attack and they found some success.

I didn't see the ISU defense get after him much, and the loss of Teddy Corwin is showing, but no excuses.

Probably the biggest blunder was trying to add more points at the end of the first half and the pic 6. You're up 24-14 w/ 22 seconds left and you get the ball after half. And you try to tack on more points when you still have to go 85 yards. Dumb play calling. Gave EIU life and let them back in the game.

Whether it was honoring longtime coach Bob Spoo or Hanging a banner for Mike Shanahan EIU played better. ISU didn't play down, still not sure who or what we are. But we are NOT the team from last year so it seems.

[PantherRob82]

Whitlock seemed to play a much better game than his first two. EIU was committed to a more balanced run/pass attack and they found some success.

I didn't see the ISU defense get after him much, and the loss of Teddy Corwin is showing, but no excuses.

Probably the biggest blunder was trying to add more points at the end of the first half and the pic 6. You're up 24-14 w/ 22 seconds left and you get the ball after half. And you try to tack on more points when you still have to go 85 yards. Dumb play calling. Gave EIU life and let them back in the game.

Whether it was honoring longtime coach Bob Spoo or Hanging a banner for Mike Shanahan EIU played better. ISU didn't play down, still not sure who or what we are. But we are NOT the team from last year so it seems.

That's what blows my mind. I had you guys preseason #1.

[BisonFan02]

Whitlock seemed to play a much better game than his first two. EIU was committed to a more balanced run/pass attack and they found some success.

I didn't see the ISU defense get after him much, and the loss of Teddy Corwin is showing, but no excuses.

Probably the biggest blunder was trying to add more points at the end of the first half and the pic 6. You're up 24-14 w/ 22 seconds left and you get the ball after half. And you try to tack on more points when you still have to go 85 yards. Dumb play calling. Gave EIU life and let them back in the game.

Whether it was honoring longtime coach Bob Spoo or Hanging a banner for Mike Shanahan EIU played better. ISU didn't play down, still not sure who or what we are. But we are NOT the team from last year so it seems.

I think the loss of Corwin on D might be a big deal out of the gate anyway for ISUr in Valley play (especially since they have UNI and YSU back-to-back) That being said...."Next man up!".

[The Yo Show]

Im really excited that MVFC conference play is basically here!

[centennial]

In other news Missouri State sucks. They LOST to a Sun Belt school(shame), this school isn't very good(Arkansas State, more shame), and they lost 70-7 WTF.

[BisonFan02]

In other news Missouri State sucks. They LOST to a Sun Belt school(shame), this school isn't very good(Arkansas State, more shame), and they lost 70-7 WTF.

Anyone check the Sunbelt boards to see if Missouri State is still a candidate for expansion? :D

[clenz]

Read the MSU board. They are and it doesn't matter what happens this year. The Sun Belt is going to wait until next year to judge Missouri State because Steckle is in his first season.

[RabidRabbit]

And the selectee, CCU, has RECORD ATTENDANCE OF 10K +.

[REALBird]

PantherRob,

Last year probably the biggest blessing was that Tre Roberson didn't have the WHOLE playbook because he came into camp late. I saw more pure athleticism, he didn't always go through all his reads. It was Option #1 and then run, at times maybe option #2 and run.

Maybe it's just me, but through three games I see him trying to sit in the pocket, trying to go through progressions to see the 2nd and 3rd receiver. Good for his life after ISU, but his WR are inexperienced they don't always run good routes or get open. To me that can be dangerous for Tre and this team. Don't take away his athleticism by calling a game that doesn't fit his talents. Plus, now that he does know the playbook, That's great but he doesn't have the proven talent he had last year to maybe cover up for his inaccuracy or ill timed poorly thrown pass.

Coprich is gaining steam, and I get the whole "saving" him for late in the season. But he didn't wear down last year, so if it ain't broke don't fix it. Giving the 2nd and 3rd stringers reps will be great for next year, but unless it's the occasional breather don't overthink it too much coaches.

ISU will go as the WR core goes or the play calling. Still a work in progress. But wouldn't shock me to see 1-2 more losses this year.

[Bisonwinagn]

I would be surprised if any team goes undefeated and wouldn't be shocked if the winner has 2 losses. This conference is extremely tough just like last year.

[Sycamore62]

Are all the MVFC conference games going to be on espn3 or was that just a MVC thing?

[clenz]

That's an MVC deal, it's up to individual schools to put it on ESPN3.

UNI and NDSU will have every home game on ESPN3. The rest I don't know

[penguinpower]

That's an MVC deal, it's up to individual schools to put it on ESPN3.

UNI and NDSU will have every home game on ESPN3. The rest I don't know

Youngstown also has all home games on ESPN3.

[FargoBison]

Basically every conference game will be on ESPN3, there are a few exceptions.

The MVFC and ESPN3 do have a contract, I know that because it restricts NDSU from putting games on networks like Fox Sports North.

[ST_Lawson]

Yup, all of ours are on ESPN3 this season, as was our home game vs Eastern. Only games that weren't were against Illinois (BTN) and Coastal Carolina (streamed on Big South conference website).

I think it gives great visibility for the conference. I can just pop open my ESPN app on my roku and watch pretty much any MVFC football game live, and usually in HD. Also provides the ability to go back and watch. Like, on 10/3, we've got SIU in town for Homecoming, so I'll miss much of what's going on that day, but I can pop open the app that night or on Sunday morning before NFL games and watch what was probably a pretty exciting NDSU @ SDSU game...just as an example.

I know it's not ESPN or ESPN2, but I know that a lot of our alumni watched the game against Eastern IL earlier this year that otherwise wouldn't have been able to watch it, because it was on ESPN3.

[clenz]

Basically every conference game will be on ESPN3, there are a few exceptions.

The MVFC and ESPN3 do have a contract, I know that because it restricts NDSU from putting games on networks like Fox Sports North.
I'd like to see a link to the contract.

There is an agreement with Mediacom and Niles Media Group to produce and broadcast some games that will be sent to ESPN3, but not a conference wide agreement to show games on ESPN3. It's up to each school to send the feed to ESPN3 when they aren't produced by Mediacom or Niles.


What does that mean? Unless your game is broadcast by/to Mediacom or Comcast Sports it's up to your school to send the feed to ESPN. It's why the NDSU broadcasts involve the NBCND crew, and the UNI games the PantherSportsNetwork crew.

It's why schools like Indiana State, USD and WIU have all had significantly fewer games on ESPN3 than UNI, NDSU, SIU, ISUr, SDSU, etc... in the past.

With the new deal with the MVC you will see ISUb and MSU dramatically increase the number of football games on ESPN3 because the control room and equipment are now in place because of the new deal to show every single home, indoor, even on ESPN3 for MVC sports

[Twentysix]

Basically every conference game will be on ESPN3, there are a few exceptions.

The MVFC and ESPN3 do have a contract, I know that because it restricts NDSU from putting games on networks like Fox Sports North.

Pretty sure NDSU's tv contract that hinders putting games on networks like Fox Sports North is with one of the ND channels. It isn't an MVFC broadcasting contract.

[FargoBison]

I'd like to see a link to the contract.

There is an agreement with Mediacom and Niles Media Group to produce and broadcast some games that will be sent to ESPN3, but not a conference wide agreement to show games on ESPN3. It's up to each school to send the feed to ESPN3 when they aren't produced by Mediacom or Niles.


What does that mean? Unless your game is broadcast by/to Mediacom or Comcast Sports it's up to your school to send the feed to ESPN. It's why the NDSU broadcasts involve the NBCND crew, and the UNI games the PantherSportsNetwork crew.

It's why schools like Indiana State, USD and WIU have all had significantly fewer games on ESPN3 than UNI, NDSU, SIU, ISUr, SDSU, etc... in the past.

With the new deal with the MVC you will see ISUb and MSU dramatically increase the number of football games on ESPN3 because the control room and equipment are now in place because of the new deal to show every single home, indoor, even on ESPN3 for MVC sports

I don't know where to find the contract but our media director said this about why NDSU can't have games on FSN....


@GulsethMichael (https://twitter.com/GulsethMichael) Thanks!! no FSN for football with the leagues relationship with ESPN

https://twitter.com/jerjorgenson/status/630813059393544192

[Twentysix]

I don't know where to find the contract but our media director said this about why NDSU can't have games on FSN....



https://twitter.com/jerjorgenson/status/630813059393544192

Interesting.

[clenz]

I don't know where to find the contract but our media director said this about why NDSU can't have games on FSN....



https://twitter.com/jerjorgenson/status/630813059393544192
That is because of what I already pointed out.

There is a deal in place to have only Mediacom and Niles Media produce "conference" games. that aren't produced by the school. Mediacom and Niles have relationships with Mediacom (obviously) and Comcast Sports Chicago.

Games that Mediacom and Nile produce are the conference games of the week that will be on Mediacom22 or Comcast Sports Chicago. The rest of the broadcasts are school produced. I don't think it's ESPN, specifically, that says you can't use FSN; it's the overall deal that ESPN, MVFC and Mediacom/Niles have in place.

Want to know how I know that?

It's right on the MVFC website

From last years release

Approximately 50 league games will air on a myriad of television networks during the 2014 season, the Missouri Valley Football Conference announced today. The Conference will produce seven league games – including five Homecoming games -- as part of its 2014 Game of the Week package, and approximately 50 additional games will air in conjunction with MVFC institutional packages.

The MVFC will work with two production companies, renewing partnerships from last season. Mediacom, which has partnerships with a number of Valley Football institutions, will produce and air six league games. Mediacom will distribute those games on its family of networks and simulcast four of the games on ESPN3. Kansas City-based Niles Media Group returns as a league partner and will produce one game for the conference -- and that contest will air on over-the-air stations and on ESPN3. Veteran broadcasters Scott Warmann and Danan Hughes will provide play-by-play and analyst duties for the 2014 package.
For the first time, the league will utilize instant replay during its game of the week broadcasts. An estimated 30 league contests will utilize instant replay this fall, which includes league-produced and select institutionally produced TV games. DVSport, Inc., will administer replay, in conjunction with MVFC officials.
The 2014 conference package is listed immediately below. Additional broadcast information will be added as schools formalize their institutional telecast agreements.

Saturday, Oct. 4 -- North Dakota St. at Western Illinois (HC), 3 pm
Saturday, Oct. 11 -- UNI at South Dakota (HC), 3 pm
Saturday, Oct. 18 -- South Dakota at Missouri State (HC), 2 pm
Saturday, Oct. 25 -- Youngstown State at South Dakota State (HC), 2 pm
Saturday, Oct. 25 -- Indiana State at Southern Illinois (HC), 6 pm
Saturday, Nov. 8 -- Youngstown State at Illinois State, 1 pm
Saturday, Nov. 15 -- UNI at Southern Illinois, 2 pm

[clenz]

I can't find anything else on the deal. I'll keep looking, but all previous articles (going back to 2011) point to ESPN3 being the distributor of the games) and it's up to the school to put it on ESPN, unless it's a Mediacom/Niles broadcast. Then it has to go to to ESPN3

It's why not every MVFC home game has been on ESPN3 in past years.

Maybe there is a new deal this year, but I haven't found anything on it, unless it got tied into the new MVC deal that was worked out


I very well could be wrong.xthumbsupx

[FargoBison]

That is because of what I already pointed out.

There is a deal in place to have only Mediacom and Niles Media produce "conference" games. that aren't produced by the school. Mediacom and Niles have relationships with Mediacom (obviously) and Comcast Sports Chicago.

Games that Mediacom and Nile produce are the conference games of the week that will be on Mediacom22 or Comcast Sports Chicago. The rest of the broadcasts are school produced. I don't think it's ESPN, specifically, that says you can't use FSN; it's the overall deal that ESPN, MVFC and Mediacom/Niles have in place.

Want to know how I know that?

It's right on the MVFC website

From last years release

Approximately 50 league games will air on a myriad of television networks during the 2014 season, the Missouri Valley Football Conference announced today. The Conference will produce seven league games – including five Homecoming games -- as part of its 2014 Game of the Week package, and approximately 50 additional games will air in conjunction with MVFC institutional packages.

The MVFC will work with two production companies, renewing partnerships from last season. Mediacom, which has partnerships with a number of Valley Football institutions, will produce and air six league games. Mediacom will distribute those games on its family of networks and simulcast four of the games on ESPN3. Kansas City-based Niles Media Group returns as a league partner and will produce one game for the conference -- and that contest will air on over-the-air stations and on ESPN3. Veteran broadcasters Scott Warmann and Danan Hughes will provide play-by-play and analyst duties for the 2014 package.
For the first time, the league will utilize instant replay during its game of the week broadcasts. An estimated 30 league contests will utilize instant replay this fall, which includes league-produced and select institutionally produced TV games. DVSport, Inc., will administer replay, in conjunction with MVFC officials.
The 2014 conference package is listed immediately below. Additional broadcast information will be added as schools formalize their institutional telecast agreements.

Saturday, Oct. 4 -- North Dakota St. at Western Illinois (HC), 3 pm
Saturday, Oct. 11 -- UNI at South Dakota (HC), 3 pm
Saturday, Oct. 18 -- South Dakota at Missouri State (HC), 2 pm
Saturday, Oct. 25 -- Youngstown State at South Dakota State (HC), 2 pm
Saturday, Oct. 25 -- Indiana State at Southern Illinois (HC), 6 pm
Saturday, Nov. 8 -- Youngstown State at Illinois State, 1 pm
Saturday, Nov. 15 -- UNI at Southern Illinois, 2 pm

All I know is that he directly referenced ESPN. Of course what you say makes sense since a few schools apparently can put their games on Comcast Chicago.

Whatever the case it is a horrific media deal.

[clenz]

Here's an article from the Evansville Courier Press on the MVC deal


http://www.courierpress.com/sports/ue/espn-mvc-announce-contract-extension_93356558
The media rights deal announced Thursday — a 10-year extension to the current contract between the MVC and ESPN — calls for each conference school to produce its own ESPN3 telecasts for all volleyball, men’s basketball and women’s basketball home contests in 2015-16. Soccer matches will be broadcast in 2016-17, followed by softball and baseball games the next year, said Tom Benson, general manager of WUEV and AcesTV.
ESPN3 provides television-quality broadcasts online with the same graphics packages as other ESPN networks. ESPN3 is available nationally and can be viewed on laptops or mobile devices.
The most obvious byproduct of the deal — which introduced the brand “The Valley on ESPN3” — is increased exposure for MVC athletics. Regional TV deals for conference schools will not be affected.
“We’ve never underestimated the promotional power of ESPN,” MVC Commissioner Doug Elgin said. “When you think about networks that you can partner with, you certainly look to the worldwide leader.”

