Sports Network Poll; Oct. 20

[kdinva]

http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/misc/cfoot225poll.aspx



1.
North Dakota State Bison (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/gateway/teamsn.aspx?id=713) (152)
7-0
3848
1


2.
Eastern Washington Eagles (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/bigsky/teamsn.aspx?id=489) (2)
7-1
3676
2


3.
New Hampshire Wildcats (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/colonial/teamsn.aspx?id=556)
5-1
3402
3


4.
Coastal Carolina Chanticleers (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/bigsouth/teamsn.aspx?id=850)
7-0
3353
4


5.
Villanova Wildcats (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/colonial/teamsn.aspx?id=643)
6-1
3304
5


6.
Jacksonville State Gamecocks (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/ovc/teamsn.aspx?id=669)
5-1
2996
6


7.
Montana Grizzlies (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/bigsky/teamsn.aspx?id=548)
5-2
2941
7


8.
Southeastern Louisiana Lions (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/southland/teamsn.aspx?id=848)
6-2
2683
8


9.
Illinois State Redbirds (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/gateway/teamsn.aspx?id=514)
6-0
2448
10


10.
Montana State Bobcats (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/bigsky/teamsn.aspx?id=549)
6-2
2432
9


11.
McNeese State Cowboys (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/southland/teamsn.aspx?id=536)
4-2
2181
11


12.
Fordham Rams (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/patriot/teamsn.aspx?id=646)
6-1
2129
12


13.
South Dakota State Jackrabbits (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/gateway/teamsn.aspx?id=V36)
5-2
1759
18


14.
Bethune-Cookman Wildcats (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/meac/teamsn.aspx?id=466)
6-1
1733
16


15.
Chattanooga Mocs (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/southern/teamsn.aspx?id=606)
4-3
1584
17


16.
Richmond Spiders (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/colonial/teamsn.aspx?id=587)
5-2
1558
19


17.
Youngstown State Penguins (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/gateway/teamsn.aspx?id=641)
5-2
1492
21


18.
William & Mary Tribe (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/colonial/teamsn.aspx?id=637)
4-3
1191
15


19.
Eastern Kentucky Colonels (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/ovc/teamsn.aspx?id=494)
6-1
1097
13


20.
Southern Illinois Salukis (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/gateway/teamsn.aspx?id=595)
5-3
1014
14


21.
Harvard Crimson (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/ivy/teamsn.aspx?id=506)
5-0
711
25


22.
Indiana State Sycamores (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/gateway/teamsn.aspx?id=516)
4-3
563
22


23.
Northern Iowa Panthers (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/gateway/teamsn.aspx?id=568)
3-4
402
20


24.
Sacred Heart Pioneers (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/nec/teamsn.aspx?id=728)
6-1
390
NR


25.
Albany Great Danes (http://www.sportsnetwork.com/merge/tsnform.aspx?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/conf/colonial/teamsn.aspx?id=801)
5-2
221
NR


Others receiving votes: Bryant 119, Charleston Southern 114, Liberty 113, Missouri State 87, Western Carolina 56, Sam Houston State 40, Northwestern State 40, Grambling State 37, Dartmouth 30, James Madison 29, Wofford 22, Alcorn State 22, Delaware 21, Central Arkansas 21, Bucknell 21, North Carolina A&T 21, Jacksonville 20, Stephen F. Austin 14, Tennessee State 14, Western Illinois 13, Presbyterian 13, Northern Arizona 12, Cal Poly 11, Yale 10, Southeast Missouri State 10, Furman 9, South Carolina State 8, Samford 7, Idaho State 3, Monmouth 3, Duquesne 1, Lamar 1.

[MTfan4life]

Illinois State is undefeated. They have a 30+ point win over a top 15 team. They have a road win against a team who is ranked and another road win against a very solid WIU team. Yet, they're only 9th? Below Montana, SELA, and Coastal? It's a crime to put them anywhere lower than 6th, imo.

[knucklehead]

What a mess. Missouri st still out? Albany in?

[JMUNJ08]

My comments are many but I will keep it to 1:

ORV
Grambling St. - 37
JMU - 29

Now, tell me who outside of Grambling State's players and mothers would say that they are better than a mild JMU squad?

[TypicalTribe]

This poll seems to get less disastrous every week, at least.

[REALBird]

My only question is will the voters stick to not moving anyone in the top #10 without losing, or will they value some of the late season matchups of ranked teams playing within each conference?

Illinois St. beat also rans Ms. Valley State and Austin Peay, which shouldn't have moved the needle much IMHO. But beating then #25 EIU, then #9 SDSU, #22 Indiana State started the ascension in the polls. Beat a 4 loss WIU team who was #25 in the GPI, #29 in Massey, and still in the ORV category (13 votes). We still have Missouri State (#29, ORV, GPI #18), #23 UNI (GPI #12), #17 Youngstown State (GPI #19), South Dakota (Massey #55, GPI #39) and #20 Southern Illinois (GPI #7) left on the schedule.

