Delaware Gets PSU OL Transfer [Archive]

ChickenMan

June 29th, 2005, 10:03 AM

I guess we'll see whether he can play at that weight or not. Sounds like sour grapes from the family. Paterno was obviously unhappy with the work the kid put in.

Yes we will see... but considering that the OL was 'the' area of concern heading into this season... it's a another big pick up in a 'need' area. This is the second OL transfer from a big time 1A program (the other was an OT from Miami)... so maybe the OL will be fine. If so... the UD offense will be very strong... as all the skill guys are back.

blukeys

June 29th, 2005, 10:17 AM

Meshugana! :doh::bawling::anim_chai:shakingma:bow:

And most importantly, will you appreciate him enough? :)

You know how Moms are 13. My baby is right even when he's wrong. It may be the case that the kid and JoPa got the relationship off on the wrong foot from the beginning and they never got on the same page. Happens all the time in sports.

The guy is going to help the depth situation and might turn into a good one. But if he has a work ethic problem he may find himself riding the pines just as he did with PSU.

Tribe4SF

June 29th, 2005, 10:20 AM

Yeah, it certainly is good news for you guys. If your young receivers deliver, the Hen offense should be better. I still think Riccio needs to play at a higher and more consistent level for you.

blukeys

June 29th, 2005, 10:28 AM

I still think Riccio needs to play at a higher and more consistent level for you.
That was the problem we had with Andy Hall in '02. ;) :D

Lehigh Football Nation

June 29th, 2005, 10:30 AM

MR. CHICKEN

June 29th, 2005, 10:35 AM

TWELVE MO' TRANSFERS........AN' WE WILL CATCH UP WHIFF MONTANA & UMASS!......:nod:........BRRAAAWWWWKKKKK!@transfer U.

ChickenMan

June 29th, 2005, 10:51 AM

Ubiquitous headlines:

"People Breathe Air and Drink Water"

"Madonna Changes Her Look"

"Stephen Spielberg Makes a Movie"

"Dogs Bite Men"

"Violence in Iraq"

"Israelis and Palestinians Fight"

"Delaware gets I-A Transfer"

Why is it that UD is the ONLY school that seems to be regulary criticized for accepting qualified 1A transfers??? UD had just one last year and two this year. In the A10 alone, I know JMU has had more and UMass had seven just this year. UD takes no more and probably a lot less transfers than most top 1AA's... but fortunately... for UD... a couple of their's (Hall & Johnson) were a hell of a lot better than most of the others.

Ronbo

June 29th, 2005, 11:01 AM

TWELVE MO' TRANSFERS........AN' WE WILL CATCH UP WHIFF MONTANA & UMASS!......:nod:........BRRAAAWWWWKKKKK!@transfer U.

We have three this year. That's our average 2-3 a year. I can't ever remember 4 or more in one year. Talk about Chattanooga, Sam Houston State or N. Iowa bird breath. Sam Houston had 7-8 last year and another 4-5 this year. :confused: :rolleyes: :D :p

We just filled a couple needs with a second QB to back up or be the starter and a top notch WR. The O-Lineman was just a bonus as we were going to be strong on the O-Line anyway. :D

Tribe4SF

June 29th, 2005, 11:09 AM

blukeys

June 29th, 2005, 11:19 AM

Why is it that UD is the ONLY school that seems to be regulary criticized for accepting qualified 1A transfers??? UD had just one last year and two this year. In the A10 alone, I know JMU has had more and UMass had seven just this year. UD takes no more and probably a lot less transfers than most top 1AA's... but fortunately... for UD... a couple of their's (Hall & Johnson) were a hell of a lot better than most of the others.
Lighten' up CM. You know how the PL spinmeisters work. They need to prepare the ground for the excuses they will give when they lose to Delaware. It is never Delaware had the better team this time. It is Delaware cheats and uses transfers and by the way our SAT's are really high.

