PATSY Ratings - Fordham's Class of 2018

[Lehigh Football Nation]

http://lehighfootballnation.blogspot.com/2014/02/patsy-ratings-fordhams-class-of-2018.html

Did they beat Colgate on points? Will there be more controversy?

[jimbo65]

As to the small no. of recruits, 10, we have 4 or 5 five year players on for this season so you could say we have 14 or 15, if that makes sense.

[RichH2]

No space fillers in this class . Impressive,not likely that Rams will suffer much from a small xlass next year. 5th yrs are great but as with everything they come with a cost. Having a lot of them raises that cost exponentially a couple of years down the road. Course. Moorhead may be at UCONN by thenxcoolx

[Fordham]

Wow - never would have thought that a class of 10 could have generated 63 Patsy points. Nice.

With Klecko transferring in on the DL and five 5th year players coming back, including some really impactful ones, this is a great group imo. To Rich's point, though, we are clearly doubling down on making a run as deep as we can in '14. Imo, when you have a chance to go for it, you go for it ... and that's clearly what we're doing. There will be a cost for it in having to recruit a class of 25 next year but so be it, imo.

Well done, guys. Thanks for the work

[RichH2]

Expect Rams will be even better next yr if Moorhead gets a D for them. Klecko and Thorpe sure a pretty good startxthumbsupx

[Franks Tanks]

This is not a knock of Fordham, but they proably have more transfers and more importantly more 5th year guys than the rest of the league combined.

[RichH2]

This is not a knock of Fordham, but they proably have more transfers and more importantly more 5th year guys than the rest of the league combined.

A bit overstated FT. Moorhead clearly aiming to peak while he has Nebrich Doubt he'll be around once Nebrich leaves. Up to the rest of us to improve our own teams to thwart him.xthumbsupx

His recruits have to meet the same AI floor as the rest of us. Cross and Pards have QBs at least as good as Nebrich,should be an interesting seasonxcoffeex

[carney2]

THE STANDINGS (With 4 To Go):
1. COLGATE 76
2. FORDHAM 63
3. BUCKNELL 39

[ngineer]

A bit overstated FT. Moorhead clearly aiming to peak while he has Nebrich Doubt he'll be around once Nebrich leaves. Up to the rest of us to improve our own teams to thwart him.xthumbsupx

His recruits have to meet the same AI floor as the rest of us. Cross and Pards have QBs at least as good as Nebrich,should be an interesting seasonxcoffeex

Disagree on this. Both HC and LC's QBs are good and likely to get better, but Nebrich is in a class by himself. Imo, better than Skelton.

[RichH2]

Dont disagree n , stirring the pot.

[Fordham]

No question Nebrich is the cream of the crop for PL QB's. He is eligible to apply for another season after this as well due to his injury plagued one last year.

Forgot to mention that Justin Yancey, who I believe was all-PL as a NG (position of need) has returned to the team after leaving school last year. Between him, Klecko, the incoming frosh and a year of weight training for last year's frosh who saw considerable playing time, DL could become an area of strength for us.

[ngineer]

No question Nebrich is the cream of the crop for PL QB's. He is eligible to apply for another season after this as well due to his injury plagued one last year.

Forgot to mention that Justin Yancey, who I believe was all-PL as a NG (position of need) has returned to the team after leaving school last year. Between him, Klecko, the incoming frosh and a year of weight training for last year's frosh who saw considerable playing time, DL could become an area of strength for us.

I don't think Nebrich missed that many games to qualify for a medical redshirt. I am not up on the intricacies of the rule, but I thought you had to miss at least a majority if not a 'super majority' of games to qualify for a fifth year? I'm thinking of Lehigh's RB Barkett a few years back who broke his ankle in his senior season in about the 8th game. I seem to recall that he was not eligible.

[JoltinJoe]

I'm going to take exception to the statement that Fordham, if eligible, would have lost the autobid to Lafayette.

If that game had meant something to Fordham, as I understand it, Nebrich would have started. He was kept out of the game for precautionary reasons and because the game was not really meaningful for Fordham.

[CFBfan]

I'm going to take exception to the statement that Fordham, if eligible, would have lost the autobid to Lafayette.

If that game had meant something to Fordham, as I understand it, Nebrich would have started. He was kept out of the game for precautionary reasons and because the game was not really meaningful for Fordham.

I respectfuly DISAGREE. That game DID mean something to FU.

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I don't think Nebrich missed that many games to qualify for a medical redshirt. I am not up on the intricacies of the rule, but I thought you had to miss at least a majority if not a 'super majority' of games to qualify for a fifth year? I'm thinking of Lehigh's RB Barkett a few years back who broke his ankle in his senior season in about the 8th game. I seem to recall that he was not eligible.


I agree engineer, he played most of the season, he does not qualify

[JoltinJoe]

I respectfuly DISAGREE. That game DID mean something to FU.

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I agree engineer, he played most of the season, he does not qualify

If the game had meant something, Nebrich would have started.

Nebrich played in fewer than three games in 2012. He has already qualified for a medical red-shirt and will get it when and if he applies for it.

Here is an article from the NY Post from August 2013 which correctly refers to Nebrich as a red-shirt sophomore: http://nypost.com/2013/08/11/fordham-football-looking-to-take-next-step-2/

[CFBfan]

If the game had meant something, Nebrich would have started.

