Recruiting pipelines

[MplsBison]

Off season discussion here.

Does your FCS team have a significant number of players all from the same region of the country such that the region is a considerable distance away from the school? Could be high school, JUCO or both.

NDSU tried this at various times under Bohl's regime. Most notably was the attempt with high school players from Houston, TX. There were probably 15 high school players from the area brought up to Fargo in a few years period. All of them were of course full scholarship players. I doubt that any of their families would have been able to afford sending their kid to Fargo to pay maximum, out of state tuition rates (I think about 15k at NDSU plus R&B, fees, books, etc. probably around 25k in direct educational costs per year).

Of those probably only five were significant contributors and I can only think of three off the top of my head who were starters.

At other times Bohl tried bringing in players (high school and JUCO) from California, Arizona and Mississippi, with varying degrees of success.


Now, NDSU's roster only contains two high school players from AZ (both of which will probably be contributors) and none left from CA, TX or MS.

However, the current coaching staff is trying to start a new pipeline. This time, to central Florida. Three high school players signed in the 2013 class. Two more were announced for the 2014 class and now another (late signee) has been shown on an NDSU fan website.

It makes me wonder why this staff thinks they can change history and do better than what Bohl was able to accomplish with Houston.



So how about the rest of FCS? What are your experiences? And do you think it's a good thing, bad thing or you don't care where players come from?

[NoDak 4 Ever]

I think it largely depends on the assistant coaches. Willie Mack Garza was NDSU's Texas connection and when he left for Tennessee, that was over. Florida seemed an odd choice to me but with the abundance of players there, it seems there are plenty to go around.

Doesn't hurt playing indoors either.

[Tribe4SF]

Tribe has a long running pipeline from Atlanta which went dry this year. No doubt it will continue in the future, though. Players from there have been major contributors over the years. Four starters last year including a Captain, leading rusher, and leading receiver. Will have three starters from there this year.

[RichH2]

Agree to a certain extent that assts do help locate areas of interest. For us,over last few yrs W and N Florida,Ga,Mich and the Carolinas seem to get most miles and results.

[bonarae]

The Ivies' rosters these days are primarily composed of players from the south and west regions, though we still do get some Northeast based players... and also once in a while, we get one or two Canadians as well. (Most recent example of a Canadian Ivy player: Harvard's Marco Iannuzzi, now a star in the CFL.)

[Pard4Life]

Oddly, Lafayette has strong connections in Florida. We usually have about 8 guys on the roster from there, mostly from the Gulf side too.

I think we are trying to build a connection to California... we have been hitting recruits from some Catholic or Prep league that's big out there... think San Juan Capistrano and Thousand Oaks... those places.

Also, some success in Colorado, but don't know if it's a long-term pipeline.

[CrazyCat]

I think it largely depends on the assistant coaches. .


Agree 100% We didn't get into Texas until an assistant coach had connections there . It's all about the coaches building relationships with the area they are recruiting.

[lionsrking2]

Our Head Coach is from California, and played in the Cali JC system, so naturally, we have ties there ... through our assistants, we also have connections in south Florida, Houston, Austin, Dallas, and various other locales across the country ... we even have a redshirt freshman from Hawaii who shows a lot of promise on the O-line.

[Bogus Megapardus]

Oddly, Lafayette has strong connections in Florida. We usually have about 8 guys on the roster from there, mostly from the Gulf side too.

I think we are trying to build a connection to California... we have been hitting recruits from some Catholic or Prep league that's big out there... think San Juan Capistrano and Thousand Oaks... those places.

Also, some success in Colorado, but don't know if it's a long-term pipeline.

Coach T. addressed this question directly. Lafayette's recruiting pipelines are, in the coach's words, "any place where you can get a direct flight from Lehigh Valley International Airport." That means Atlanta, Charlotte, Orlando, St. Petersburg, Chicago, Washington, Cleveland, Wichita, and Detroit. Denver also has been in the mix for a while now, as has Minneapolis/St Paul. Both can be reached directly from Mercer/Trenton (NJ) Airport (next to Princeton). That isn't too much farther from the Bourger Frankosaurium, it is quite easy to get in and out of, and it's a very pleasant drive to/from Pardsville. The L.A./Orange County thing is an entirely new phenomenon (for football, although not basketball). Just like Lawn Guyland, you can't really get there from here.