If you want to get your blood pressure up read the Morning Call up in the Lehigh Valley. The reporters there drink in the propaganda like it is purple Kool Aid.

blukeys

June 29th, 2005, 11:27 AM

UD does get a bad rap on this. UNI has a bunch this year, and McNeese always seems to have alot.

The one position where I think transfers can come back to bite you is QB. I know you guys have a promising young QB in the program, but neither Delaware or JMU was able to sign a high school QB this year. Montana has again brought in a transfer, as has Sam Houston. When a program gets the reputation for transfer QBs, I honestly believe it effects recruiting.

I don't know about the other schools but Delaware did not recruit heavily in QB's and I don't think it would have been correct to do so. Carty has 2 more years and Moyer has 4. The recruiting buzz was more on the linemen and backers from Florida. in addition There were other areas that were of more concern. With the offense UD is running now, I don't think there will be any shortage of candidates at QB. Hey Tribe How is Potts doing?

bluehenbillk

June 29th, 2005, 11:33 AM

Ronbo

June 29th, 2005, 11:53 AM

UD does get a bad rap on this. UNI has a bunch this year, and McNeese always seems to have alot.

The one position where I think transfers can come back to bite you is QB. I know you guys have a promising young QB in the program, but neither Delaware or JMU was able to sign a high school QB this year. Montana has again brought in a transfer, as has Sam Houston. When a program gets the reputation for transfer QBs, I honestly believe it effects recruiting.

I'll bet you we start a redshirt freshman at QB this year. The transfer was brought in as a back up. He didn't look near as good as the freshman in spring drills. Then we have Clint Stapp from Colorado that we recruited, 6'3" 205, he'll redshirt this year. He could be better than the kid that will start this year (Bergquist). Stapp threw for 61% completion average, 2200 yards, 23 TD's, and ran for 6 TD's his senior year. All State QB in Colorado. We'll have a QB controversy in two years between Bergquist and Stapp.

blukeys

June 29th, 2005, 11:55 AM

Agreed, it's the people from 'Nova & the PL, mainly Le-High that complain the most about UD getting any transfers. Bottom line, they still lost a lot to us before we got transfers too.

All you guys need is some cheese to go with that whine....

As someone who has followed UD football for more than 4 decades I can say that KC has brought in no more transfers than Tubby or Admiral Dave about 3-5 /year . For the most part there was a good reason the players transferred from I-A. They weren't that good. (some of these guys transfer to PL schools where they become student - athletes and then are hailed for their academic/athletic accomplishments). One of the better transfers was a linemen named Cook.

For the most part transfers are way overrated. Case in point 2000 transfer from Iowa State who started but was not as good as Antwawn Jenkins. A 2002 transfer from Va. Tech who could not start ahead of Jenkins. The best UD impact transfer was Johnson who originally wanted to go to a PL school and only an obscure PL rule landed him at Delaware. Johnson is now vilified by the PL.. Had he the sense of not completing his undergraduate degree in 4 years, and gone to Fordham he would have been hailed by the same people.

GannonFan

June 29th, 2005, 12:33 PM

Johnson is now vilified by the PL.. Had he the sense of not completing his undergraduate degree in 4 years, and gone to Fordham he would have been hailed by the same people.

Yeah, the irony is, that with his undergraduate degree already in hand, he was essentially too smart for the Patriot League.

UD has gotten an unfair rap over the most recent years over the transfers probably due to the success - a lot of programs that bring in tons of transfers do so almost every year and just aren't very good. But in UD's case, people forget that KC came into the coaching job in late February, after Tubby had already recruited his last high school class, meaning that KC had to install a radically new offense (a spread offense as compared with the Wing-T) and he had to do it without recruiting high school - as Tubby had left almost 10 schollies open, that's why you saw so many transfers in the first year. But typically, the transfers are guys with a lot of playing time left - case in point, both Boler and Bleymeir were IA transfers but only spent a redshirt season at IA - they are now seniors and will play their 4th year for UD this season - btw, without a medical redshirt, 4 years is all anyone can play for a school so call them transfers if you will, but they played for UD as long as any high-school recruit.