[clenz]

All I know is that he directly referenced ESPN. Of course what you say makes sense since a few schools apparently can put their games on Comcast Chicago.

Whatever the case it is a horrific media deal.
The only games on Comcast Sports Chicago are the "Games of the Week". That is the league produced game by Mediacom/Niles with "professional broadcasters".

If UNI, Illinois State, SIU, etc... get an extra game on CSNChicago it's because the school worked a deal with Comcast to play their games (I know UNI has a deal that plays a good number of games from all sports on the station.


It is a terrible deal, as of now, right now though.


Something like the deal the MVC got would be GREAT. I don't know that Mediacom and Niles will give up that kind of power though

[FargoBison]

All I can really find on ESPN3 and the MVFC....


"ESPN3.com continues to grow as a leading destination and a key distribution outlet for reaching the college sports fan," said Damon Phillips, Vice President, ESPN3.com. "We are looking forward to working with the Missouri Valley Football Conference to produce and distribute these exclusive games.


http://www.wfmj.com/story/15237176/espn-missouri-valley-football-conference-reach-agreement

[clenz]

All I can really find on ESPN3 and the MVFC....



http://www.wfmj.com/story/15237176/espn-missouri-valley-football-conference-reach-agreement
Yeah. That's just about it being the distribution point for games. Not who can/can't carry it.

Again, I could be very wrong on this. I can't find anything that would prohibit FSN on behalf of ESPN.

I would guess it's more because the contract now includes exclusive rights to CSNCHICAGO through Mediacom/Niles, which is a NBC SPORTS affiliate.

Local ABC and Fox Stations carrying a game is okay, but going to a regional deal might ding an issue with NBC Sports group.

No real idea

[The Yo Show]

You would think it would be easier to find information about the network deals and televising restrictions for a conference. It seems more secretive than area 51 right now xeyebrowx

[clenz]

You would think it would be easier to find information about the network deals and televising restrictions for a conference. It seems more secretive than area 51 right now xeyebrowx
With most conferences it is.

This is why there is so much frustration with the MVFC leadership right now.

The TV deal is bad/non-existant. The games on Mediacom aren't produced in HD, have terrible PxP guys, is 4:3 ratio stretch to 16:9, which cuts 1/4 of all sides of the screen off, etc...

There seems to be little effort to better the deal. I know the MVFC and MVC are separate, but with the relationship that ESPN and the MVC have you'd think Patty would be able to swing something better. ESPN has no reason to approach the MVFC to change it.

However, with the MVC deal now requiring all MVC schools meeting ESPN quality standard for on campups productions (it was really ISUb, MSU and SIU that had the most issues) I think we will see a deal similar to the MVC deal for next year (all home games involving MVFC members must be on EPSN3). That is assuming all the Summit schools can make it happen (USD and WIU are the only two I have "concerns of" but both seem to be on ESPN3 a decent amount this year.

What needs to happen is the deal with Mediacom/Niles needs to be re-worked. I think that's the biggest hold up. Force them to upgrade their production quality. They only produce 1 game per week so force them to give up control over regional broadcast rights.

[FargoBison]

The core issue the MVFC has, is that the MVC wants nothing to do with football. It plagues the league, especially in areas like this where together they could benefit each other by working together.

As a result the MVFC is kind of hamstrung in my opinion. Meanwhile the CAA has a great deal for both because the conferences work together, the CAA model is what the MVFC/MVC should emulate.

[PantherRob82]

The core issue the MVFC has, is that the MVC wants nothing to do with football. It plagues the league, especially in areas like this where together they could benefit each other by working together.

As a result the MVFC is kind of hamstrung in my opinion. Meanwhile the CAA has a great deal for both because the conferences work together, the CAA model is what the MVFC/MVC should emulate.

Could you give examples of what the CAA does differently?

[BisonFan02]

The core issue the MVFC has, is that the MVC wants nothing to do with football. It plagues the league, especially in areas like this where together they could benefit each other by working together.

As a result the MVFC is kind of hamstrung in my opinion. Meanwhile the CAA has a great deal for both because the conferences work together, the CAA model is what the MVFC/MVC should emulate.

http://realtimerpi.com/ncaab/conf_Men.html

except the MVC doesn't want to be the CAA....they want to be the Big East...and the less football spending/focus, the better if you are the MVC. They wouldn't bat an eye if every MVC program cut the sport.

[FargoBison]

Could you give examples of what the CAA does differently?

Look at their media deal...NBCSN and Comcast for both football and basketball. Look at their website, it actually talks about football. It is not even separated like the MVC/MVFC.

The commissioner of the CAA actually likes football and has an active role within the FCS. Honestly I am not sure if they even have separate commissioners.

The MVFC would be better off being run by the Summit League.

[PantherRob82]

Look at their media deal...NBCSN and Comcast for both football and basketball. Look at their website, it actually talks about football. It is not even separated like the MVC/MVFC.

The commissioner of the CAA actually likes football and has an active role within the FCS. Honestly I am not sure if they even have separate commissioners.

I'm entirely sure why they decided to do things this way. Seems to be mixed opinions on Patti.

[clenz]

http://realtimerpi.com/ncaab/conf_Men.html

except the MVC doesn't want to be the CAA....they want to be the Big East...and the less football spending/focus, the better if you are the MVC. They wouldn't bat an eye if every MVC program cut the sport.
Yeah...shame on the MVC for caring about their sports.

It's also funny you post the RPI and then say "They want to be the Big East", especially after the MVC finished 7th in RPI nationally and closer to the Big East in the ranking than the CAA is to the MVC...and it's not close.




That's not the issue at all, and it isn't hamstringing the conference at all. It's funny seeing NDSU fans think it does. It clearly hasn't hurt NDSU with 4 straight titles....or 5 bids for the MVFC last season....or looking like 4 or 5 bids so far this year....and all the top 25 rankings.


The issue with the TV deal is Patty V not being real smart, not the MVC wanting to be good at basketball. Say what you want about MVC schools not spending money on football - I believe MSU just dumped 20 million or so into their football stadium, ISUr has as much individual talent as anyone in the league and just redid their stadium, UNI should really never be questioned on commitment to football. SIU just opened a 20 million stadium and the money issues come from the fact the state of Illinois shouldn't be given a check book but was. Indiana State is the only "hold up" on spending money in the MVC....and that carries over to MVC sports as well.



Maybe you need to look at other Summit programs for not spending enough money to better themselves

http://volanteonline.com/2015/02/usd-athletic-department-least-funded-summit-league-missouri-valley-football-conference-since-d-transition/

[FargoBison]

I'm entirely sure why they decided to do things this way. Seems to be mixed opinions on Patti.

I think part of Patty's problem is that she works for three different leagues at the same time. I have never really understood why she is the comish of two FCS conferences, it is probably something that should be put to an end.

[clenz]

MVC schools with budgets per USA Today
UNI 17M
SIU 21M
ISUR 21M
ISUB 14M
MSU 15M

Summit schools with budgets per USA Today
NDSU 20M
SDSU 15M
USD 9M (PER EARLY ARTICLE)
WIU 12M

Horizon
YSU 14M


Looks like the lowest MVC team still would be third in the summit when it comes to funding programs.


I'll dig for football specific numbers tomorrow, if no one posts them before hand.

MVC schools with football spend the same between 1.7-2.4m on basketball each year.

The non basketball schools spend a minimum of 2.3 (Bradley) in 2013 on basketball. Pretty easy to see why WSU would want UNI to up the basketball budget from 2.4m to about 3.2m. The potential for UNI's basketball program would sky rocket.

[FargoBison]

I don't think the MVC wants to be like the Big East, I do think the conference doesn't want to become like the former Big East where this big rift formed between the privates and football publics. Thus anything football related is approached with extreme caution.

[BisonFan02]

Yeah...shame on the MVC for caring about their sports.

It's also funny you post the RPI and then say "They want to be the Big East", especially after the MVC finished 7th in RPI nationally and closer to the Big East in the ranking than the CAA is to the MVC...and it's not close.

Yeah.....no kidding. I was talking about FargoBison trying to say the MVC/MVFC should look towards what the CAA is doing...hence why I think the MVC wants to be more like the Big East...rather than the CAA (and they are...hence the bball RPI)

That's not the issue at all, and it isn't hamstringing the conference at all. It's funny seeing NDSU fans think it does. It clearly hasn't hurt NDSU with 4 straight titles....or 5 bids for the MVFC last season....or looking like 4 or 5 bids so far this year....and all the top 25 rankings.

Didn't say it hamstrung NDSU at all...The Bison can take care of themselves anyway. :D You're welcome for the SOS by the way... xlolx

The issue with the TV deal is Patty V not being real smart, not the MVC wanting to be good at basketball. Say what you want about MVC schools not spending money on football - I believe MSU just dumped 20 million or so into their football stadium, ISUr has as much individual talent as anyone in the league and just redid their stadium, UNI should really never be questioned on commitment to football. SIU just opened a 20 million stadium and the money issues come from the fact the state of Illinois shouldn't be given a check book but was. Indiana State is the only "hold up" on spending money in the MVC....and that carries over to MVC sports as well.



Maybe you need to look at other Summit programs for not spending enough money to better themselves

http://volanteonline.com/2015/02/usd-athletic-department-least-funded-summit-league-missouri-valley-football-conference-since-d-transition/

See above.

[BisonFan02]

I don't think the MVC wants to be like the Big East, I do think the conference doesn't want to become like the former Big East where this big rift formed between the privates and football publics. Thus anything football related is approached with extreme caution.

I do...then maybe Creighton wouldn't have "moved up"... xlolx (yeah...low blow taken at the loss of a private school and the sought after Omaha media market...you guys should take a run at Summit member UNO to get that back :D )

[clenz]

I don't think the MVC wants to be like the Big East, I do think the conference doesn't want to become like the former Big East where this big rift formed between the privates and football publics. Thus anything football related is approached with extreme caution.
This is exactly it, and why the addition of Loyola (while controversial) was likely the right move.

We watched the old Big East - the exact same set up as the MVC just on a larger scale - implode before our eyes because basketball and football couldn't figure out how to co-exist. The issue is the non-football schools in the MVC have zero room to talk about football hindering basketball when the football schools have far more success than the non-football schools (sans WSU).

Because of that implosion the entire conference is fully aware of the potential ramifications should that fault line move. Unlike the basketball side of the old Big East we don't have the names like Villanova and Georgetown to parlay that into another basketball league. The football teams also realize that at the FCS level we can't just create a new conference like the AAC and pull in a bunch of okay-decent programs to make a conference out of nothing that will be respectable at basketball and football.

It's a very delicate balance, and when it gets upset it is done so by Illinois State and Indiana State for their small minded thinking.



Any issue with the MVFC has nothing to do with the fact UNI spends as much in one season on basketball as the entire Summit League combined (yes, that was sarcasm...I realize it's only as much as 75% of the conference). It's that Patty V shouldn't be in charge.

[clenz]

I do...then maybe Creighton wouldn't have "moved up"... xlolx (yeah...low blow taken at the loss of a private school and the sought after Omaha media market...you guys should take a run at Summit member UNO to get that back :D )
Creighton's move was a huge mistake, and everyone except their president new it. They have no natural rivals, they have no regional rivals (Marquette is the closest and they are 2 states away). Creighton's president is a lot like St. Louis's president. They fell in love with the east coast media and private, jesuit, institutions. He sold their soul to get them into that league.

He just so happened to luck into have Doug McDermott there to use as a trump card. He used 3 years of McD in the MVC to go "See, we are good. We have an All American" and the Big East bought it. Everyone knew once Dougy was gone Creighton would fall apart - there was talk on the MVC boards about them falling to about 6th or 7th after Dougy left.

The entire athletic department at Creighton was pissed when they were forced into the move by the president. The money from FS1 is the only saving grace (and it's a nice chunk of change).

The harsh reality of the Big East is they are Villanova and then no one. They are a bunch of programs with big names from things done in the 80s.

[BisonFan02]

Creighton's move was a huge mistake, and everyone except their president new it. They have no natural rivals, they have no regional rivals (Marquette is the closest and they are 2 states away). Creighton's president is a lot like St. Louis's president. They fell in love with the east coast media and private, jesuit, institutions. He sold their soul to get them into that league.

He just so happened to luck into have Doug McDermott there to use as a trump card. He used 3 years of McD in the MVC to go "See, we are good. We have an All American" and the Big East bought it. Everyone knew once Dougy was gone Creighton would fall apart - there was talk on the MVC boards about them falling to about 6th or 7th after Dougy left.

The entire athletic department at Creighton was pissed when they were forced into the move by the president. The money from FS1 is the only saving grace (and it's a nice chunk of change).

The harsh reality of the Big East is they are Villanova and then no one. They are a bunch of programs with big names from things done in the 80s.



Team
Titles
Title Years
Finals
Runner-up


Youngstown State (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Youngstown_State_Penguins_football)
4
1991, 1993, 1994, 1997
6
1992, 1999


North Dakota State (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Dakota_State_Bison_football)
4
2011 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_North_Dakota_State_Bison_football_team), 2012 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_North_Dakota_State_Bison_football_team), 2013 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_North_Dakota_State_Bison_football_team), 2014 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_North_Dakota_State_Bison_football_team)
4



Southern Illinois (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Illinois_Salukis_football)
1
1983
1



WKU (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WKU_Hilltoppers_football)♯
1
2002
1



Northern Iowa (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Iowa_Panthers_football)
0

1
2005 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_Northern_Iowa_Panthers_football_team)


Illinois State (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illinois_State_Redbirds_football)
0

1
2014 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Illinois_State_Redbirds_football_team)




I know those feels bro...... :D

[clenz]

Team
Titles
Title Years
Finals
Runner-up


Youngstown State (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Youngstown_State_Penguins_football)
4
1991, 1993, 1994, 1997
6
1992, 1999


North Dakota State (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Dakota_State_Bison_football)
4
2011 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_North_Dakota_State_Bison_football_team), 2012 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_North_Dakota_State_Bison_football_team), 2013 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_North_Dakota_State_Bison_football_team), 2014 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_North_Dakota_State_Bison_football_team)
4



Southern Illinois (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Illinois_Salukis_football)
1
1983
1



WKU (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WKU_Hilltoppers_football)♯
1
2002
1



Northern Iowa (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Iowa_Panthers_football)
0

1
2005 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_Northern_Iowa_Panthers_football_team)


Illinois State (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illinois_State_Redbirds_football)
0

1
2014 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Illinois_State_Redbirds_football_team)




I know those feels bro...... :DWhen you can't actually argue your point anymore bring up something unrelated.