[Nickels]

SHSU will be solely made up of Delawareans in the next few years.

[Bogus Megapardus]

SHSU will be solely made up of Delawareans in the next few years.

When do SHSU fans start sporting their K.C. Keeler AGS avatars? xrolleyesx

Seriously, though, the Blue Hens typically have had very, very few in-state players - players who actually came from Delaware. Geographically, Keeler's rosters always looked a lot like Villanova/W&M/UNH/Patriot League rosters. The State of Delaware really doesn't have many strong H.S. football programs. Delaware fans, correct me if I'm wrong here.

That said, I imagine that Keeler will try to bring some northeastern kids down to Huntsville. That would be unusual for SHSU, would it not? There's a lot of competition for those kids, though.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

Lehigh's would be Eastern PA, New Jersey, Florida and Ohio. They've also had success in Georgia.

Lehigh hasn't recruited Western PA and Texas heavily in the past....

[MR. CHICKEN]

SHSU will be solely made up of Delawareans in the next few years.


18983.......DELAWAREANS.......DON'T EVEN [email protected]!

.......................KC......LIKED DUH FLORIDA/GEORGIA LINE....TA AUGMENT......NY/NJ/PA/MD/VA.......AWK!

[Bogus Megapardus]

Lehigh's would be Eastern PA, New Jersey, Florida and Ohio. They've also had success in Georgia.

Lehigh hasn't recruited Western PA and Texas heavily in the past....


18983.......DELAWAREANS.......DON'T EVEN [email protected]!

.......................KC......LIKED DUH FLORIDA/GEORGIA LINE....TA AUGMENT......NY/NJ/PA/MD/VA.......AWK!


I'm still waiting for a Delaware/Lehigh game so I can have a little photoshop phun with Foghorn and Henry.





http://www.sitcomsonline.com/photopost/data/3429/Pepe7011FoghornLHeneryChickenHawk.jpg

[MplsBison]

Sounds like most of the fans who have replied on here experienced positive results from their respective pipelines.

In that case, I would not expect there to be any negative feelings towards out of region players by those fans. Or am I wrong?


My own feelings on that topic are well known, driven by NDSU's overall failure in the area. So I won't expand unless someone wants me to.

[RichH2]

LU has tried Cal with very little success. A number transferred back to W coast. Same issue w Tx.

[MR. CHICKEN]

18990............BRAWK!

[MR. CHICKEN]

18991...........AWK!

[MR. CHICKEN]

[QUOTE=RichH2;2110644]LU has tried Cal with very little success. A number transferred back to W coast. Same issue w Tx.[/QUOT



18994.....ONE NEGATIVE.....WHEN RECRUITIN'......OUTTAH YER.......ESTABLISHED PIPELINE......SOME...PLAYERS FROM DUH SOUFF.......LEFT COAST......WHOM GO NORFF-EAST.......AFTERAH FOOTBALL SEASON.....GET LONESOME...DISLIKE WINTERAH WEATHERAH....GET BORED......MAYBEAH GET IN SOME TROUBLE....ETC...........AWK!

[MR. CHICKEN]

18995.......YEAH....DAT RIGHT..........JES' FIGURED OUT...HOW TA ENLARGE....DUH THUMBIES.............xsmugx.......DOODLE-DOO!

[darell1976]

Muss tried to get players from out west like Arizona and California, Bubba is sticking to more Midwestern areas especially Minnesota (Twin Cities metro) and Wisconsin.

[Red & Black]

The Bay Area of Cali seems to be a pipeline for EWU. Several good players coming out of there the past several years. EWU recruits WA, CA, OR, AZ...probably in that order.


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[lionsrking2]

Sounds like most of the fans who have replied on here experienced positive results from their respective pipelines.