On this transfer specifically, we'll have to see if a new address changes his attitude - obviously things have gone sour at Penn St in general and maybe this kid just got caught up in the malaise. If anything, UD's coaching staff is pretty good at motivation so if that's all that lacking he should find help here. Should provide some much needed depth and if he lives up to his ability, this is a great pickup.

blueballs

June 29th, 2005, 02:12 PM

As long as UD does nothing against the rules, which they certainly haven't, it is all good.

Transfer talent has advantages and disadvantages. UD seems to be willing to live with both the good and bad. I don't see anythiing wrong with this. JMO...

Tribe4SF

June 29th, 2005, 03:49 PM

Hey Tribe How is Potts doing?

He's doing great. Got a report the other day that he is going above and beyond with summer workouts. In addition to strength and conditioning, i was told he's meeting Josh Lustig twice a day to throw. When Lustig had a conflict for their morning session, Potts made him come at 6:30 so they wouldn't miss. I'm sure he knows that hard work may make the difference in his battle with Jake Phillips. Mike showed some touch on his passes in the spring game, which was my biggest concern about him. When he played last fall, he threw everything hard.

The battle between the two of them is really something. Pick any ten fans or players and they'll be split down the middle on who the likely winner is going to be.

blukeys

June 29th, 2005, 04:12 PM

Mike has always worked hard on his game since he was little. There is nothing wrong with his work ethic. He never was really recruited by Delaware which I thought was a mistake. I don't know if he had any real interest in Delaware. His High school was 30 min. from the Tub and many kids want a little distance when they go to college. Ud might have been discouraged from recruiting him. The word that went out in High School was that he was looking at Maryland or Rutgers. (his uncle has some type of job with the Jets). Both schools hosted him for visits and he went to a few of their games. In the end though Maryland offered him a walk on and Rutgers a partial while W&M offered a full ride so he is at W&M.

Potts has a great arm and I saw him throw some bullets in high school . He will eventually get the touch passes down. His mobility is not the greatest although he is faster than a lot of people think once he gets moving.

MR. CHICKEN

June 29th, 2005, 04:42 PM

UH DELAWARE NATIVE...GOIN' TA MARY'S SCHOOL FO' BILLIES...TURNCOAT!...BAWK!

charliej

June 29th, 2005, 07:44 PM

I met Holler when he was being recruited,I think UD was one of the schools he visited back then if I'm not mistaken.The kid is a MOUNTAIN.He has the kind of build that may make it tough to lose the weight,(his forearms are near as big as my thighs) Real nice kid,maybe too nice, struck me as kind of the gentle giant type.

WMTribe90

June 29th, 2005, 10:58 PM

I agree UD has taken some unwarranted criticism for taking transfers. There are other schools UMass, JMU, McNeese, Sam Houston and UNI (to name a few) that certainly take more. In addition, I don't think UD takes IA kids transferring for academic or discipline reasons like some other I-AA's do.

That said, the transfer route has as many potential pitfalls and it does potential benefits. I think with some positions (QB and RB) you can damage your HS recruiting if your seen as a dumping ground for IA QBs and RBs. I also think you risk damaging team chemistry with too many or the wrong "type" of transfers.

While WM will occassionally take a transfer to fill a real need (probably average .5 transfers a year), I'm glad WM does not lean to heavily on transfers. Laycock has chosen to build the program more around developing talent from within by recruiting quality walk-ons, promising of opportunity to earn a scholarship. I know alot of schools award scholarships to deserving walk-ons. I just don't know of any school that does it to the extent of WM does.

Husky Alum

June 29th, 2005, 11:51 PM

Hey Delaware fans, can you use a 6'3 300 lb defensive lineman who was recruited by Harvard, Yale, Don Brown, Vanderbilt, and Duke out of High School??

I was thinking of getting my masters, I wonder if KC will take me, I think I have some eligibility left. ;)

ngineer

June 30th, 2005, 12:09 AM

Tribe4SF

June 30th, 2005, 12:48 AM

Potts has a great arm and I saw him throw some bullets in high school . He will eventually get the touch passes down. His mobility is not the greatest although he is faster than a lot of people think once he gets moving.