Oh...wait...

That actually proves my point. Nothing about the MVC has hurt NDSU. Why is it hurting USD, SDSU, WIU?

[BisonFan02]

When you can't actually argue your point anymore bring up something unrelated.


Oh...wait...

That actually proves my point. Nothing about the MVC has hurt NDSU. Why is it hurting USD, SDSU, WIU?

Haha...holy **** clenzy, I'm just rattlin' your cage bud. xlolx I actually don't disagree with you much about the whole MVC/MVFC thing as far as what has gone on thus far. The only thing I would say is, as a fan of a Summit school, I would MUCH rather see the Summit league at the helm of football (rather than the "invisible" hand, so to speak, of the MVC) for the sheer fact that it could be used as a tool to recruit more stable Summit league members....not being able to provide a football home hurts Douple's ability to keep the conference together with the candidates available to him. The MVC does not have that problem.

[centennial]

Haha...holy **** clenzy, I'm just rattlin' your cage bud. xlolx I actually don't disagree with you much about the whole MVC/MVFC thing as far as what has gone on thus far. The only thing I would say is, as a fan of a Summit school, I would MUCH rather see the Summit league at the helm of football (rather than the "invisible" hand, so to speak, of the MVC) for the sheer fact that it could be used as a tool to recruit more stable Summit league members....not being able to provide a football home hurts Douple's ability to keep the conference together with the candidates available to him. The MVC does not have that problem.
Not sure if you care about the Summit being stable vs UND being in the Summit. Why would the MVC let the control of the football go? Not in their interest. MVC's interest is to keep it's football-basketball schools happy, not make the Summit more stable.

[nmatsen]

Not sure if you care about the Summit being stable vs UND being in the Summit. Why would the MVC let the control of the football go? Not in their interest. MVC's interest is to keep it's football-basketball schools happy, not make the Summit more stable.

If this were the case we wouldn't be the MVFC, we would just be the MVC. I understand trying to keep the brand of the Valley to elite schools / household names like Evansville and Bradley, but when they added Dallas Baptist (which sounds like a high school) as a baseball member I lost it. Just have football be a sport played in the Valley. It doesn't need to be a separate conference.

[Twentysix]

If this were the case we wouldn't be the MVFC, we would just be the MVC. I understand trying to keep the brand of the Valley to elite schools / household names like Evansville and Bradley, but when they added Dallas Baptist (which sounds like a high school) as a baseball member I lost it. Just have football be a sport played in the Valley. It doesn't need to be a separate conference.

lol, household names in Illinois and Iowa maybe. No one has ever heard of either of those schools once you are 500 miles from them. Ever. UCLA is a household name. Notre Dame is a household name. Harvard is a household name. Those are not household names.

[clenz]

lol, household names in Illinois and Iowa maybe. No one has ever heard of either of those schools once you are 500 miles from them. Ever. UCLA is a household name. Notre Dame is a household name. Harvard is a household name. Those are not household names.
Evansville might not be household (and it's not) but Bradley certainly is to anyone that follows basketball

[clenz]

If this were the case we wouldn't be the MVFC, we would just be the MVC. I understand trying to keep the brand of the Valley to elite schools / household names like Evansville and Bradley, but when they added Dallas Baptist (which sounds like a high school) as a baseball member I lost it. Just have football be a sport played in the Valley. It doesn't need to be a separate conference.
DBU was a very good baseball add for the conference. Their success the last 8 years, plus the location and resources they have was a no brainer.

You don't seem to have issues with University of Hartford, Stony Brook, SIU-Edwardsville or Maryland Baltimore County being associate members of the MVC

[eiu1999]

Whitlock seemed to play a much better game than his first two. EIU was committed to a more balanced run/pass attack and they found some success.

I didn't see the ISU defense get after him much, and the loss of Teddy Corwin is showing, but no excuses.

Probably the biggest blunder was trying to add more points at the end of the first half and the pic 6. You're up 24-14 w/ 22 seconds left and you get the ball after half. And you try to tack on more points when you still have to go 85 yards. Dumb play calling. Gave EIU life and let them back in the game.

Whether it was honoring longtime coach Bob Spoo or Hanging a banner for Mike Shanahan EIU played better. ISU didn't play down, still not sure who or what we are. But we are NOT the team from last year so it seems.


Yes, EIU did play better, but they are still closer to that WIU game than this ISU one.

The defense is far worse than expected and the OL and WR positions are very weak.

Makes for a long season. Oh and that kicker............

[AmsterBison]

Not sure if you care about the Summit being stable vs UND being in the Summit. Why would the MVC let the control of the football go? Not in their interest. MVC's interest is to keep it's football-basketball schools happy, not make the Summit more stable.

It's not necessarily going to up to the MVC.

[clenz]

Haha...holy **** clenzy, I'm just rattlin' your cage bud. xlolx I actually don't disagree with you much about the whole MVC/MVFC thing as far as what has gone on thus far. The only thing I would say is, as a fan of a Summit school, I would MUCH rather see the Summit league at the helm of football (rather than the "invisible" hand, so to speak, of the MVC) for the sheer fact that it could be used as a tool to recruit more stable Summit league members....not being able to provide a football home hurts Douple's ability to keep the conference together with the candidates available to him. The MVC does not have that problem.
There is no invisible hand controlling the MVFC from the MVC. You, and many NDSU fans, have this perception that Elgin is sitting at a marionette just controlling everything Patty V does. That simply isn't true - nor has it ever been true.


How can the Summit not provide a football home right now, but they could if Douple was in charge? They'd still need the same number of votes to get a member in - and guess what, the MVC still has more votes than the Summit (plus YSU is going to vote with the MVC when it comes to you (maybe not you but a NDSU fan) wanting to add freaking Northern Colorado.)

Wasn't it you who, during the basketball season, spent all season trying to tell me how stable the Summit is because it's NDSU, SDSU and then a bunch of teams that couldn't buy their way into a new conference if they tried? No one in the Summit is on any conferences short list. There is no fear of that conference destabilizing. ORU has jumped around so much that any conference is going to be wary of them going forward. Denver had a chance at the MVC, but wasn't willing to commit the resources needed to be in the conference. IUPUI and IPFW would struggle to find a new home if the Horizon of OVC didn't feel bad for them and take them in should the Summit implode. UNO? Please. WIU and USD are essentially the same and of no value to anyone outside of the Summit. Want to know why you aren't worried what the non-football schools think of football? Because the non-football schools you are with are barley D1 institutions and know they'd have no value to sell to another conference.


Do you want UND in The Summit? Why or why not? Does UND's hockey mentality cause you any concern with how they would fit into the Summit?

- - - Updated - - -


It's not necessarily going to up to the MVC.
You're right...because the MVC isn't in charge of the MVFC.

NDSU fans really seem to struggle with this.

[uni88]

Evansville might not be household (and it's not) but Bradley certainly is to anyone that follows basketball
Bradley still has the potential to put themselves back together but their history is less significant than that of the Big East teams that you think so poorly of and it's fading even faster.

Evansville is hardly a household name but they have had notoriety in the past from the plane crash, their short sleeved jerseys and the pimp they used to have as a mascot.

[clenz]

Bradley still has the potential to put themselves back together but their history is less significant than that of the Big East teams that you think so poorly of and it's fading even faster.

Evansville is hardly a household name but they have had notoriety in the past from the plane crash, their short sleeved jerseys and the pimp they used to have as a mascot.
Bradley certainly is on the fast track to nothing, but less than a decade ago they were in the S16.

The issue with the Big East teams right now, IMO, is that people see "Georgetown" and "St. Johns" and just assume they are a top 10 program. That simply isn't the case. Since 07 (a good year for Georgetown) they are 3-6 in the NCAA tournament. Yet they are treated like Duke. St. John's is 1-4 since the turn of the century with just 4 bids. DePaul is 2-6 since 1988 and no bids since 04. Seton Hall had a great run between 89-92...only been back 5 times since. Providence has 7 wins since 1987...(4 in 87 and 3 in 97). Zero wins other than those two years since 1974 and just 4 bids since the turn of the century (2 of them came after the split and Louisville, Cuse, UCONN, etc... had moved on.).

They are name teams, but they aren't what their name is at this point. That's what I'm saying.



P.S. Evansville still uses the pimp, unless that changed in the last 2 years.

[Sycamore62]

if you go to page 3 or so it shows the telecasts. most games on espn3. I guess ISUb will have a local crew do the games that dont have road teams bringing their own crew.
http://cdn.streamlinetechnologies.com/mvc/8F9BC8FE-6236-4932-A556-354A0B9290EE/MVFC_8-31-2015.pdf

[AmsterBison]

Do you want UND in The Summit? Why or why not? Does UND's hockey mentality cause you any concern with how they would fit into the Summit?

You're right...because the MVC isn't in charge of the MVFC.

NDSU fans really seem to struggle with this.

I can only speak for myself, but as long as UND is in the Big Sky, it means that they'll bleed money and never be a threat to NDSU in BB or FB, hockey or not. However, there is increasing pressure to help UND out by playing them every year in football and basketball... if NDSU is forced to do home and homes with them, UND might as well be in the same conference. However, given two options, UND seems hell bent on picking the one that most resembles a self-inflicted kick in the balls so I'd expect them to say no to a Summit invitation.

Anyway, the point I was making is that if the Summit schools feel the need, the league could sponsor football. In that case, MVC teams wouldn't get a vote - their part would be deciding whether or not to become affiliate members of the Summit.

[clenz]

I can only speak for myself, but as long as UND is in the Big Sky, it means that they'll bleed money and never be a threat to NDSU in BB or FB, hockey or not. However, there is increasing pressure to help UND out by playing them every year in football and basketball... if NDSU is forced to do home and homes with them, UND might as well be in the same conference. However, given two options, UND seems hell bent on picking the one that most resembles a self-inflicted kick in the balls so I'd expect them to say no to a Summit invitation.

Anyway, the point I was making is that if the Summit schools feel the need, the league could sponsor football. In that case, MVC teams wouldn't get a vote - their part would be deciding whether or not to become affiliate members of the Summit.
There are 4 Summit league teams.

Where are you gaining 2 more just for the AQ...also good luck running a conference on 6 teams.

[AmsterBison]

There are 4 Summit league teams.

Where are you gaining 2 more just for the AQ...also good luck running a conference on 6 teams.

The scenario I'm thinking of is that MVFC schools turn down UND. To help out UND, the Summit votes to sponsor football. At the point, the Summit would have five football-playing teams so it'd only take one more to get the AQ which could be an affiliate, one of three large MN D2s, or some team to be named later.

Like I said, it's not that likely for a number of reasons, but it's not out of the realm of possibility. So, hypothetically, MVC schools might want to consider that the Summit schools do have an alternative - like you said, good luck running the MVFC on 6 teams.

[centennial]

The scenario I'm thinking of is that MVFC schools turn down UND. To help out UND, the Summit vote to sponsor football. At the point, the Summit would have five football-playing teams so it'd only take one more to get the AQ, either an affiliate, one of three large MN D2s, or something like that.

Like I said, it's not that likely for a number of reasons, but it's not out of the realm of possibility. So before the MVC schools turn down UND, they might want to consider that the Summit-side of things does have some leverage - like you said, good luck running the MVFC on 6 teams.

This was called the great west.

[clenz]

The scenario I'm thinking of is that MVFC schools turn down UND. To help out UND, the Summit votes to sponsor football. At the point, the Summit would have five football-playing teams so it'd only take one more to get the AQ which could be an affiliate, one of three large MN D2s, or some team to be named later.

Like I said, it's not that likely for a number of reasons, but it's not out of the realm of possibility. So, hypothetically, MVC schools might want to consider that the Summit schools do have an alternative - like you said, good luck running the MVFC on 6 teams.
If I'm not mistaken I don't think you can just "start sponsoring football as a league"

That also sounds like like the Great West, which was as craptastic as it got when it came to scholarship football at that point.


I seeCentennial beat me to that

[AmsterBison]

This was called the great west.

No, it's entirely different. The Summit League is AQ home to the vast majority of SDSU, NDSU, USD, and Western Illinois athletics. If that home is endangered by some combination of events, I could see the League taking drastic measures to preserve it.

It'd be more accurate to say that it'd be the NCC 2.0.

That said, I could be engaging in a little clenz "The MVC is the king of all things" cage-rattling. :)

[clenz]

Again, why are NDSU fans so worried about the MVFC as it sits now?

It's only NDSU fans that are all up in arms about it. The conference has existed for 30 years. It's perfectly healthy

[centennial]

Again, why are NDSU fans so worried about the MVFC as it sits now?

It's only NDSU fans that are all up in arms about it. The conference has existed for 30 years. It's perfectly healthy

I have to agree. Let's find one or two basketball schools willing to move up. We aren't going to be two bids league anyway so what does it matter if we are considered low mid major or not. Easiest solution vs trying to get UND to move, which even they aren't really interested in.

[F'N Hawks]

I have to agree. Let's find one or two basketball schools willing to move up. We aren't going to be two bids league anyway so what does it matter if we are considered low mid major or not. Easiest solution vs trying to get UND to move, which even they aren't really interested in.

Douple calls every year, at least once. That is straight from the athletic department. But he never can deliver a plan for football.

He knows Gene is gone and getting UND in for baseball and basketball purposes is more of an option now. But he never seems to bring home the whole package so it becomes a short conversation.