In that case, I would not expect there to be any negative feelings towards out of region players by those fans. Or am I wrong?


My own feelings on that topic are well known, driven by NDSU's overall failure in the area. So I won't expand unless someone wants me to.

The only folks who seem to have negative feelings towards our out-of-state players are our opponents, or locals who never come to games, yet bitch about Little Johnny not getting a scholarship. That said, an overwhelming number of kids on our roster are from in-state, or within a couple hours drive of Hammond, extending into Mississippi.

[MplsBison]

.....ONE NEGATIVE.....WHEN RECRUITIN'......OUTTAH YER.......ESTABLISHED PIPELINE......SOME...PLAYERS FROM DUH SOUFF.......LEFT COAST......WHOM GO NORFF-EAST.......AFTERAH FOOTBALL SEASON.....GET LONESOME...DISLIKE WINTERAH WEATHERAH....GET BORED......MAYBEAH GET IN SOME TROUBLE....ETC...........AWK!

Another thing is if they don't get playing time right away, I think they start questioning themselves. Like, "why the heck am I up here in the freezing cold, with all these white people, thousands of miles from everything and everyone I know and love..."

I don't blame them for a second if they decide to go home. It's an unnatural situation.

[NoDak 4 Ever]

Sounds like most of the fans who have replied on here experienced positive results from their respective pipelines.

In that case, I would not expect there to be any negative feelings towards out of region players by those fans. Or am I wrong?


My own feelings on that topic are well known, driven by NDSU's overall failure in the area. So I won't expand unless someone wants me to.

I'd bet everyone else would like to fail as badly as NDSU.


Amirite?

[Professor Chaos]

I think the popular misconception is that you need to go to Texas, California, or the southeast to get players with the speed and athleticism to play the skill positions. NDSU has won every game last en route to a national title with RBs from Minnesota and Illinois, a QB from Wisconsin, WRs from Minnesota and the Dakotas, and TEs from Minnesota. Defensively the starting secondary came entirely out of Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Nebraska and the starting LBs came entirely from Minnesota and North Dakota.

NDSU's recruiting coordinators are much smarter than I when it comes to deciding where to recruit but, truth be told, I'd rather see them spend recruiting resources in the upper Midwest than in Florida because I think retention is better. In any case it's not like NDSU is relying on Florida for recruiting, it's just a supplementary pipeline so I consider it more of a high risk/high reward gamble.

[Bison Fan in NW MN]

I think the popular misconception is that you need to go to Texas, California, or the southeast to get players with the speed and athleticism to play the skill positions. NDSU has won every game last en route to a national title with RBs from Minnesota and Illinois, a QB from Wisconsin, WRs from Minnesota and the Dakotas, and TEs from Minnesota. Defensively the starting secondary came entirely out of Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Nebraska and the starting LBs came entirely from Minnesota and North Dakota.

NDSU's recruiting coordinators are much smarter than I when it comes to deciding where to recruit but, truth be told, I'd rather see them spend recruiting resources in the upper Midwest than in Florida because I think retention is better. In any case it's not like NDSU is relying on Florida for recruiting, it's just a supplementary pipeline so I consider it more of a high risk/high reward gamble.


Good post

Plus there are always 'diamonds in the rough' that walk on that are from the region like Danny Luecke. Walked on and worked hard and earned a scholly and a lot of playing time.

There is a young kid here in Fertile (class of '15) that has interest from UND and NDSU. Now he has gotten a interest letter from Michigan State and Nebraska wanting him to come to their summer camps to get a better look at him. He is pretty excited but wants to stay close to home to play.

[Sader87]

Holy Cross, like the other PL and Ivy schools, has a more "national scope" to recruiting. Not being a public school, I don't think there's been much grumbling over the years of not recruiting local talent.

As for pipelines, historically (dating back to when HC gave schollies) HC had a pretty good feeder system in many of the Catholic high schools around the country. My roommate at HC played at Jesuit HS (Dallas) for instance. Hopefully with the return of schollies that pipeline will renew/continue. The rising Soph/last year's starting QB was a Loyola HS (Chicago) grad as an example.