Mike showed some good mobility in the spring game. I was surprised by his willingness to tuck it up and run hard. It's the one area, though, that he is at a distinct disadvantage versus Phillips. Jake is a truly dangerous runner who rushed for over 1,400 yds. and 26 TDs his senior year in high school.

Here's a shot of MIke in action last fall.

blukeys

June 30th, 2005, 02:17 AM

I think UD gets more attention on the transfer issue because they are more in the spotlight, plus they promote the transfers through the SI. Nothing wrong with that. I think a majority of the griping is just plain jealosy. I'd love for Lehigh to get a few quality transfers. We've had a few transfers over the years, but nothing to write home about--in fact, a few were unhappy Blue Hens, and they didn't really do anything in Brown & White, either. :(

A guy named Connor maybe? The whole Delaware transfer issue really comes down to Sean Johnson. While some may blame Lehigh, the initial Johnson trashing began on the Colgate message boards and then was picked up throughout the PL. Delaware has always had 3-5 transfers per year most coming from what one would call I-A. My Father (God rest his soul) would get ecstactic about the transfer potential. This goes back to the 50's and 60's . But as of opening day the original Delaware recruit would start and the transfers would be seeing limited playing time.

There is a reason players transfer. They aren't getting playing time where they are at. There is a reason they aren't getting playing time. They aren't that good. Tubby Raymond always said that the players he was recruiting he expected to be just as good at the I-A level.

In 2002 Keith Burnell was a heralded transfer from Va. Tech. He lost the starting job to Antwawn Jenkins an original UD recruit. For my money the competition wasn't close.

Most of the whining about transfers is jealousy. But I hate seeing perfectly decent student athletes vilified when they have done nothing wrong. If someone doesn't like UD fine. Take your animosity and post something on the SMACK Board. We can all argue it out and have some fun in the process. There is no need to besmirch the individual reputations of players in the process.

(unless of course they are that punk Randy Moss)

DemiGS

June 30th, 2005, 05:48 AM

Someone check my math. But of the top rated, traditional powers of I-AA is there anyone who wins as much with as few transfers as GSU? How many 1-AA transfer threads do we see involving GSU? Sure Delaware and Montana are their state’s flag ship, but do the transfers equal better then they would have received normally.

FU97

June 30th, 2005, 08:25 AM

Yes we will see... but considering that the OL was 'the' area of concern heading into this season... it's a another big pick up in a 'need' area. This is the second OL transfer from a big time 1A program (the other was an OT from Miami)... so maybe the OL will be fine. If so... the UD offense will be very strong... as all the skill guys are back.

Given their performance lately, I'd hardly call Penn State "big time" anymore. Joe Pa's time passed over a decade ago. They suck. Really bad.

ChickenMan

June 30th, 2005, 09:15 AM

Given their performance lately, I'd hardly call Penn State "big time" anymore. Joe Pa's time passed over a decade ago. They suck. Really bad.

Obviously over the past few years PSU hasn't been the power they once were... but they still play 'big time' football and they still recruit 'big time' athletes. The kid in question (Holler) was a HS All-American and a first team All-State selection in PA who was recruited by the some of the top programs in the nation (VT, Miami, Ohio St) as well a PSU. Who knows what he will do... if anything at UD... but is he a welcome addition in a 'need' area.

colgate13

June 30th, 2005, 09:28 AM

A guy named Connor maybe? The whole Delaware transfer issue really comes down to Sean Johnson. While some may blame Lehigh, the initial Johnson trashing began on the Colgate message boards and then was picked up throughout the PL.

Yea, I try and squash that whenever I can. No one at Colgate was complaining about DeWayne Long from Nebraska for the past 2 years - or JJ Bennett from Kentucky before community college this year.