[AmsterBison]

Douple calls every year, at least once. That is straight from the athletic department. But he never can deliver a plan for football.

Which is awesome to hear because I'm counting on the shortsighted ineptness of UND's athletic department. Despite how clenz is painting things, I really like the way things are. The MVFC is a great home for NDSU football.

[F'N Hawks]

Which is awesome to hear because I'm counting on the shortsighted ineptness of UND's athletic department. Despite how clenz is painting things, I really like the way things are. The MVFC is a great home for NDSU football.

What should UND be doing then?

[clenz]

Which is awesome to hear because I'm counting on the shortsighted ineptness of UND's athletic department. Despite how clenz is painting things, I really like the way things are. The MVFC is a great home for NDSU football.
I'm not painting anything.

Go look at how a good number (not all) of NDSU fans react to anything Patty V or the MVC does.

They seem 10000000000% convinced the MVC and Patty have it out for NDSU

The MVFC is in great health. It's been around for 30 years - not bad for a one sport conference. There's no reason for the Summit schools to get all pissy about anything to the point of the Summit thinking they need to pull away.

Just because teams in Illinois, Indiana and Ohio might not want another team or TWO (given the UNC talk) further away than the furthest outlier already doesn't mean anyone has it out for NDSU and only cares about the MVC.

It's actually quite the opposite because the MVC schools realize how quickly a conference can drop to 6 (already happened with the Gateway once) and be in danger if both sides don't want to play ball. The MVFC/MVC schools have a great appreciation for maintaining the MVFC than most NDSU fans could dream of.

- - - Updated - - -


What should UND be doing then?
Probably shouldn't have drug your feet the first time around and allowed USD in on their own.

UND really screwed themselves on that one

[F'N Hawks]

I'm not painting anything.
- - - Updated - - -


Probably shouldn't have drug your feet the first time around and allowed USD in on their own.

UND really screwed themselves on that one

That is not how it went down. At all.

Patty reacted to a late call from Douple AFTER UND told them they were going to the Big Sky because Patty said no to football. Then, Patty went against having a perfect 9 team setup and allowed USD in because the Summit sorely needed members (and still do). Its been laid out very well on Siouxsports. USD actually was set for the Big Sky as well for a short period of time.

UND went with the Big Sky first. They had no choice. Now Douple calls every year hoping to fix it.

[BisonFan02]

What should UND be doing then?

Drop football and join the Summit like UNO and Denver....not many would notice.

[goyotes]

That is not how it went down. At all.

Patty reacted to a late call from Douple AFTER UND told them they were going to the Big Sky because Patty said no to football. Then, Patty went against having a perfect 9 team setup and allowed USD in because the Summit sorely needed members (and still do). Its been laid out very well on Siouxsports. USD actually was set for the Big Sky as well for a short period of time.

UND went with the Big Sky first. They had no choice. Now Douple calls every year hoping to fix it.

If you and your friends ever set up a poker game, count me in.

[F'N Hawks]

If you and your friends ever set up a poker game, count me in.

Fair enough. Let us know USD's version of the events.

[mango43]

That is not how it went down. At all.

Patty reacted to a late call from Douple AFTER UND told them they were going to the Big Sky because Patty said no to football. Then, Patty went against having a perfect 9 team setup and allowed USD in because the Summit sorely needed members (and still do). Its been laid out very well on Siouxsports. USD actually was set for the Big Sky as well for a short period of time.

UND went with the Big Sky first. They had no choice. Now Douple calls every year hoping to fix it.


Can you actually prove that?

[F'N Hawks]

Can you actually prove that?

Does higher members of the athletic department telling me count? I didn't tape the conversation, no. So, no I cannot prove it.

[BisonBacker]

Again, why are NDSU fans so worried about the MVFC as it sits now?

It's only NDSU fans that are all up in arms about it. The conference has existed for 30 years. It's perfectly healthy

Well if it's so healthy why are UNI fans crapping the bed about FCOA and wanting to kick NDSU out for being the first on the MVFC to offer it?

[BisonBacker]

That is not how it went down. At all.

Patty reacted to a late call from Douple AFTER UND told them they were going to the Big Sky because Patty said no to football. Then, Patty went against having a perfect 9 team setup and allowed USD in because the Summit sorely needed members (and still do). Its been laid out very well on Siouxsports. USD actually was set for the Big Sky as well for a short period of time.

UND went with the Big Sky first. They had no choice. Now Douple calls every year hoping to fix it.


Oh how Douple must lose sleep at night....
This is great theater xpopcornx

[nmatsen]

lol, household names in Illinois and Iowa maybe. No one has ever heard of either of those schools once you are 500 miles from them. Ever. UCLA is a household name. Notre Dame is a household name. Harvard is a household name. Those are not household names.

Omg guys I was being sarcastic. I was basically saying that we have no reputation to protect, we might as well just call the MVFC the MVC...

[PantherRob82]

Well if it's so healthy why are UNI fans crapping the bed about FCOA and wanting to kick NDSU out for being the first on the MVFC to offer it?

Because message boards are a great indicator of how things work in real life. xrolleyesx

[centennial]

Drop football and join the Summit like UNO and Denver....not many would notice.
Lol. A grade trolling.

[jacksfan29]

That is not how it went down. At all.

Patty reacted to a late call from Douple AFTER UND told them they were going to the Big Sky because Patty said no to football. Then, Patty went against having a perfect 9 team setup and allowed USD in because the Summit sorely needed members (and still do). Its been laid out very well on Siouxsports. USD actually was set for the Big Sky as well for a short period of time.

UND went with the Big Sky first. They had no choice. Now Douple calls every year hoping to fix it.

You read too many SiouxVolley, Star2City, SiouxFan fantasy posts.

Douple calls every year? Really? I thought Douple and the UND administration hated each other. Who knew.

The Summit needs schools? Right now we are actually pretty stable. The RPI keeps going up and so far so good. It has ended up being a good home. Pretty sure SDSU/NDSU and USD are all happy with how things turned out. Do the eastern schools flirt with new conferences? Sure, but neither IUPUI or IPFW are going anywhere anytime soon. Would we flirt with the MVC if they came calling? Does our administration look dumb? Of course we would, as would NDSU, USD, UNO and Western. But are we actively trying to get into the MVC? No. By all accounts we are in a very good spot as is NDSU and USD.

As for USD, yes SDSU and NDSU wanted USD in the Summit and MVFC. Why wouldn't we? They were and will continue to be a great addition. They did flirt with the BSC. Fullerton, in his used car salesman way opened his mouth stating that USD was in. The only problem is USD had not agreed to join. They wanted into the Summit/MVFC and were continuing to talk with Douple and Patty as were the SDSU and NDSU administrations. The only schools not thrilled with the USD addition were the eastern schools. Thus the change in the annual scheduling.

UND was never, and may never get an invite to the MVFC. I think some big changes would have to occur for it to happen. Pretty sure two schools would need to leave for UND to get an invite.

The Summit? I think UND would get a fair shake and I think NDSU/SDSU and USD would support an invite. But would the others? Not so sure. I think the emphasis is on finding schools in the ORU and Denver areas. UNC would get automatic approval.

[Professor Chaos]

Its been laid out very well on Siouxsports.
Preposterous statement of the year candidate right here.

[Bison56]

Preposterous statement of the year candidate right here.

I second that.

[BisonBacker]

Preposterous statement of the year candidate right here.


I second that.
I'll make it a third vote.

[FargoBison]

There is no invisible hand controlling the MVFC from the MVC. You, and many NDSU fans, have this perception that Elgin is sitting at a marionette just controlling everything Patty V does. That simply isn't true - nor has it ever been true.



The problem with the MVC is that they do nothing for football, it isn't like the CAA where they two work to make each other stronger. That was the only point I was trying to get a across. I never meant to imply that Patty V is controlled by anyone but the presidents she works for.

I do wish the MVC would have a more positive view of FCS football, in my opinion it is of no threat at all to them. I would love to see something more like the CAA.

[FargoBison]

The Summit is perfectly stable right now, don't listen to ramblings of Sioux fans. There is no where for any school to go, most schools left in the league are happy with how things are being run. There was a period where a few schools were unhappy but they have left. Douple has done a tremendous job with the league.

I don't think UND was ever on the table for the MVFC, USD is a much better fit geographically and adding two Dakota schools was a non-starter. IMO they should have asked the Big Sky to let them in as a football only member and put the rest of their sports in the Summit when USD pulled out. Now they are stuck out on an island.

[MSUBear42]

Sorry, MVFC, for bringing down the collective GPI ratings.

You've been warned, in advance.

[BisonFan02]

Sorry, MVFC, for bringing down the collective GPI ratings.

You've been warned, in advance.

Assholes.... xlolx You can go to the Sunbelt now in shame....

[clenz]

The problem with the MVC is that they do nothing for football, it isn't like the CAA where they two work to make each other stronger. That was the only point I was trying to get a across. I never meant to imply that Patty V is controlled by anyone but the presidents she works for.

I do wish the MVC would have a more positive view of FCS football, in my opinion it is of no threat at all to them. I would love to see something more like the CAA.
What, pray tell, is the Summit actively doing to make the MVFC stronger?

BF02 tried bringing up that MVC schools are too focused on basketball, and yes we spend more than The Summit on basketball...we have too...or we end up like, well, The Summit in terms of competitiveness. It was easily proven that MVC schools spend more, in general on athletics.

Is attempting to bring in UND - who would be a bottom 2 team in this league - actually helping the league OR is it a selfish action, looking out for only the well being of the Summit (which is already stable)?

Fling poo against the wall all you want about the MVC, and it's schools. None of it is sticking thus far.

[OSBF]

Again, why are NDSU fans so worried about the MVFC as it sits now?

It's only NDSU fans that are all up in arms about it. The conference has existed for 30 years. It's perfectly healthy

In fact, it's SOOOOOOOOOOOOO healthy that there are folks on RBF that keep saying the entire conf is moving up to FBS as a group/unit

Even when someone explains to them that such a provision does not exist in the NCAA bylaws/procedures they bring it up ALL THE DAMM TIME

[OSBF]

I'm not sayin' that the MVC and MVFC necessarily must mirror each other, ever.

However i'll admit I would love to see NDSU and SDSU in the MVC

Either would bring more (currently) to the table, even though neither has the rich history and tradition that Loyola does

[BisonFan02]

What, pray tell, is the Summit actively doing to make the MVFC stronger?

BF02 tried bringing up that MVC schools are too focused on basketball, and yes we spend more than The Summit on basketball...we have too...or we end up like, well, The Summit in terms of competitiveness. It was easily proven that MVC schools spend more, in general on athletics.

Is attempting to bring in UND - who would be a bottom 2 team in this league - actually helping the league OR is it a selfish action, looking out for only the well being of the Summit (which is already stable)?

Fling poo against the wall all you want about the MVC, and it's schools. None of it is sticking thus far.

MVC schools with budgets per USA Today
UNI 17M
SIU 21M
ISUR 21M
ISUB 14M
MSU 15M

Summit schools with budgets per USA Today
UND 24M
NDSU 20M
SDSU 15M
USD 14.5M
WIU 12M

Horizon
YSU 14M

For discussion....I think USD's number has risen to 14.5M...not that this argument really means anything.

http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances/

[clenz]

I'm not sayin' that the MVC and MVFC necessarily must mirror each other, ever.

However i'll admit I would love to see NDSU and SDSU in the MVC

Either would bring more (currently) to the table, even though neither has the rich history and tradition that Loyola does
Illinois State is first at the table to take blame on that one.

Illinois State, Indiana State, SIU, and Evansville all bitched about travel distances....which is why we got freaking Loyola. Because it's in Illinois and short travel for all of them.

- - - Updated - - -


MVC schools with budgets per USA Today
UNI 17M
SIU 21M
ISUR 21M
ISUB 14M
MSU 15M

Summit schools with budgets per USA Today
UND 24M
NDSU 20M
SDSU 15M
USD 14.5M
WIU 12M

Horizon
YSU 14M

For discussion....I think USD's number has risen to 14.5M...not that this argument really means anything.

http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances/
My USD number came straight from the ADs mouth in an article back in the spring.

[MSUBear42]

However, with the MVC deal now requiring all MVC schools meeting ESPN quality standard for on campups productions (it was really ISUb, MSU and SIU that had the most issues)..

Where did we have issues?

Not disagreeing, just curious. We've consistently had 18+ basketball games televised locally and all football games televised locally?

[clenz]

.
http://volanteonline.com/2015/02/usd-athletic-department-least-funded-summit-league-missouri-valley-football-conference-since-d-transition/

USD’s total athletic department budget of roughly $9.4 million is about $6 million less than South Dakota State University’s total athletic budget, and about half of North Dakota State University’s.

“Believe me, if you’ve got the cheapest house, you don’t tell everybody that your house is the cheapest house. I mean, you dress it up as best you can and fix what you can when you can,” Herbster said. “And that’s kind of what we had done for a while, but it got to the point where you can’t do any more with what you have.”
USD President James Abbott said in addition to athletics, student activity support is also underfunded.
“We haven’t raised the fee as much as other institutions, and we haven’t asked the students to pay for the arena, for instance,” Abbott said. “We’ve concentrated on raising money to build the facilities, but we do need operating dollars.”

[MSUBear42]

Assholes.... xlolx You can go to the Sunbelt now in shame....

xnodx

You all should actually be thanking us... it's been a while since you've been able to circle an MVFC game as a 'known win.'

[BisonFan02]

Illinois State is first at the table to take blame on that one.

Illinois State, Indiana State, SIU, and Evansville all bitched about travel distances....which is why we got freaking Loyola. Because it's in Illinois and short travel for all of them.

- - - Updated - - -


My USD number came straight from the ADs mouth in an article back in the spring.

and mine came from the same USA Today source as the rest of them...that were received on an open records request. Choose whichever accounting exercise you want.

[clenz]

Where did we have issues?

Not disagreeing, just curious. We've consistently had 18+ basketball games televised locally and all football games televised locally?
The issue with MSU was picture/audio quality. Maybe it was because Mediacom was in charge of distribution but it was equivalent to watching a low res video on youtube shot on an early gen camera phone.