If the remaining three teams on our schedule which are currently in the TSN Top 25 remain ranked, and Illinois St. can win out....that would be a total of six Top 25 wins and 9 victories over teams rated #55 or above in the GPI. Does that make the W's over Austin Peay & Ms. Valley State (still D-1 FCS schools) less impressive than say a D-II victory, or a lopsided loss versus a D-1 FBS school? Guess I'm just curious as to what moves the needle in the mind of pollsters late in the season? Or does it move at all if you don't lose?

I don't speak for the sentiments of all MVFC fans, but if we can somehow win out.......would it seem far fetched to believe we should get a top 4 seed? Still plenty of football to play, so not counting my chickens before they hatch. Just interested in the opinions of others.

[HailSzczur]

Didn't realize the votership wasn't the same from week to week. I was trying to compare Nova's total votes from last week to this week, and it was low because there were 6 less ballots cast this week.

[Grizzlies82]

My only question is will the voters stick to not moving anyone in the top #10 without losing, or will they value some of the late season matchups of ranked teams playing within each conference?

Illinois St. beat also rans Ms. Valley State and Austin Peay, which shouldn't have moved the needle much IMHO. But beating then #25 EIU, then #9 SDSU, #22 Indiana State started the ascension in the polls. Beat a 4 loss WIU team who was #25 in the GPI, #29 in Massey, and still in the ORV category (13 votes). We still have Missouri State (#29, ORV, GPI #18), #23 UNI (GPI #12), #17 Youngstown State (GPI #19), South Dakota (Massey #55, GPI #39) and #20 Southern Illinois (GPI #7) left on the schedule.

If the remaining three teams on our schedule which are currently in the TSN Top 25 remain ranked, and Illinois St. can win out....that would be a total of six Top 25 wins and 9 victories over teams rated #55 or above in the GPI. Does that make the W's over Austin Peay & Ms. Valley State (still D-1 FCS schools) less impressive than say a D-II victory, or a lopsided loss versus a D-1 FBS school? Guess I'm just curious as to what moves the needle in the mind of pollsters late in the season? Or does it move at all if you don't lose?

I don't speak for the sentiments of all MVFC fans, but if we can somehow win out.......would it seem far fetched to believe we should get a top 4 seed? Still plenty of football to play, so not counting my chickens before they hatch. Just interested in the opinions of others.

RealBird, typically it takes a loss to drop out of the top five or ten in the polls. About the only exception to that is if a team behind them did something extraordinary to jump ahead... ie... a #15 team beats the #1 or #2 by 35 points on the road. So stacking up good quality wins help but often won't jump you ahead in the poll unless someone ahead stumbles.

Yet keep in mind, the POLLS are not the same as the Playoff SEEDING. Stacking up those quality wins will have more impact on those who do the seeding than it will on those who vote in the polls.

[dewey]

My only question is will the voters stick to not moving anyone in the top #10 without losing, or will they value some of the late season matchups of ranked teams playing within each conference?

Illinois St. beat also rans Ms. Valley State and Austin Peay, which shouldn't have moved the needle much IMHO. But beating then #25 EIU, then #9 SDSU, #22 Indiana State started the ascension in the polls. Beat a 4 loss WIU team who was #25 in the GPI, #29 in Massey, and still in the ORV category (13 votes). We still have Missouri State (#29, ORV, GPI #18), #23 UNI (GPI #12), #17 Youngstown State (GPI #19), South Dakota (Massey #55, GPI #39) and #20 Southern Illinois (GPI #7) left on the schedule.

If the remaining three teams on our schedule which are currently in the TSN Top 25 remain ranked, and Illinois St. can win out....that would be a total of six Top 25 wins and 9 victories over teams rated #55 or above in the GPI. Does that make the W's over Austin Peay & Ms. Valley State (still D-1 FCS schools) less impressive than say a D-II victory, or a lopsided loss versus a D-1 FBS school? Guess I'm just curious as to what moves the needle in the mind of pollsters late in the season? Or does it move at all if you don't lose?

I don't speak for the sentiments of all MVFC fans, but if we can somehow win out.......would it seem far fetched to believe we should get a top 4 seed? Still plenty of football to play, so not counting my chickens before they hatch. Just interested in the opinions of others.

If Illinois State finishes the season undefeated they have got to be a top 4 seed. The resume would be very impressive. I still can't believe they are not a top 5-7 tteam in this poll.

Dewey

[TypicalTribe]

They are a clear #2 in the computers and will play a challenging schedule the rest of the way, as opposed to Villanova and especially UNH. I think they will definitely be a top 4 seed.

[Professor Chaos]

If Illinois State finishes the season undefeated they have got to be a top 4 seed. The resume would be very impressive. I still can't believe they are not a top 5-7 tteam in this poll.

Dewey
If Illinois St finishes the season undefeated they should be seeded #2 at worst.

[MTfan4life]

Yet keep in mind, the POLLS are not the same as the Playoff SEEDING.

Case in point, in 2010 Eastern Washington finished the season ranked #1 in both polls (TSN & Coaches), but were given the #5 seed. The polls and the seeds usually don't align.