Lehigh Football Nation

June 30th, 2005, 09:47 AM

There is a reason players transfer. They aren't getting playing time where they are at. There is a reason they aren't getting playing time. They aren't that good. Tubby Raymond always said that the players he was recruiting he expected to be just as good at the I-A level.

...

Most of the whining about transfers is jealousy. But I hate seeing perfectly decent student athletes vilified when they have done nothing wrong. If someone doesn't like UD fine. Take your animosity and post something on the SMACK Board. We can all argue it out and have some fun in the process. There is no need to besmirch the individual reputations of players in the process.

If they're not that good, how all the UD folks on this board are making a big deal of them? You are rightfully excited that you've got a mountainous OL prospect from PSU coming to Newark. But turning around and saying most transfers are not that good is disingenuous. I wouldn't call Andy Hall and Shawn Johnson not that good, would you?

I think talking about transfers is NOT about jealousy. It touches on how people feel about football eligibility and academics. I, and most of the PL people on this board IMO, are not jealous that you got these players. That would imply that secretly we wish that Lehigh, Colgate, Lafayette, Fordham would scrap their rules on eligibility so that these folks would be let in. That's not true. I don't wish Shawn Johnson was on Lehigh, Fordham, or any PL school. This has 100% to do with principles. Nothing to do with individual players.

Ivytalk

June 30th, 2005, 09:55 AM

Joe Pa was quoted as saying the kid is just too heavy and should play at 305. Can KC whip the lad into shape?

ChickenMan

June 30th, 2005, 10:03 AM

Joe Pa was quoted as saying the kid is just too heavy and should play at 305. Can KC whip the lad into shape?

At 6'6"... 325 doesn't sound all that heavy to me... but we will see.

As for transfers in general... they're a lot like HS recruits... some are very good... some are mediocre and some never contribute at all.

blukeys

June 30th, 2005, 11:27 AM

Yea, I try and squash that whenever I can. No one at Colgate was complaining about DeWayne Long from Nebraska for the past 2 years - or JJ Bennett from Kentucky before community college this year.
You are quite correct 13. You always strive to be accurate and I have always been appreciative.

blukeys

June 30th, 2005, 11:51 AM

If they're not that good, how all the UD folks on this board are making a big deal of them? You are rightfully excited that you've got a mountainous OL prospect from PSU coming to Newark. But turning around and saying most transfers are not that good is disingenuous. I wouldn't call Andy Hall and Shawn Johnson not that good, would you?

If you read carefully the UD posts about Holler you will note a wait and see attitude. I am excited about this prospect because the O-line is a problem area for this year's team not that this guy is the second coming. Holler is the more typical I-A transfer he is not getting playing time at PSU so he is leaving. Regarding transfers For every Andy Hall there are about 7 or 8 Ryan McDermonds. Didn't hear of McDermond? He was a transfer who played on the '03 team. He got in some on defense and played some on special teams. Most transfers are of the Ryan McDermond type they make a contribution but they are not that good and their prescence hardly warrants the hype the media gives them due to being a I-A transfer

Johnson and Hall are that good. They are the exceptions that prove the rule that most (not all) are not that good. Johnson is the extreme exception. I don't think I will ever see another transfer who started at a BCS conference team who is all conference go to a I-AA school (unless the guy was kicked out of one school like Randy Moss)

foghorn

June 30th, 2005, 03:18 PM

If you read carefully the UD posts about Holler you will note a wait and see attitude. I am excited about this prospect because the O-line is a problem area for this year's team not that this guy is the second coming. Holler is the more typical I-A transfer he is not getting playing time at PSU so he is leaving. Regarding transfers For every Andy Hall there are about 7 or 8 Ryan McDermonds. Didn't hear of McDermond? He was a transfer who played on the '03 team. He got in some on defense and played some on special teams. Most transfers are of the Ryan McDermond type they make a contribution but they are not that good and their prescence hardly warrants the hype the media gives them due to being a I-A transfer

Johnson and Hall are that good. They are the exceptions that prove the rule that most (not all) are not that good. Johnson is the extreme exception. I don't think I will ever see another transfer who started at a BCS conference team who is all conference go to a I-AA school (unless the guy was kicked out of one school like Randy Moss)