[FargoBison]

I think it largely depends on the assistant coaches. Willie Mack Garza was NDSU's Texas connection and when he left for Tennessee, that was over. Florida seemed an odd choice to me but with the abundance of players there, it seems there are plenty to go around.

Doesn't hurt playing indoors either.

Atif Austin our new assistant was a high school coach in Florida and an assistant for Stetson. So there is a coaching connection.

I think another new pipleline closer to Fargo NDSU fans will see emerge is St Louis.

[Bogus Megapardus]

Holy Cross, like the other PL and Ivy schools, has a more "national scope" to recruiting. Not being a public school, I don't think there's been much grumbling over the years of not recruiting local talent.

As for pipelines, historically (dating back to when HC gave schollies) HC had a pretty good feeder system in many of the Catholic high schools around the country. My roommate at HC played at Jesuit HS (Dallas) for instance. Hopefully with the return of schollies that pipeline will renew/continue. The rising Soph/last year's starting QB was a Loyola HS (Chicago) grad as an example.

I count 12 kids from the local area on the current Lafayette roster. That's about typical for a PL school, I'd imagine. I know Georgetown has only 3 or 4 from Metro D.C., though.

[SFA 93]

The majority of our players come from the piney woods of East Texas and greater Houston Area. The second biggest recruiting hot bed for SFA would be the Dallas Metroplex area and finally a handful come from Central Texas (Waco area).

Only 6 players on the roster outside the state of Texas…

2 Louisiana
1 Arkansas
1 Florida
1 Mississippi
1 American Samoa

No Yankees allowed! :)

[Bogus Megapardus]

American Samoa

Still waiting for that first Samoan to bulk up our OL. xnodx

[WestCoastAggie]

A&T, along with many other MEAC schools have players from Atlanta too especially from Dekalb County.

Murray State always seem to have a player or 4 from Florida.

[chattownmocs]

Tennessee, Georgia, Alabama, Florida...

[MplsBison]

I'd bet everyone else would like to fail as badly as NDSU.

Amirite?

NDSU has one of the luckiest recruiting situations in the nation. They're the dominate FCS program in ND and SD and then in the prime recruiting states (MN, WI and NE) have only a single DI football program and in all cases it's a B1G program that (mostly) overlooks in-state talent. That leaves NDSU as the biggest, most important program recruiting those states. We'll never beat those B1G programs head to head, but we'll usually beat out any FCS team for a kid we want and even some FBS teams.

[MplsBison]

I think the popular misconception is that you need to go to Texas, California, or the southeast to get players with the speed and athleticism to play the skill positions. NDSU has won every game last en route to a national title with RBs from Minnesota and Illinois, a QB from Wisconsin, WRs from Minnesota and the Dakotas, and TEs from Minnesota. Defensively the starting secondary came entirely out of Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Nebraska and the starting LBs came entirely from Minnesota and North Dakota.

NDSU's recruiting coordinators are much smarter than I when it comes to deciding where to recruit but, truth be told, I'd rather see them spend recruiting resources in the upper Midwest than in Florida because I think retention is better. In any case it's not like NDSU is relying on Florida for recruiting, it's just a supplementary pipeline so I consider it more of a high risk/high reward gamble.

Great post! And I agree 100%. Rather than paying for 10 yearly trips for assistants to Florida, that money is better spent sending coaches to Mpls, Milwaukee and Omaha for the same cost. That's only my opinion, of course.

[MplsBison]

Atif Austin our new assistant was a high school coach in Florida and an assistant for Stetson. So there is a coaching connection.

I think another new pipleline closer to Fargo NDSU fans will see emerge is St Louis.

Reggie Moore was a high school coach in Houston. He's the guy who brought all those Houston kids up to Fargo (I'm sure Garza helped as well).

So having connections doesn't necessarily mean you'll be able to retain those kids once they get up to Fargo, find out how different things are culturally there, go through the first winter and then battle in spring practice for a chance at playing time. If it doesn't come, it's no wonder they say "forget this". And that's of course assuming grades stay up through the first fall and winter.