SIU had the same issues.

[OSBF]

Illinois State is first at the table to take blame on that one.

Illinois State, Indiana State, SIU, and Evansville all bitched about travel distances....which is why we got freaking Loyola. Because it's in Illinois and short travel for all of them.


I know

They felt like it was more important to look out for the $$$ in the AD's budget than to improve the MVC overall in the long run

Short-sighted approach where long term vision and leadership would have been the more appropriate response

[BisonFan02]

xnodx

You all should actually be thanking us... it's been a while since you've been able to circle an MVFC game as a 'known win.'

You haven't been watching the NDSU/USD games lately huh? :D xsmiley_wix

[BisonBacker]

I'm not sayin' that the MVC and MVFC necessarily must mirror each other, ever.

However i'll admit I would love to see NDSU and SDSU in the MVC

Either would bring more (currently) to the table, even though neither has the rich history and tradition that Loyola does

Hey careful there your going to get on Clenz's bad side. Shame on you for even thinking that NDSU or SDSU would do anything but make the MVC a cluster****.

[centennial]

Sorry, MVFC, for bringing down the collective GPI ratings.

You've been warned, in advance.

South Dakota is happy you taking their spot. You guys are probably the worst MVFC team in the last half decade.

[Sycamore62]

xnodx

You all should actually be thanking us... it's been a while since you've been able to circle an MVFC game as a 'known win.'

ive never even bought a writing instrument to make such circles

[REALBird]

How so Clenz? What do you have to support that ISU wanted Loyola anymore so than Bradley, Evansville, Drake or any of the other private schools?

[clenz]

How so Clenz? What do you have to support that ISU wanted Loyola anymore so than Bradley, Evansville, Drake or any of the other private schools?
I included Evansville in that list...did you read my post?

It's well documented across the MVC and MVFC that the Illinois schools absolutely despise having to do more than a very short flight or bus ride for their teams. The thought of adding a team in Tennessee, Oklahoma, Colorado (they ruled themselves out), etc... was never going to get enough support to pass a vote.

[Sycamore62]

I could almost guarantee we were on the list of teams that didnt want to travel.

[clenz]

I could almost guarantee we were on the list of teams that didnt want to travel.
The list I know of is ISUr, ISUb, SIU, Evansville and Bradley is about a 50/50 split. It's one of the driving reasons the MVC tournament will almost never leave St Louis for Kansas City. Every single one of those schools have "threatened" that their fans won't stand for it and won't travel that far.

It's not going to be in a news article in a paper, but those schools are well known for taking that stance.

It's also a large reason UNI gets to travel to ISUr, SDSU and NDSU in the same year for football. In order to get USD added a provision was needed for ISUr, ISUb and YSU to keep them from traveling to the Dakota's more than once per year. UNI is in the middle and good with the travel and paid for it.

[ST_Lawson]

xnodx

You all should actually be thanking us... it's been a while since you've been able to circle an MVFC game as a 'known win.'

Of course...right when you're off our schedule for a couple of years.

[ValleyChamp]

The problem with the MVC is that they do nothing for football, it isn't like the CAA where they two work to make each other stronger. That was the only point I was trying to get a across. I never meant to imply that Patty V is controlled by anyone but the presidents she works for.

I do wish the MVC would have a more positive view of FCS football, in my opinion it is of no threat at all to them. I would love to see something more like the CAA.

What exactly do you want or expect them to "do" other than whats already been done?

The CAA has essentially crumbled apart from its glory of the previous decade so I have no idea why that is the conference model that you envy.

As it stands right now, the MVFC is very clearly the best league in the country. Sounds like a lot of needless and baseless bitching if you ask me.

[Sycamore62]

Of course...right when you're off our schedule for a couple of years.

yeah we got USD off the schedule for 2 years.

of course we dont have to be a team that loses to them either so I guess it goes both ways.

[clenz]

What exactly do you want or expect them to "do" other than whats already been done?

The CAA has essentially crumbled apart from its glory of the previous decade so I have no idea why that is the conference model that you envy.

As it stands right now, the MVFC is very clearly the best league in the country. Sounds like a lot of needless and baseless bitching if you ask me.
That's kind of the fun part about that comparison.

CAA basketball has gone from a 10-12 rated basketball conference to a conference that has finished as low as 24th in the last years in RPI.

CAA football has gone from, by far, the best in the FCS to 3rd...almost 4th.

On the non-football side they've lost George Mason, Georiga State, ODU, Richmond, and VCU (all in the last 5 years) and replaced them with College of Charleston and Elon.


They've been forced to replace ODU football, who grew into a top 5-10 program, with Elon and Albany. The top of the league is still okay, but the bottom of that league has fallen WAY off.

They CAA has had multiple teams CUT their programs in the last 10-15 years because admins in the NE pretty much hate college sports. Their policies are killing (litterally in the case of Hoftstra and Northeastern and figuratively in cases like UD) their programs.

Meanwhile over that same time the MVFC added NDSU and SDSU (and USD). Has upped OOC scheduling. Has become the premier FCS league. Is now getting 5 teams into the playoffs. Is performing spectacularly in OOC games. On the MVC side it struggled right after losing Creighton (and UNI losing Doug Mc$ to Creighton) but is rebounding and has nearly as much talent as it had when it was getting 4 NCAA bids (if the coaches would get the hell out of the way of the players). The Summit is extremely stable right now (again, due to the schools not being on any other conferences radar for the most part). The profile is grow with NDSU/SDSU being competitive. It's actually a head of the CAA recently.

If you want to emmulate the CAA and have the MVC just "admit" to running the show, and that's your biggest gripe, then that goes to show there is nothing wrong with the set up. Just as their hasn't been for the last 30 years.


If you want to emulate the CAA in terms of policies, not being able to keep programs happy, not being able to keep top programs, etc... then......well.....

[clenz]

I know

They felt like it was more important to look out for the $$$ in the AD's budget than to improve the MVC overall in the long run

Short-sighted approach where long term vision and leadership would have been the more appropriate response
100% agreed.

It's why Creighton felt the need to leave, partially. It's why WSU wants to leave. Everything from most of the schools is short sided.

Should WSU leave and UNI can't ride a coattail to a league with football (I'm thinking AAC/CUSA) I'm 100% on board with saying "screw the private school assholes" and getting NDSU and SDSU involved with UNI to make a push for somewhere. Contrary to what NDSU fans think of my opinion, I've only ever talked about the conference view of things.

Thankfully, as of now, WSU has no options. If someone other than UNI can step up in the conference and make waves nationally it would help ease WSU's tensions.

[Yote 53]

100% agreed.

It's why Creighton felt the need to leave, partially. It's why WSU wants to leave. Everything from most of the schools is short sided.

Should WSU leave and UNI can't ride a coattail to a league with football (I'm thinking AAC/CUSA) I'm 100% on board with saying "screw the private school assholes" and getting NDSU and SDSU involved with UNI to make a push for somewhere. Contrary to what NDSU fans think of my opinion, I've only ever talked about the conference view of things.

Thankfully, as of now, WSU has no options. If someone other than UNI can step up in the conference and make waves nationally it would help ease WSU's tensions.

The bolded is key. Here is my take and where I try to take the pulse of NDSU fans.

There is a feeling amongst some Summit fans that the MVC is trying to keep the conference (and by extension the schools) down. They do this by controlling the football side of the operation in the MVFC which NDSU, SDSU, WIU, and USD hold so dear. The MVC knows that these schools will not do anything to rock the boat because the MVFC is such a good conference. Yet at the same time we are kind of peeved that they are using it to keep the MVC ahead of the Summit in the pecking order. Ok, UNI fans, you can laugh at that. You can point to RPI's, basketball budgets, etc. I will point to schools like Creighton leaving and Loyola being added. The MVC is on the decline and the Summit is on the rise. I am talking about vision, about potential, and about the future here. The Dakota schools are in build, build, build mode, both in facilities and in budgets. We're pushing the competitive level by building infrastrucutres, increasing budgets, increasing recruiting and offering things like FCOA. (This is the point where you laugh at USD's on field results, but, if you are paying attention you would see that USD has had strong Summit performances in all other sports. Basketball is on the rise and going to get even better when the new facility opens. We have one of the best Track & Field programs in the midwest. WBB is competing for conference titles. The only sport that is lagging is football, and that is being fixed as we speak. I listened to USD President Abbott speak at a function this weekend and the type of numbers he was throwing around are large $$$ figures. USD is going all in.)

With the Dakota schools (and I will include UND here) you have state institutions that stayed out of the D1 game for too long. Now that we all have a taste of D1 we want more. The MVC schools have to see that, have to see what is happening and how the landscape is shifting and need to keep us in check, and they are using the MVC/MVFC relationship to do just that. You're right, they will never let UND in without a catastrophic change to the MVFC because if they do they will join the Summit. A Summit of UND, NDSU, SDSU, USD, ORU, Denver, and even UNO as a core is dangerous and is a threat to the mid-major dominance of the MVC in this area of the country. Give these schools a decade with no changes to the current landscape and see how the balance of power will shift. Bring in the expected shift to the landscape of D1 football and I think we have the makings of something very turbulent that will effect the non-football schools of the MVC. If that happens, schools like UNI are going to need to make a choice about which direction they want to go. Stay in the MVC which is a basketball first conference, or join the Dakota schools in a G5/Second Tier D1 football conference. Maybe it ends up being a conferecne centered around the Dakota/Montana/Idaho schools that we like to talk about and how it would make such a fantastic conference. A seismic shift to D1 football could create an environment for a scenario like that to happen.

[ST_Lawson]

yeah we got USD off the schedule for 2 years.

of course we dont have to be a team that loses to them either so I guess it goes both ways.

Then again, we had NDSU off our schedule the two years before that (championship years #2 and #3)...so...you know....tradeoffs.

[penguinpower]

That's kind of the fun part about that comparison.

CAA basketball has gone from a 10-12 rated basketball conference to a conference that has finished as low as 24th in the last years in RPI.

CAA football has gone from, by far, the best in the FCS to 3rd...almost 4th.

On the non-football side they've lost George Mason, Georiga State, ODU, Richmond, and VCU (all in the last 5 years) and replaced them with College of Charleston and Elon.


They've been forced to replace ODU football, who grew into a top 5-10 program, with Elon and Albany. The top of the league is still okay, but the bottom of that league has fallen WAY off.

They CAA has had multiple teams CUT their programs in the last 10-15 years because admins in the NE pretty much hate college sports. Their policies are killing (litterally in the case of Hoftstra and Northeastern and figuratively in cases like UD) their programs.

Meanwhile over that same time the MVFC added NDSU and SDSU (and USD). Has upped OOC scheduling. Has become the premier FCS league. Is now getting 5 teams into the playoffs. Is performing spectacularly in OOC games. On the MVC side it struggled right after losing Creighton (and UNI losing Doug Mc$ to Creighton) but is rebounding and has nearly as much talent as it had when it was getting 4 NCAA bids (if the coaches would get the hell out of the way of the players). The Summit is extremely stable right now (again, due to the schools not being on any other conferences radar for the most part). The profile is grow with NDSU/SDSU being competitive. It's actually a head of the CAA recently.

If you want to emmulate the CAA and have the MVC just "admit" to running the show, and that's your biggest gripe, then that goes to show there is nothing wrong with the set up. Just as their hasn't been for the last 30 years.


If you want to emulate the CAA in terms of policies, not being able to keep programs happy, not being able to keep top programs, etc... then......well.....


Don't tell Craig Haley and the Stats people your take on CAA Football. They would disagree strongly based on their articles. They say that it is the deepest conference

[Missingnumber7]

Don't tell Craig Haley and the Stats people your take on CAA Football. They would disagree strongly based on their articles. They say that it is the deepest conference

Because they don't pay much attention to anything west of Ohio. If they watched all of FCS football they might have a greater appreciation for MVFC/Southland/Big Sky

[F'N Hawks]

The bolded is key. Here is my take and where I try to take the pulse of NDSU fans.

There is a feeling amongst some Summit fans that the MVC is trying to keep the conference (and by extension the schools) down. They do this by controlling the football side of the operation in the MVFC which NDSU, SDSU, WIU, and USD hold so dear. The MVC knows that these schools will not do anything to rock the boat because the MVFC is such a good conference. Yet at the same time we are kind of peeved that they are using it to keep the MVC ahead of the Summit in the pecking order. Ok, UNI fans, you can laugh at that. You can point to RPI's, basketball budgets, etc. I will point to schools like Creighton leaving and Loyola being added. The MVC is on the decline and the Summit is on the rise. I am talking about vision, about potential, and about the future here. The Dakota schools are in build, build, build mode, both in facilities and in budgets. We're pushing the competitive level by building infrastrucutres, increasing budgets, increasing recruiting and offering things like FCOA. (This is the point where you laugh at USD's on field results, but, if you are paying attention you would see that USD has had strong Summit performances in all other sports. Basketball is on the rise and going to get even better when the new facility opens. We have one of the best Track & Field programs in the midwest. WBB is competing for conference titles. The only sport that is lagging is football, and that is being fixed as we speak. I listened to USD President Abbott speak at a function this weekend and the type of numbers he was throwing around are large $$$ figures. USD is going all in.)

With the Dakota schools (and I will include UND here) you have state institutions that stayed out of the D1 game for too long. Now that we all have a taste of D1 we want more. The MVC schools have to see that, have to see what is happening and how the landscape is shifting and need to keep us in check, and they are using the MVC/MVFC relationship to do just that. You're right, they will never let UND in without a catastrophic change to the MVFC because if they do they will join the Summit. A Summit of UND, NDSU, SDSU, USD, ORU, Denver, and even UNO as a core is dangerous and is a threat to the mid-major dominance of the MVC in this area of the country. Give these schools a decade with no changes to the current landscape and see how the balance of power will shift. Bring in the expected shift to the landscape of D1 football and I think we have the makings of something very turbulent that will effect the non-football schools of the MVC. If that happens, schools like UNI are going to need to make a choice about which direction they want to go. Stay in the MVC which is a basketball first conference, or join the Dakota schools in a G5/Second Tier D1 football conference. Maybe it ends up being a conferecne centered around the Dakota/Montana/Idaho schools that we like to talk about and how it would make such a fantastic conference. A seismic shift to D1 football could create an environment for a scenario like that to happen.