Blukeys is right. K C Keeler said on his last radio show that he gets around 200 inquiries per year from potential transfers from D-I-A. Last year I recall getting Riccio and maybe 1 more, this year two O-linemen. So, KC is very careful whom he accepts as transfers. They also need approval vote by the team.
In the past we've had anywhere from 1 to 5 per year, but they didn't get much press because they were not impact players. It is an entirely wrong assumption to think that because a player is tranferring "down" to Div. I-AA that he is automatically a superior athlete. For every Andy Hall there are 10 Ryan McDermonds. This is not to disparage Ryan since he fulfilled a need at the time, but he was an average Div. I-AA player.
I give Keeler credit for managing to sort out the truly talented transfer players, but it's much more important to successfully recruit those high school kids. Go Hens! :cool:

Tribe4SF

July 1st, 2005, 01:46 AM

Bluekeys, Foghorn and Chickenman are right on this. We get very few at W&M because it's so difficult to get them admitted. Elijah Brooks is the only transfer on our roster at the moment. Ryan Carty's older brother came in from UNC in '98 and was never a starter, despite sensational high school credentials.

It's interesting to me that probably the best transfer in the country last year was Gerald Sensabaugh for the Tar Heels. And he transferred from I-AA (ETSU) to I-A.

colgate13

July 1st, 2005, 09:16 AM

Ryan Carty's older brother came in from UNC in '98 and was never a starter, despite sensational high school credentials.

That's where Ryan ended up? I never knew that. I went to the same high school (but did not play with) the Cartys. They were legit in high school.

HensRock

July 1st, 2005, 09:23 AM

Actually Ryan is a backup QB at Delaware. Tribe4SF was saying that his older brother ended up at W&M. 13, if you went to high school with him, then you also might know another Hen transfer, Saul Freund, who I think came from Pitt.

http://eteamz.active.com/I-AAfootball/images/card_carty.gif

Tribe4SF

July 1st, 2005, 10:47 AM

Ryan's older brother was Kevin. He was a top-5 national QB coming out of high school, but UNC brought in Ronald Curry so Kevin transferred. He got a shot at the start of the '99 season, but was beaten out by a redshirt freshman named David Corley, the A-10 career total offense leader.

colgate13

July 1st, 2005, 10:58 AM

Kevin - that's right. He was the older one. Wasn't there also another brother, Sean maybe?

I didn't actually go to school with any of them (I'm not that young) but I followed their careers in high school and remember UNC and then never hearing about Kevin again.

BTW, Ryan's lost some hair, huh?

http://www.udel.edu/sportsinfo/football/carty-headshot.gif

I don't remember Saul Freund, but do you remember Matt Morrill, DE for the Hens in the early 90s? Same high school. Our playing days just missed each other. Matt is your all time sack leader if I remember correctly.

Edit: He is. Just checked your record books. He also has the record for career tackles for a loss and several other season stats that are listed. He was quite a player - a monster if I remember!

ChickenMan

July 1st, 2005, 11:08 AM

I don't remember Saul Freund, but do you remember Matt Morrill, DE for the Hens in the early 90s? Same high school. Our playing days just missed each other. Matt is your all time sack leader if I remember correctly.

Edit: He is. Just checked your record books. He also has the record for career tackles for a loss and several other season stats that are listed. He was quite a player - a monster if I remember!

I remember Morrill very well... an outstanding DE who could really rush the passer.

blukeys

July 1st, 2005, 11:09 AM

colgate13

July 1st, 2005, 11:53 AM

Your memory regarding Mr. Morrill is impeccable.

My hometown paper would run a weekly feature on him at UD for his junior and senior years if not just his senior. Every week you'd read about him tearing it up.

I think he tried out some places for the pros but never caught on. I think I remember the paper covering that too. He was legit and you knew who he was if you played ball at my school. Definite monster - but such a nice guy too. Heck of TE in high school as well.