[Bogus Megapardus]

When I was in college (way back when) we had a kid from Minot, ND. Perhaps the one and only ever.

So I'm wondering . . . is Minot a UND recruiting area or a NDSU recruiting area? It's way out in the middle of the state.

[NoDak 4 Ever]

When I was in college (way back when) we had a kid from Minot, ND. Perhaps the one and only ever.

So I'm wondering . . . is Minot a UND recruiting area or a NDSU recruiting area? It's way out in the middle of the state.

All of ND is a recruiting area for both. If he's good enough, NDSU will get him.


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[Bogus Megapardus]

All of ND is a recruiting area for both. If he's good enough, NDSU will get him.

You have a monopoly. Be thankful you're not Pennsylvania - the statewide competition for recruits is practically unfathomable.

[IBleedYellow]

You have a monopoly. Be thankful you're not Pennsylvania - the statewide competition for recruits is practically unfathomable.

They don't make it very hard for us. Unless the kid grew up hating NDSU, if we want them, and we know they can play here, we'll get them.

They throw the majority of their eggs into the hockey basket, mens and womens hockey comes before football.



That said, for other sports it's definitely a crap shoot as to who will get them.

[frozennorth]

i think culture has a lot to do with it. Texas is just different than North Dakota. I think florida works better because in reality, large parts of florida are just midwestern transplants.

I think the other advantage for florida is that Floridian football seems to be more in keeping with the physical style of NDSU, while Texas is overly invested in the spread.

[MplsBison]

i think culture has a lot to do with it. Texas is just different than North Dakota. I think florida works better because in reality, large parts of florida are just midwestern transplants.

I think the other advantage for florida is that Floridian football seems to be more in keeping with the physical style of NDSU, while Texas is overly invested in the spread.

That's an interesting idea. I guess we'll find out in a few years, once these first recruits come through the program.

I have my doubts however that these particular central Florida recruits are any different than those Houston players in both regards. I doubt that their parents were midwestern transplants or that their Lakeland communities were much like Fargo at all, in terms of demographics, socio-economics and culture. And finally, I would be open to correction - but my general assumption of all southern high school football is that all of their offenses are basketball on grass: the linemen are in lazy two points stances (almost standing straight up), the QB always in shotgun (even if it's fourth and a half yard to go), a single scat back next to the QB, the QB holds the ball out for a lazy fake as the back drags across him, then the QB throws a duck up to one of four or five basketball players for a jump ball.

[NoDak 4 Ever]

Is he as much of a bigot as the previous one?

Anyway. Liberty is just a religious University of Phoenix.

[MplsBison]

AGS mod deleted my post.

[frozennorth]

That's an interesting idea. I guess we'll find out in a few years, once these first recruits come through the program.

I have my doubts however that these particular central Florida recruits are any different than those Houston players in both regards. I doubt that their parents were midwestern transplants or that their Lakeland communities were much like Fargo at all, in terms of demographics, socio-economics and culture. And finally, I would be open to correction - but my general assumption of all southern high school football is that all of their offenses are basketball on grass: the linemen are in lazy two points stances (almost standing straight up), the QB always in shotgun (even if it's fourth and a half yard to go), a single scat back next to the QB, the QB holds the ball out for a lazy fake as the back drags across him, then the QB throws a duck up to one of four or five basketball players for a jump ball.
no.

[citdog]

That's an interesting idea. I guess we'll find out in a few years, once these first recruits come through the program.

I have my doubts however that these particular central Florida recruits are any different than those Houston players in both regards. I doubt that their parents were midwestern transplants or that their Lakeland communities were much like Fargo at all, in terms of demographics, socio-economics and culture. And finally, I would be open to correction - but my general assumption of all southern high school football is that all of their offenses are basketball on grass: the linemen are in lazy two points stances (almost standing straight up), the QB always in shotgun (even if it's fourth and a half yard to go), a single scat back next to the QB, the QB holds the ball out for a lazy fake as the back drags across him, then the QB throws a duck up to one of four or five basketball players for a jump ball.