I like the way you think. Would it be the old NCC in a way - yes. But the old NCC was pretty damn good at a lot of sports.

[BisonFan02]

I like the way you think. Would it be the old NCC in a way - yes. But the old NCC was pretty damn good at a lot of sports.

Topical.....skip to the 1 minute mark if you want.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WA7zQp2sYaA

05/19/2000 in Alexandria, MN.......

[jacksfan29]

The reality is that all the talk on here about the MVFC, MVC and Summit is just that, talk. Until the P5 conferences decide what they intend to do it will be status quo. And in all honesty, right now the status quo is pretty good. If/when the big boys take their FB and leave the G5 schools to fend for themselves there will be a lot of conference changes. From an SDSU perspective, I just want our administration to be ready to make the moves they need to when the time comes. So far, so good. Justin Sell was a great catch, thanks UNI!

Where it will get really interesting, what does a school like Wichita do when FB takes over the world?

[BisonFan02]

The reality is that all the talk on here about the MVFC, MVC and Summit is just that, talk. Until the P5 conferences decide what they intend to do it will be status quo. And in all honesty, right now the status quo is pretty good. If/when the big boys take their FB and leave the G5 schools to fend for themselves there will be a lot of conference changes. From an SDSU perspective, I just want our administration to be ready to make the moves they need to when the time comes. So far, so good. Justin Sell was a great catch, thanks UNI!

Where it will get really interesting, what does a school like Wichita do when FB takes over the world?

Add football and join the Big 12.... :D xrotatehx

[Bisonator]

Not sure what's with all the bashing and mashing of conferences in here. I don't have time to go back and pick up on it all. Anyway I think those who seem to want UND in the Summit League need to realize there is nothing stopping UND from getting into the Summit League right now except their own pride and stubbornness. They could easily request an invite and see if the BSC would allow them to remain as a football only member like CP and CD. My guess is the BSC would be in favor getting rid of the travel expenses for all sports. This is almost such a no brainer that there is no way UND will seek it. They much prefer to lose money while saving face! xlolx

[jacksfan29]

In hindsight, one wonders if anyone at Wichita kicks themselves for dropping the sport. It has helped the MVC stay pretty much intact. If WSU had FB they would likely be in the AAC. Minus the sport, they really don't have any place to go.


Add football and join the Big 12.... :D xrotatehx

[PantherRob82]

The bolded is key. Here is my take and where I try to take the pulse of NDSU fans.

There is a feeling amongst some Summit fans that the MVC is trying to keep the conference (and by extension the schools) down. They do this by controlling the football side of the operation in the MVFC which NDSU, SDSU, WIU, and USD hold so dear. The MVC knows that these schools will not do anything to rock the boat because the MVFC is such a good conference. Yet at the same time we are kind of peeved that they are using it to keep the MVC ahead of the Summit in the pecking order. Ok, UNI fans, you can laugh at that. You can point to RPI's, basketball budgets, etc. I will point to schools like Creighton leaving and Loyola being added. The MVC is on the decline and the Summit is on the rise. I am talking about vision, about potential, and about the future here. The Dakota schools are in build, build, build mode, both in facilities and in budgets. We're pushing the competitive level by building infrastrucutres, increasing budgets, increasing recruiting and offering things like FCOA. (This is the point where you laugh at USD's on field results, but, if you are paying attention you would see that USD has had strong Summit performances in all other sports. Basketball is on the rise and going to get even better when the new facility opens. We have one of the best Track & Field programs in the midwest. WBB is competing for conference titles. The only sport that is lagging is football, and that is being fixed as we speak. I listened to USD President Abbott speak at a function this weekend and the type of numbers he was throwing around are large $$$ figures. USD is going all in.)

With the Dakota schools (and I will include UND here) you have state institutions that stayed out of the D1 game for too long. Now that we all have a taste of D1 we want more. The MVC schools have to see that, have to see what is happening and how the landscape is shifting and need to keep us in check, and they are using the MVC/MVFC relationship to do just that. You're right, they will never let UND in without a catastrophic change to the MVFC because if they do they will join the Summit. A Summit of UND, NDSU, SDSU, USD, ORU, Denver, and even UNO as a core is dangerous and is a threat to the mid-major dominance of the MVC in this area of the country. Give these schools a decade with no changes to the current landscape and see how the balance of power will shift. Bring in the expected shift to the landscape of D1 football and I think we have the makings of something very turbulent that will effect the non-football schools of the MVC. If that happens, schools like UNI are going to need to make a choice about which direction they want to go. Stay in the MVC which is a basketball first conference, or join the Dakota schools in a G5/Second Tier D1 football conference. Maybe it ends up being a conferecne centered around the Dakota/Montana/Idaho schools that we like to talk about and how it would make such a fantastic conference. A seismic shift to D1 football could create an environment for a scenario like that to happen.

I love the Dakota schools, but that post left me laughing. How does the MVC/MVFC relationship keep the Dakota schools in check?

[PantherRob82]

In hindsight, one wonders if anyone at Wichita kicks themselves for dropping the sport. It has helped the MVC stay pretty much intact. If WSU had FB they would likely be in the ACC. Minus the sport, they really don't have any place to go.

The ACC? That would be an odd footprint.

[Yote 53]

The reality is that all the talk on here about the MVFC, MVC and Summit is just that, talk. Until the P5 conferences decide what they intend to do it will be status quo. And in all honesty, right now the status quo is pretty good. If/when the big boys take their FB and leave the G5 schools to fend for themselves there will be a lot of conference changes. From an SDSU perspective, I just want our administration to be ready to make the moves they need to when the time comes. So far, so good. Justin Sell was a great catch, thanks UNI!

Where it will get really interesting, what does a school like Wichita do when FB takes over the world?

Agree, it is all talk. I stated as much that the real shake-up will begin when the P5 decide what course of action they are going to take, if any. Maybe it remains the status quo?

SDSU is putting themselves in position with the upgrades they are making. USD sees the landscape and is preparing as well, as is NDSU.

What does a school like Wichita think? They have a lot to lose. Don't you think that maybe they are what I was alluding to when I said the MVC is keeping control of things and the Summit schools in check by using the MVFC? Millions of dollars are on the line. If these people in positions of power aren't playing these types of games or moving themselves into position for the future then they are going to get steamrolled and left behind. Not sure about UND but people at USD don't want that happening again.

Also agree that the MVFC is the highest quality FCS conference in the country and we're all in pretty good spots right now since we are a part of it.

[PantherRob82]

What does a school like Wichita think? They have a lot to lose. Don't you think that maybe they are what I was alluding to when I said the MVC is keeping control of things and the Summit schools in check by using the MVFC? Millions of dollars are on the line. If these people in positions of power aren't playing these types of games or moving themselves into position for the future then they are going to get steamrolled and left behind. Not sure about UND but people at USD don't want that happening again.


This makes no sense. What is Wichita worried about? You still haven't explained how the MVFC keeps the Dakotas in check.

[Yote 53]

I love the Dakota schools, but that post left me laughing. How does the MVC/MVFC relationship keep the Dakota schools in check?

Control of football keeps the Summit League in check. If UND were let in to the MVFC it would solidify the Summit League permanently. As it is right now the conference is on safe footing, but put the Dakota 4 as the backbone of the Summit along with WIU, UNO, ORU, and Denver and you take away the uncertainty of what is going on with the Indiana schools, etc. A rock solid Summit League is a threat to the MVC, in the future. A Summit League permanently in flux keeps them in there place and keeps us needing the MVC fotoball schools in the MVFC instead of calling some shots on our own.

As it was you let USD into the MVFC out of self preservation. USD knew we had a Big Sky invite. We knew that if we went the Summit was ready to implode. Alot of people in the state did not want to see that for SDSU. Frankly, I don't think the USD people wanted to hurt SDSU either. We played the cards we did because the goal was to be in a midwest based conference all along and the MVFC is the best football conference there is in the FCS. What would have happened if USD went to the Big Sky is NDSU and SDSU would have eventually ended up there too and Fullerton would have had his super conference with East and West divisions. The MVFC would have been down 2 more members and severely neutered with YSU looking to the CAA, Mo State to the Belt, and WIU most likely to the OVC. Securing USD held everything together, keeping UND in limbo keeps everybody in check.

[PantherRob82]

The Summit is not a threat to the MVC. xlolx

The rest of that is a funny conspiracy theory.

[Yote 53]

This makes no sense. What is Wichita worried about? You still haven't explained how the MVFC keeps the Dakotas in check.

Wichita should be worried about what conference they end up in a college landscape where conference affiliations are decided by schools with football programs. What major conference is going to house their basketball program in this area of the country without a football program? It's the Big East issue all over again. The MVC is keeping it in check by keeping a balance of power in the conference. That balance of power is also predicated on mainting a balnce of power in the MVFC between Summti football schools and MVC football schools.

Simply put, what would UNI do if they found out tomorrow the the MVFC had imploded and they had to find a home for football? Do you think it would affect their other sports and the MVC?

[OSBF]

Once and for all folks, not a difficult concept.

The MVC and the MVFC are not the same conference.

The MVC and the MVFC are separate, distinct, and unique conferences.

Dare I say they are un-related.

[Yote 53]

The Summit is not a threat to the MVC. xlolx


You're right. Today it is not. What about 10-20 years from now though? Some of us are expanding our budgets and building athletic infrastructure like crazy. Others think we should have a conference rule limiting the giving of FCOA. Which side is your school on right now? Where is it headed in the future?

[jacksfan29]

The ACC? That would be an odd footprint.

AAC, for some reason the edit didn't save.

[Panther-State]

You're right. Today it is not. What about 10-20 years from now though? Some of us are expanding our budgets and building athletic infrastructure like crazy. Others think we should have a conference rule limiting the giving of FCOA. Which side is your school on right now? Where is it headed in the future?

In 10-20 years from now the oil may be all dried up and the Dakota schools (at the least the northern ones) may be slashing budgets like crazy. Speculative evidence is not good evidence.

[BisonFan02]

In 10-20 years from now the oil may be all dried up and the Dakota schools (at the least the northern ones) may be slashing budgets like crazy. Speculative evidence is not good evidence.

To be fair (not going to touch this argument our fellow USD fan is making), but oil money has absolutely nothing to do with the athletic budgets at the Dakota schools. You would be better off making the argument about the farm income decline having an effect on the land grant schools (NDSU and SDSU) more so than the oil one.

[clenz]

Man I wish I was at a computer to take the time to respond to things.

Yote 53 strikes me as a flat earther, never landed on the moon, type guy with all these conspiracy theories

[goyotes]

Man I wish I was at a computer to take the time to respond to things.

Yote 53 strikes me as a flat earther, never landed on the moon, type guy with all these conspiracy theories

When you can't win the argument, attack the person.

[BisonFan02]

Man I wish I was at a computer to take the time to respond to things.

Yote 53 strikes me as a flat earther, never landed on the moon, type guy with all these conspiracy theories

Oh....BS. You guys should just bow down to your FCOA offering Summit League school overlords and kiss our nattys...bunch of poors... xlolx

[jacksfan29]

Control of football keeps the Summit League in check. If UND were let in to the MVFC it would solidify the Summit League permanently. As it is right now the conference is on safe footing, but put the Dakota 4 as the backbone of the Summit along with WIU, UNO, ORU, and Denver and you take away the uncertainty of what is going on with the Indiana schools, etc. A rock solid Summit League is a threat to the MVC, in the future. A Summit League permanently in flux keeps them in there place and keeps us needing the MVC fotoball schools in the MVFC instead of calling some shots on our own.

As it was you let USD into the MVFC out of self preservation. USD knew we had a Big Sky invite. We knew that if we went the Summit was ready to implode. Alot of people in the state did not want to see that for SDSU. Frankly, I don't think the USD people wanted to hurt SDSU either. We played the cards we did because the goal was to be in a midwest based conference all along and the MVFC is the best football conference there is in the FCS. What would have happened if USD went to the Big Sky is NDSU and SDSU would have eventually ended up there too and Fullerton would have had his super conference with East and West divisions. The MVFC would have been down 2 more members and severely neutered with YSU looking to the CAA, Mo State to the Belt, and WIU most likely to the OVC. Securing USD held everything together, keeping UND in limbo keeps everybody in check.

Some of what you have to say is correct, some of it may be a bit self serving. The reality is USD needed the Summit/MVFC. UND has a lot more money than USD. The travel alone to the BSC schools would have kept USD in D1 purgatory for a long time. Did we want USD in the Summit/MVFC? Yes, so did UNI and NDSU. It made sense. Did USD use the BSC to leverage membership, yep. It was a smart move, a very smart move. Did Fullerton want USD/UND into the BSC. Oh yes he did. That's where it gets interesting because you are correct. Fullerton wanted the four Dakota schools together. The two South Dakota schools are far more tied together than the North Dakota schools. I think SDSU would have had to look hard at BSC membership if USD had gone.

Where do I think you are way off base? I don't believe for a second the MVC is controlling the MVFC. I don't see the benefit to them. The MVC is a completely separate entity with their own offices, commissioner, etc. I really wish the Gateway name would have stayed. It would be less confusing. The MVC has their own problems, I'm personally glad to let them deal with them.

The Summit is on its way up and has improved dramatically since we joined. It is more stable today than it has been in its history. Douple was smart, he saw that the larger state sponsored schools in the Dakotas were his ticket and he is riding it. Look at the conference championships. How many small conferences are putting 10K in the seats for their women's championship game? Where we are in 10 years? Who knows. I don't think it will be the Missouri Valley. I still think we go west. But hey, I live in Colorado and would prefer SDSU travel my direction.

[BisonFan02]

Summit League Football:

NDSU
SDSU
USD
UND
WIU
UNO (yup...pipe dream...but so is this idea right now)
UNC

and add 2 more to take it to 9 teams...8 game conference schedule

EIU?
UNI, SIU or other now MVFC looking for homes....

[Yote 53]

Where do I think you are way off base? I don't believe for a second the MVC is controlling the MVFC. I don't see the benefit to them. The MVC is a completely separate entity with their own offices, commissioner, etc. I really wish the Gateway name would have stayed. It would be less confusing. The MVC has their own problems, I'm personally glad to let them deal with them.