[UNIFanSince1983]

If Illinois St finishes the season undefeated they should be seeded #2 at worst.

The problem is they would be seeded about 4th. The other problem is they aren't finishing undefeated.

[thebootfitter]

The problem is they would be seeded about 4th. The other problem is they aren't finishing undefeated.
I doubt an undefeated Illinois State team would be seeded that low. Historically, the committee has seeded undefeated and one-loss teams better than teams with a better poll ranking.

As to your second point... I tend to agree they'll likely drop at least one in the Valley.

[tribe_pride]

If Illinois St finishes the season undefeated they should be seeded #2 at worst.

Assuming these teams win out, ND State will be 1 and UNH, Nova, Illinois St., and E. Washington will be in the running for 2-5 seeds. The other 3 would only have 1 loss to FBS teams.

[Theee Catrabbit]

What I will be most interested in is if SDSU beats NDSU. UNI beats Ill St. NDSU beats UNI,.....what kind of round robin tizzy that will create in the MVFC and the polls(after SDSU beats YSU this week of course) all of that potential is there....

[UNIFanSince1983]

I doubt an undefeated Illinois State team would be seeded that low. Historically, the committee has seeded undefeated and one-loss teams better than teams with a better poll ranking.

As to your second point... I tend to agree they'll likely drop at least one in the Valley.

But can they seed them ahead of UNH, Villanova, and EWU if all those teams have 1 loss that is to an FBS?

I feel if all those teams win out you get:
1) NDSU
2) EWU
3) Nova
4) ISUr
5) UNH

Heck they might even give an undefeated CCU team a higher seed. This also makes it so the MVFC teams meet in the semis instead of the Finals.

[Professor Chaos]

But can they seed them ahead of UNH, Villanova, and EWU if all those teams have 1 loss that is to an FBS?

I feel if all those teams win out you get:
1) NDSU
2) EWU
3) Nova
4) ISUr
5) UNH

Heck they might even give an undefeated CCU team a higher seed. This also makes it so the MVFC teams meet in the semis instead of the Finals.
Yes, they could and they should IMO based on their relative strength of schedule and possible wins (based on the current AGS poll).

Illinois St would have quality wins over SDSU (11), YSU (15), SIU (17), ISUb (21), MSU (24), UNI (26), and WIU (35).
EWU's best wins would be UM (8), MSU (12), and ISU (32) with NAU and SHSU being borderline.
Villanova's best wins would be UR (9), Fordham (13), W&M (20), Albany (29), and JMU (31) with UD being borderline.

Even if you count the borderline teams for EWU and Villanova, Illinois St would still have 8 quality wins to 5 and 6 for EWU and Villanova. I understand that the MVFC will beat up on each other and knock each other down the polls but so will the CAA and Big Sky teams. I just think that with the strength of the MVFC this year if both NDSU and Illinois St go undefeated they'll be the top 2 seeds regardless of what anyone else does or if only one of those teams goes undefeated they'll be the top seed.

[dewey]

But can they seed them ahead of UNH, Villanova, and EWU if all those teams have 1 loss that is to an FBS?

I feel if all those teams win out you get:
1) NDSU
2) EWU
3) Nova
4) ISUr
5) UNH

Heck they might even give an undefeated CCU team a higher seed. This also makes it so the MVFC teams meet in the semis instead of the Finals.

I agree with your list of teams assuming they all finish undefeated. It would be interesting to see how they handle EWU, Villanova and UNH since their only losses are to FBS teams with EWU and Villanova having a chance to win those games late. Illinois State had a very weak OOC schedule but going undefeated through the MVFC. would be pretty impressive.

If those teams finish the rest of the season undefeated I think they would be above Coastal Carolina. CCU would have a solid win over Liberty, possibly Furman, possibly NC A&T and possibly Charleston Southern.

Dewey

[kalm]

Yes, they could and they should IMO based on their relative strength of schedule and possible wins (based on the current AGS poll).

Illinois St would have quality wins over SDSU (11), YSU (15), SIU (17), ISUb (21), MSU (24), UNI (26), and WIU (35).
EWU's best wins would be UM (8), MSU (12), and ISU (32) with NAU and SHSU being borderline.
Villanova's best wins would be UR (9), Fordham (13), W&M (20), Albany (29), and JMU (31) with UD being borderline.

Even if you count the borderline teams for EWU and Villanova, Illinois St would still have 8 quality wins to 5 and 6 for EWU and Villanova. I understand that the MVFC will beat up on each other and knock each other down the polls but so will the CAA and Big Sky teams. I just think that with the strength of the MVFC this year if both NDSU and Illinois St go undefeated they'll be the top 2 seeds regardless of what anyone else does or if only one of those teams goes undefeated they'll be the top seed.

Very good breakdown, thanks!

FWIW, NAU and ISU would be the favorite in all but 1 of their remaining games so there's a chance that our quality wins criteria could catch up a bit. Not saying it's going to happen, but it's conceivable that we could have wins over 6 teams with 8 or more wins including an FBS.