That's an AWFUL amount of "LAZY'S" in reference to Southerners who play football. Stereotype much?

[Nickels]

That's an interesting idea. I guess we'll find out in a few years, once these first recruits come through the program.

I have my doubts however that these particular central Florida recruits are any different than those Houston players in both regards. I doubt that their parents were midwestern transplants or that their Lakeland communities were much like Fargo at all, in terms of demographics, socio-economics and culture. And finally, I would be open to correction - but my general assumption of all southern high school football is that all of their offenses are basketball on grass: the linemen are in lazy two points stances (almost standing straight up), the QB always in shotgun (even if it's fourth and a half yard to go), a single scat back next to the QB, the QB holds the ball out for a lazy fake as the back drags across him, then the QB throws a duck up to one of four or five basketball players for a jump ball.
You obviously haven't watched much southern high school football.

[Nickels]

That said, I imagine that Keeler will try to bring some northeastern kids down to Huntsville. That would be unusual for SHSU, would it not? There's a lot of competition for those kids, though.
I can't name one NE player ever at SHSU. Not that there hasn't been a few but I can't think of one. Their definitely hasn't been one that contributed the last few years. Hell, the only good recent out of state player I can think of is Flanders (OK).

We do have a redshirt freshman from Missouri competing for the starting QB job though.

[344Johnson]

You obviously haven't watched much southern high school football.

I haven't watched much if any of it... But Im thinking that if the hurry up spread was in North Dakota back when I was in high school (2010 grad).... It's probably already out of style out east ;)

Veer back in style I'm guessing?? :D

[darell1976]

All of ND is a recruiting area for both. If he's good enough, NDSU will get him.


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Now that Bubba is back at UND we should see more ND kids than in previous years with Mussman. Bubba has more homegrown connections in this area, and once he gets this team back to where we were prior to the move up NDSU will finally get some home state competition.

[chattownmocs]

I think the popular misconception is that you need to go to Texas, California, or the southeast to get players with the speed and athleticism to play the skill positions. NDSU has won every game last en route to a national title with RBs from Minnesota and Illinois, a QB from Wisconsin, WRs from Minnesota and the Dakotas, and TEs from Minnesota. Defensively the starting secondary came entirely out of Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Nebraska and the starting LBs came entirely from Minnesota and North Dakota.

NDSU's recruiting coordinators are much smarter than I when it comes to deciding where to recruit but, truth be told, I'd rather see them spend recruiting resources in the upper Midwest than in Florida because I think retention is better. In any case it's not like NDSU is relying on Florida for recruiting, it's just a supplementary pipeline so I consider it more of a high risk/high reward gamble.


BS, No one has that misconception about winning at the FCS level. If an FCS school gets the 300th or 400th best players from Florida or Texas it is a major get. Basically those SHSU teams you guys blasted were guys that were believed to be anywhere from 300-600 best in the state the year they graduated. Im sure you guys have gotten some of the very best players from you area.

[MplsBison]

Now that Bubba is back at UND we should see more ND kids than in previous years with Mussman. Bubba has more homegrown connections in this area, and once he gets this team back to where we were prior to the move up NDSU will finally get some home state competition.

It'll be interesting to see Bubba head to head with Randy! Especially with Randy wearing Green & Gold. That has to make some old timey Sioux football fans exclaim "Say it ain't so!"

[MplsBison]

BS, No one has that misconception about winning at the FCS level. If an FCS school gets the 300th or 400th best players from Florida or Texas it is a major get. Basically those SHSU teams you guys blasted were guys that were believed to be anywhere from 300-600 best in the state the year they graduated. Im sure you guys have gotten some of the very best players from you area.

Up north they have that misconception. They think if you're from the north, it's impossible to run fast or be a skill player in DI football.

[Nickels]

Blasted xcoffeex

Which games were you watching?

THIS is blasted

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9Lq8uBGInc