Controlling in a machiavellian sort of way? No probably not. I don't see any godfather pulling the strings. Controlling in that the MVFC won't invite UND? Yes. Definitely. Take a poll of all MVFC presidents right now regarding a UND invite to the MVFC and I bet they fall on MVC and Summit lines (with YSU going with the MVC schools). UND to the MVFC makes for a healthy, rock solid Summit and shifts the balance of power in teh MFVC to the Summit schools. In that way, yes, the MVC schools are keeping the Summit schools in check.

[Yote 53]

Some of what you have to say is correct, some of it may be a bit self serving. The reality is USD needed the Summit/MVFC. UND has a lot more money than USD. The travel alone to the BSC schools would have kept USD in D1 purgatory for a long time. Did we want USD in the Summit/MVFC? Yes, so did UNI and NDSU. It made sense. Did USD use the BSC to leverage membership, yep. It was a smart move, a very smart move. Did Fullerton want USD/UND into the BSC. Oh yes he did. That's where it gets interesting because you are correct. Fullerton wanted the four Dakota schools together. The two South Dakota schools are far more tied together than the North Dakota schools. I think SDSU would have had to look hard at BSC membership if USD had gone.


I never admitted otherwise. I said the goal all along for USD was a midwest based conference as it was the best fit, and we played our hand right to get it. On the flipside though, a Big Sky invite was better than our current situation in the Great West with no real conference invite. Is the MFVC/Summit combo better? Absolutely.

Everything I said about Fullerton's play is true as you acknowledged. My question is where would UNI (especially) be right now if that scenario had played out. I'm guessing not in a very good position. Best case scenario in a 6 team football conference waiting for the other shoe to drop (YSU to the CAA).

[OSBF]

Controlling in a machiavellian sort of way? No probably not. I don't see any godfather pulling the strings. Controlling in that the MVFC won't invite UND? Yes. Definitely. Take a poll of all MVFC presidents right now regarding a UND invite to the MVFC and I bet they fall on MVC and Summit lines (with YSU going with the MVC schools). UND to the MVFC makes for a healthy, rock solid Summit and shifts the balance of power in teh MFVC to the Summit schools. In that way, yes, the MVC schools are keeping the Summit schools in check.

Did Coprich sell you some of the good stuff from his personal stash?

[Yote 53]

Did Coprich sell you some of the good stuff from his personal stash?


I was going to, but the black helicopters and drones circling overhead scared me away from meeting him at the buy site.

[centennial]

Did Coprich sell you some of the good stuff from his personal stash?

I thought he was going to stop selling?

[Sycamore62]

I thought he was going to stop selling?

NO, just stop getting caught

[Sycamore62]

you can tell its the bye week between non-conference and conference play.

[CappinHard]

you can tell its the bye week between non-conference and conference play.

This. Some of it is entertaining, but most of it is speculative nonsense. Speaking of conference play... When is the last time NDSU was technically an underdog going into in a game? Assuming SDSU takes care of business this week, we will be looking at Sagarin favoring SDSU for sure, and possibly Vegas. Stage set. Now, I just hope SDSU delivers on said stage.

[centennial]

This. Some of it is entertaining, but most of it is speculative nonsense. Speaking of conference play... When is the last time NDSU was technically an underdog going into in a game? Assuming SDSU takes care of business this week, we will be looking at Sagarin favoring SDSU for sure, and possibly Vegas. Stage set. Now, I just hope SDSU delivers on said stage.
Probably some games in the 2011, 2010 season and against K State.

[CappinHard]

Probably some games in the 2011, 2010 season and against K State.

Yeah, I guess I was curious about the last time they were an underdog against FCS.

[jacksfan29]

you can tell its the bye week between non-conference and conference play.

Hey, speak for yourself. We actually have a game this weekend. And they beat Notre Dame last weekend.xsmiley_wix

[PantherRob82]

Controlling in a machiavellian sort of way? No probably not. I don't see any godfather pulling the strings. Controlling in that the MVFC won't invite UND? Yes. Definitely. Take a poll of all MVFC presidents right now regarding a UND invite to the MVFC and I bet they fall on MVC and Summit lines (with YSU going with the MVC schools). UND to the MVFC makes for a healthy, rock solid Summit and shifts the balance of power in teh MFVC to the Summit schools. In that way, yes, the MVC schools are keeping the Summit schools in check.

This is completely different than what you have been saying. The MVC teams in the MVFC voting that same is 100% different than the MVC using the MVFC to keep that Dakota schools from rising to success. I'm not sure where UNI would vote on UND, but to speculate we would vote MVC party line is goofy since we were in favor of the other theee Dakotas.

[BisonTru]

Yeah, I guess I was curious about the last time they were an underdog against FCS.

I believe we were a small 4 point favorite in the '11 championship vs. SHSU. Might have to go back to EWU 2010 to find a game we were the underdog.

Lets knock off the rabbits!!

[clenz]

This is completely different than what you have been saying. The MVC teams in the MVFC voting that same is 100% different than the MVC using the MVFC to keep that Dakota schools from rising to success. I'm not sure where UNI would vote on UND, but to speculate we would vote MVC party line is goofy since we were in favor of the other theee Dakotas.
I'm not sure the MVC would give a flying **** about UND in the summit.

They didn't about NDSU, SDSU and USD

[Professor Chaos]

This. Some of it is entertaining, but most of it is speculative nonsense. Speaking of conference play... When is the last time NDSU was technically an underdog going into in a game? Assuming SDSU takes care of business this week, we will be looking at Sagarin favoring SDSU for sure, and possibly Vegas. Stage set. Now, I just hope SDSU delivers on said stage.
Well, you guys are due ;)

[The Yo Show]

Man, there is evidently much more intricacies regarding the MVFC and MVC than I ever thought possible.

[clenz]

Man, there is evidently much more intricacies regarding the MVFC and MVC than I ever thought possible.
The funny thing is, there isn't.

[wow]

I'm not sure the MVC would give a flying **** about UND in the summit.

They didn't about NDSU, SDSU and USD

Don't you think UND in the Summit could destabilize the MVFC a bit? As in, the Summit would be very close to offering football. The MVC may not care, but I have to think MVC schools that offer football might get a little anxious.

[goyotes]

The prevailing opinion is that the only way that UND will leave the Big Sky to join the Summit is if they also gain admittance to the MVFC for football.

[The Yo Show]

The funny thing is, there isn't.

I was joking mostly. Although, some of the ideas here seem interesting without any real knowledge of their claims.

[mmiller_34]

The Summit League is getting better each year. The Dakota schools make a difference. Adding UND and combining all 4 Dakota schools would be like summoning Captain Planet.

http://image1.stadiumjourney.com/images/stadiums/2300_Denny_Sanford_Premier_Center_Summit_-_1

[clenz]

Don't you think UND in the Summit could destabilize the MVFC a bit? As in, the Summit would be very close to offering football. The MVC may not care, but I have to think MVC schools that offer football might get a little anxious.
No.

What indications are there The Summit would sponsor football? Why would they need too? The MVFC has run the league, on it's own, for 30 years - the entire time with a Summit member in it.

Other than NDSU fans, and apparently a single USD fan, is there actually any issues from Summit teams regarding the MVFC set up? The MVC doesn't give two squirts of piss what the MVFC/MVC schools as long as it doesn't affect how the spend/run their MVC programs. Adding UND to the Summit has no impact on that.

I really don't get what the issue from NDSU (or Yote 53) fans is. Yote 53 wants to talk about 20 years into the future The Summit might challenge the MVC. 20 years? Really? There is about a 3% chance the NCAA looks anything like it does in 20 years. My wife gave birth 12 days ago, my son will be a junior in college by that time. There's no way to extrapolate anything out like that.

So lets pretend The Summit wants to take a chance at destabilizing their football set up and start their own league. Would they "invite" the MVC schools or would they throw UNI, SIU, ISUr, ISUb, MSU, and YSU....yeah...6 of their 10 members...out of the conference. The MVFC would still have an autobid and would likely be able to grab a handful of OVC/SLC/PFL (once they finally fall apart) to get back to 9 teams. If they invite those 6 to the new conference why even start a new conference? Why disintegrate a 30+ year old conference to have the exact same teams in it? What sense does that make? Esepcially when it doesn't give The Summit extra control, at all. The same number of votes would still be needed to do everything from adding teams to changing by-laws. Essentially The Summit would be ****ting where it eats, sleeps, drives, walks, works, everywhere except where it should actually ****.


No one has actually answered the question"

What is the MVFC doing that is causing such uneasiness from NDSU fans?
Yes, Patty V isn't the best choice for Commissioner. She wasn't appointed by the MVC. Hell, UNI and Missouri State weren't even MVC schools when they joined the Gateway (along with EIU and WIU). They were in the AMCU and joined the MVC in the early 2000s. Indiana State actually left the MVC football conference before it became a 1AA conference and went 1AA independent for a half decade before rejoining the conference.
Yes there are more MVC programs than Summit and Horizon programs.
Yes, those MVC programs also need to make sure they maintain their non-football programs to standards the Summit doesn't "worry about". Yet, they've never not spent on football.
Even with all of that, what is the MVFC doing that is harming NDSU, or the Summit?

Would NDSU still have these same qualms had the administration not screwed up and changed the name in 2008? If it was still called the Gateway Football Conference would you have these issues?

Kind of crazy that a conference that is puppet mastered by the MVC it's existed for 30 years with a large number of non-MVC schools.

[BisonFan02]

No.

What indications are there The Summit would sponsor football? Why would they need too? The MVFC has run the league, on it's own, for 30 years - the entire time with a Summit member in it.

Other than NDSU fans, and apparently a single USD fan, is there actually any issues from Summit teams regarding the MVFC set up? The MVC doesn't give two squirts of piss what the MVFC/MVC schools as long as it doesn't affect how the spend/run their MVC programs. Adding UND to the Summit has no impact on that.

I really don't get what the issue from NDSU (or Yote 53) fans is. Yote 53 wants to talk about 20 years into the future The Summit might challenge the MVC. 20 years? Really? There is about a 3% chance the NCAA looks anything like it does in 20 years. My wife gave birth 12 days ago, my son will be a junior in college by that time. There's no way to extrapolate anything out like that.

So lets pretend The Summit wants to take a chance at destabilizing their football set up and start their own league. Would they "invite" the MVC schools or would they throw UNI, SIU, ISUr, ISUb, MSU, and YSU....yeah...6 of their 10 members...out of the conference. The MVFC would still have an autobid and would likely be able to grab a handful of OVC/SLC/PFL (once they finally fall apart) to get back to 9 teams. If they invite those 6 to the new conference why even start a new conference? Why disintegrate a 30+ year old conference to have the exact same teams in it? What sense does that make? Esepcially when it doesn't give The Summit extra control, at all. The same number of votes would still be needed to do everything from adding teams to changing by-laws. Essentially The Summit would be ****ting where it eats, sleeps, drives, walks, works, everywhere except where it should actually ****.


No one has actually answered the question"

What is the MVFC doing that is causing such uneasiness from NDSU fans?
Yes, Patty V isn't the best choice for Commissioner. She wasn't appointed by the MVC. Hell, UNI and Missouri State weren't even MVC schools when they joined the Gateway (along with EIU and WIU). They were in the AMCU and joined the MVC in the early 2000s. Indiana State actually left the MVC football conference before it became a 1AA conference and went 1AA independent for a half decade before rejoining the conference.
Yes there are more MVC programs than Summit and Horizon programs.
Yes, those MVC programs also need to make sure they maintain their non-football programs to standards the Summit doesn't "worry about". Yet, they've never not spent on football.
Even with all of that, what is the MVFC doing that is harming NDSU, or the Summit?

Would NDSU still have these same qualms had the administration not screwed up and changed the name in 2008? If it was still called the Gateway Football Conference would you have these issues?

Kind of crazy that a conference that is puppet mastered by the MVC it's existed for 30 years with a large number of non-MVC schools.

Honestly...the only thing I think the MVFC could do that would cause absolute chaos at NDSU (and amongst its fans) is if Patty/MVFC told NDSU they could not do FCOA for football because it was deemed unfair by the rest of the member schools and a new rule is placed forbidding NDSU from doing so (and I don't believe the MVFC can do that). Many bitch about the lack of a TV deal, but I genuinely am not affected by it since every game is broadcast statewide on NBC (bumps Notre Dame games...which is pretty funny xlolx )

[IBleedYellow]

The prevailing opinion is that the only way that UND will leave the Big Sky to join the Summit is if they also gain admittance to the MVFC for football.


So they won't be Summit or MVFC.


Good. They will continue to fail as long as the hemorrhage money in the Big Sky.

[clenz]

Honestly...the only thing I think the MVFC could do that would cause absolute chaos at NDSU (and amongst its fans) is if Patty/MVFC told NDSU they could not do FCOA for football because it was deemed unfair by the rest of the member schools and a new rule is placed forbidding NDSU from doing so (and I don't believe the MVFC can do that). Many bitch about the lack of a TV deal, but I genuinely am not affected by it since every game is broadcast statewide on NBC (bumps Notre Dame games...which is pretty funny xlolx )
So the MVFC has done nothing wrong, and isn't doing anything that would damage NDSU, SDSU, USD, or WIU?

So why the yearly/monthly push back from Summit team fan bases?

That's what I don't get.

Just because UNI, SIU, MSU and the ISUs do what they need to to protect their basketball interests (and they'd be freaking dumb as hell not too...no matter what Summit fans want to think they aren't even close to the MVC, even in the next 5 years. It's too tough to predict what realignment will do past that). None of them have ever done anything to protect their basketball programs that has had any negative impact on Summit programs in the MVFC.

Hell, the MVC did the Summit league a favor by not considering and/or taking ORU or one of the DSU's. Imagine the chaos that could have happened then.

Really, you should be thanking the MVC

[clenz]

So they won't be Summit or MVFC.


This.

I see no way the MVFC goes above 10 teams, unless it goes to 12 or 14. I see almost no way that happens as the chaos that would ensue across the board (Summit, MVC, OVC and Horizon) would likely cripple at least 2 or 3 programs and maybe a conference.

UND's only/best hope right now is that YSU gets their MAC wish, or the CAA wants them and they decide to end a 20 year relationship with the MVFC AND Missouri State finally gets the invite we keep hearing they already have...after being passed up by 5 or 6 schools since the MSU posters started saying their athletic director had an invite from the SBC AND CUSA on his desk any time he wanted it.

[clenz]

On the UND topic, I do have a question:

Why, if the Big Sky is willing to keep them as an affiliate for football (like Cal Poly and UC Davis), would UND pass up an option to be Summit in all other sports?

I know it would be strange be in the same conference as the other Dakota schools for all sports except football, but wouldn't it be a better option for UND?

Is the Big Sky unwilling to keep UND as an affiliate because of how damn far away they are?

[mmiller_34]

So the MVFC has done nothing wrong, and isn't doing anything that would damage NDSU, SDSU, USD, or WIU?

So why the yearly/monthly push back from Summit team fan bases?

That's what I don't get.



We want to be in the MVC with you and our other MVFC friends. You don't know how lonely it gets during the football offseason when IUPUI comes to Frost to get stomped.

[clenz]

We want to be in the MVC with you and our other MVFC friends. You don't know how lonely it gets during the football offseason when IUPUI comes to Frost to get stomped.
I don't blame you.

IUPUI, IPFW, Denver (do they sponsor any other Summit sports than basketball? That is why the MVC dropped them instantly; they said they wouldn't add any sports to meet MVC standards..I think they only sponsored M/W basketball) and ORU wouldn't move too many needles.

[BisonFan02]

So the MVFC has done nothing wrong, and isn't doing anything that would damage NDSU, SDSU, USD, or WIU?

So why the yearly/monthly push back from Summit team fan bases?

That's what I don't get.

Just because UNI, SIU, MSU and the ISUs do what they need to to protect their basketball interests (and they'd be freaking dumb as hell not too...no matter what Summit fans want to think they aren't even close to the MVC, even in the next 5 years. It's too tough to predict what realignment will do past that). None of them have ever done anything to protect their basketball programs that has had any negative impact on Summit programs in the MVFC.

Hell, the MVC did the Summit league a favor by not considering and/or taking ORU or one of the DSU's. Imagine the chaos that could have happened then.

Really, you should be thanking the MVC

I could see ORU/Tulsa, but are you ****ing kidding about the DSU's? xlolx We are not on the MVC radar nor do we fit the profile of the schools you are going to look at....land grant state schools that are in Brookings and Fargo respectively. If we didn't fit now, when you guys took on Loyola, we never will barring a conference implosion (and, in which case, there wouldn't be a benefit to leave our current situation)

Personally, I would much rather see NDSU in an all sports conference. I think that would help further generate interest at NDSU in non-football sports if they had more carryover from the football schedule outside of the SD schools and WIU. Knowing the Bison are not a MVC fit...what other options are there? The MAC? MWC?...or push for the Summit to take the plunge?

Would NDSU fans miss the conference matchups with UNI (primarily you guys only), and to a lesser extent SIU, ISUr, and maybe YSU...a little perhaps...but those could be replaced by UND, UNC, SUU, a different directional U in Illinois (EIU)....etc.

[BisonFan02]

We want to be in the MVC with you and our other MVFC friends. You don't know how lonely it gets during the football offseason when IUPUI comes to Frost to get stomped.

You guys have a better shot than we do. Would be a blow to the Summit...a few more and the Bison make a FBS study and leave all together. xlolx

[mmiller_34]

I don't blame you.

IUPUI, IPFW, Denver (do they sponsor any other Summit sports than basketball? That is why the MVC dropped them instantly; they said they wouldn't add any sports to meet MVC standards..I think they only sponsored M/W basketball) and ORU wouldn't move too many needles.

ORU fans despise Dakota school fans because we took their tournament away. The games aren't even fun sometimes. NDSU and SDSU have dominated the summit the past 5 years and will continue to do so. USD is quickly becoming a strong 3rd place too. It's really ridiculous. IPFW has had some good teams then they play in front of 500 fans...

[clenz]

I could see ORU/Tulsa, but are you ****ing kidding about the DSU's? xlolx We are not on the MVC radar nor do we fit the profile of the schools you are going to look at....land grant state schools that are in Brookings and Fargo respectively. If we didn't fit now, when you guys took on Loyola, we never will barring a conference implosion (and, in which case, there wouldn't be a benefit to leave our current situation)

Personally, I would much rather see NDSU in an all sports conference. I think that would help further generate interest at NDSU in non-football sports if they had more carryover from the football schedule outside of the SD schools and WIU. Knowing the Bison are not a MVC fit...what other options are there? The MAC? MWC?...or push for the Summit to take the plunge?

Would NDSU fans miss the conference matchups with UNI (primarily you guys only), and to a lesser extent SIU, ISUr, and maybe YSU...a little perhaps...but those could be replaced by UND, UNC, SUU, a different directional U in Illinois (EIU)....etc.
I wasn't saying you were being looked at. I was pointing out the fact that because the MVC wasn't looking at you, ORU, Denver, etc... created stability in the league. So really, the MVC stabilized that league even further.

Which can only prove that this "The MVC is evil and ruining the MVFC" is a complete farsexcoffeex

[BisonFan02]

ORU fans despise Dakota school fans because we took their tournament away. The games aren't even fun sometimes. NDSU and SDSU have dominated the summit the past 5 years and will continue to do so. USD is quickly becoming a strong 3rd place too. It's really ridiculous. IPFW has had some good teams then they play in front of 500 fans...

There is a solution to that..... :D

Wanna play 21 questions to figure out how? xlolx

[mmiller_34]

There is a solution to that..... :D

Wanna play 21 questions to figure out how? xlolx

Win the conference? xconfusedx

Offer COA?

IPFW -- "I Paid For What??"



BTW NO ONE LIKED MY CAPTAIN PLANET ANALOGY?

[PantherRob82]

Win the conference? xconfusedx

Offer COA?

IPFW -- "I Paid For What??"



BTW NO ONE LIKED MY CAPTAIN PLANET ANALOGY?

I repped you. :D

[Professor Chaos]

On the UND topic, I do have a question:

Why, if the Big Sky is willing to keep them as an affiliate for football (like Cal Poly and UC Davis), would UND pass up an option to be Summit in all other sports?

I know it would be strange be in the same conference as the other Dakota schools for all sports except football, but wouldn't it be a better option for UND?

Is the Big Sky unwilling to keep UND as an affiliate because of how damn far away they are?
I thought this possibility has been discussed by the UND and Big Sky leadership but the Big Sky wanted UND as full member or not at all back when they were added. Of course this was in the middle of the conference realignment chaos of a few years back and I think the Big Sky was scared ****less about what happened to the WAC so they were trying to make sure they had strength in numbers when it came to member schools. Now with realignment calmed down and with literally no other viable options for most of their membership I'd wonder if the Big Sky would be more open to UND being an affiliate member in football.

Of course on top of that there's rumors, of which I have no idea how valid they are, that UND still has bad blood for the Summit and Douple in particular since the Summit wouldn't even consider them while they were sparring with the NCAA over their nickname and also because of how the Summit/MVFC swooped in during the 11th hour to invite USD and take away UNDs presumed Big Sky partner.

So the short answer is "who knows?". I'm sure the Summit would love to take UND at this point. Whether the Big Sky, or UND themselves, is willing to play ball is the question.

[mmiller_34]

I don't blame you.

IUPUI, IPFW, Denver (do they sponsor any other Summit sports than basketball? That is why the MVC dropped them instantly; they said they wouldn't add any sports to meet MVC standards..I think they only sponsored M/W basketball) and ORU wouldn't move too many needles.

Denver Summit Sports:
M/W Basketball
Tennis
Golf
Swimming/Diving
Volleyball
Soccer

Sports in Other Conferencds:
Skiing
Lacrosse
Gymnastics
Hockey

[BisonFan02]

I thought this possibility has been discussed by the UND and Big Sky leadership but the Big Sky wanted UND as full member or not at all back when they were added. Of course this was in the middle of the conference realignment chaos of a few years back and I think the Big Sky was scared ****less about what happened to the WAC so they were trying to make sure they had strength in numbers when it came to member schools. Now with realignment calmed down and with literally no other viable options for most of their membership I'd wonder if the Big Sky would be more open to UND being an affiliate member in football.

Of course on top of that there's rumors, of which I have no idea how valid they are, that UND still has bad blood for the Summit and Douple in particular since the Summit wouldn't even consider them while they were sparring with the NCAA over their nickname and also because of how the Summit/MVFC swooped in during the 11th hour to invite USD and take away UNDs presumed Big Sky partner.

So the short answer is "who knows?". I'm sure the Summit would love to take UND at this point. Whether the Big Sky, or UND themselves, is willing to play ball is the question.

Its time....

http://i.imgur.com/Q0ZGAVw.gif

[FargoBison]

What exactly do you want or expect them to "do" other than whats already been done?

The CAA has essentially crumbled apart from its glory of the previous decade so I have no idea why that is the conference model that you envy.

As it stands right now, the MVFC is very clearly the best league in the country. Sounds like a lot of needless and baseless bitching if you ask me.

The CAA was poached to oblivion by realignment, it was a victim of its own success and I guess timing of the bigger conferences going into expansion overdrive. Not because the conference and the football conference work together.

My only point is if the two worked together, when ESPN or CBS talked to the MVC they could bring up football. Do you think the CAA football association negotiated games on NBCSN and Comcast? No, it was a total package deal with the CAA.

Instead we have Patty V doing this on her own and have ended up with something that is just pathetic and sad. Seriously the broadcasts the Valley pays for look like they were produced by a high school.

The Valley is the best conference in the FCS but it could be better and stronger.

[clenz]

The CAA was poached to oblivion by realignment, it was a victim of its own success and I guess timing of the bigger conferences going into expansion overdrive. Not because the conference and the football conference work together.

My only point is if the two worked together, when ESPN or CBS talked to the MVC they could bring up football. Do you think the CAA football association negotiated games on NBCSN and Comcast? No, it was a total package deal with the CAA.

Instead we have Patty V doing this on her own and have ended up with something that is just pathetic and sad. Seriously the broadcasts the Valley pays for look like they were produced by a high school.

The Valley is the best conference in the FCS but it could be better and stronger.
I don't think you understand that the MVC and MVFC are different things completely.

Elgin did the TV deal, Patty V wasn't involved. Turns out Elgin isn't involved in football. Elgin has no power when it comes to getting the MVFC a deal because he has no MVFC power/ties

I also don't think you've looked at how the CAA is actually structured. It is a one sport conference but it's owned, maintained, and run by the same people as the CAA for all other sports. It may as well just be an internal piece of the CAA

Similar but very different

[FargoBison]

I don't think you understand that the MVC and MVFC are different things completely.

Elgin did the TV deal, Patty V wasn't involved. Turns out Elgin isn't involved in football. Elgin has no power when it comes to getting the MVFC a deal because he has no MVFC power/ties

I also don't think you've looked at how the CAA is actually structured. It is a one sport conference but it's owned, maintained, and run by the same people as the CAA for all other sports. It may as well just be an internal piece of the CAA

Similar but very different

I've looked at both conferences, all the MVFC administrators work for the MVC in the exact same office. It is very similar with a few differences. One Elgin has nothing to do with football where the CAA commissioner is the top administrator for everything. Secondly the CAA values football and the MVC just doesn't care or is too afraid to upset its delicate balance of the football and non-football schools by getting more involved.

So yeah obviously Elgin would have nothing to do with football or its media contract. That is what I wish would change and why I highlighted the CAA model.

[Bisonwinagn]

NObody gives a flying **** about BB or tv deals or summit conferences or any of that bull****. Stop posting that stupid crap in a football thread on a football board or get the **** off this site!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[BisonFan02]

NObody gives a flying **** about BB or tv deals or summit conferences or any of that bull****. Stop posting that stupid crap in a football thread on a football board or get the **** off this site!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Naw bruh...I'm stayin' xlolx You go.

[The Yo Show]

So is the MVC is hurting / is hurt by the MVFC discussion separate from UND joining the MVFC or??? Im so lost on the naunces of this entire discussion.

[F'N Hawks]

I thought this possibility has been discussed by the UND and Big Sky leadership but the Big Sky wanted UND as full member or not at all back when they were added. Of course this was in the middle of the conference realignment chaos of a few years back and I think the Big Sky was scared ****less about what happened to the WAC so they were trying to make sure they had strength in numbers when it came to member schools. Now with realignment calmed down and with literally no other viable options for most of their membership I'd wonder if the Big Sky would be more open to UND being an affiliate member in football.

Of course on top of that there's rumors, of which I have no idea how valid they are, that UND still has bad blood for the Summit and Douple in particular since the Summit wouldn't even consider them while they were sparring with the NCAA over their nickname and also because of how the Summit/MVFC swooped in during the 11th hour to invite USD and take away UNDs presumed Big Sky partner.

So the short answer is "who knows?". I'm sure the Summit would love to take UND at this point. Whether the Big Sky, or UND themselves, is willing to play ball is the question.

FYI, UND canceled the Summit League visit the weekend they went to the Big Sky. They were in the Summit League if they wanted, which is why Douple was set to do the formality of a campus visit. Your version is a bit " off".

[ST_Lawson]

Just to chime in....Football in the MVFC, other sports in the Summit...we're good.

We're the only original member left from the founding of the conference and the old Mid-Con days and I don't see that changing any time soon.
The Summit is stronger and more stable than it's ever been in the league's history, the MVFC is the top conference in FCS football, and we're fairly centrally located within both.

Now, if we can just get the state to give us $.

[Sycamore62]

Just to chime in....Football in the MVFC, other sports in the Summit...we're good.

We're the only original member left from the founding of the conference and the old Mid-Con days and I don't see that changing any time soon.
The Summit is stronger and more stable than it's ever been in the league's history, the MVFC is the top conference in FCS football, and we're fairly centrally located within both.

Now, if we can just get the state to give us $.

I think they have now gone to writing post-dated checks.

- - - Updated - - -

I think this thread would be shorter if they would have just kept the name as the Gateway.