Nebrich played in fewer than three games in 2012. He has already qualified for a medical red-shirt and will get it when and if he applies for it.

Here is an article from the NY Post from August 2013 which correctly refers to Nebrich as a red-shirt sophomore: http://nypost.com/2013/08/11/fordham-football-looking-to-take-next-step-2/

here is the quote to launch this debate: Originally Posted by Fordham http://www.anygivensaturday.com/images/SeamusLight/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.anygivensaturday.com/showthread.php?p=2095793#post2095793) No question Nebrich is the cream of the crop for PL QB's. He is eligible to apply for another season after this as well due to his injury plagued one last year.

"Fordham" poster said LAST year NOT 2012! 2 completely different issues and you can SPECULATE all you want about the LC loss it's your opinion and others can disagree.

[CFBfan]

[QUOTE=JoltinJoe;2095880]If the game had meant something, Nebrich would have started.


the LC game meant plenty!! FU barely got past Bucknell the prior week for it's 10th win.....by NO MEANS securing them an at large bid. No one outside of FU fans was as high on FU from pre season straight thru than me so let's deal with reality!!! and at the end of the day the last time i looked, injuries are a part of the game!

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Whether injured or held out, Fordham lost to Lafayette, and had Fordham been eligible for the PL autobid, they wouldn't have gotten it.

FWIW I felt Nebrich was hurt the last 1/3 of the season - he was still great but he didn't have the same mobility that he did in October. I think it played a part in the loss to Towson, for that matter.

More related to this thread, Nebrich yielded 0 Patsy points for his team.

With potential impact transfer guys like Nebrich coming into PL programs (and getting announced as such), that means something needs to change in regards to transfers.

The question is, how?

[Fordham]

here is the quote to launch this debate: Originally Posted by Fordham http://www.anygivensaturday.com/images/SeamusLight/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.anygivensaturday.com/showthread.php?p=2095793#post2095793) No question Nebrich is the cream of the crop for PL QB's. He is eligible to apply for another season after this as well due to his injury plagued one last year.

"Fordham" poster said LAST year NOT 2012! 2 completely different issues and you can SPECULATE all you want about the LC loss it's your opinion and others can disagree.
Ha! Just a mistake on my part. The redshirt obviously comes from his barely played in '12 season rather than '13 where he only missed one game.

Sorry for the ridiculous rabbit trail. Point still stands IMO that he's the cream of the crop and has one more year left if he chooses to take it

[CFBfan]

Ha! Just a mistake on my part. The redshirt obviously comes from his barely played in '12 season rather than '13 where he only missed one game.

Sorry for the ridiculous rabbit trail. Point still stands IMO that he's the cream of the crop and has one more year left if he chooses to take it

No apology needed!! it was jolted, er i mean joltin joe that got carreid away with himself! and I agree that he's the cream of the crop,

[van]

Whether injured or held out, Fordham lost to Lafayette, and had Fordham been eligible for the PL autobid, they wouldn't have gotten it.

FWIW I felt Nebrich was hurt the last 1/3 of the season - he was still great but he didn't have the same mobility that he did in October. I think it played a part in the loss to Towson, for that matter.

More related to this thread, Nebrich yielded 0 Patsy points for his team.

With potential impact transfer guys like Nebrich coming into PL programs (and getting announced as such), that means something needs to change in regards to transfers.

The question is, how?

Until PL starts getting a lot of transfers (a la blue chickens), suggest that committee make qualitative adjustment for transfers.

[carney2]

Until PL starts getting a lot of transfers (a la blue chickens), suggest that committee make qualitative adjustment for transfers.

Too subjective. Part of the charm of the Patsies is that they are about as objective as one can get in this area.

Whatever is done about transfers, The Committee had better order in a large supply of midnight oil.

[ngineer]

If the game had meant something, Nebrich would have started.

Nebrich played in fewer than three games in 2012. He has already qualified for a medical red-shirt and will get it when and if he applies for it.

Here is an article from the NY Post from August 2013 which correctly refers to Nebrich as a red-shirt sophomore: http://nypost.com/2013/08/11/fordham-football-looking-to-take-next-step-2/


That's different as to 2012. You said 'due to his injury plagued season last year', which I interpreted at 2013. You don't get two years to MRS. He may get one for 2012 as I don't know the math on how many games he suited up for. If he as a bang-up year in 2014, I wouldn't be surprised to see him go pro ala Towson's West. If he gets signs that he would get drafted, he may decide to get the money, now, (i.e. 2015)rather than wait another season and risk injury.

- - - Updated - - -


If the game had meant something, Nebrich would have started.

Nebrich played in fewer than three games in 2012. He has already qualified for a medical red-shirt and will get it when and if he applies for it.

Here is an article from the NY Post from August 2013 which correctly refers to Nebrich as a red-shirt sophomore: http://nypost.com/2013/08/11/fordham-football-looking-to-take-next-step-2/


That's different as to 2012. You said 'due to his injury plagued season last year', which I interpreted at 2013. You don't get two years to MRS. He may get one for 2012 as I don't know the math on how many games he suited up for. If he as a bang-up year in 2014, I wouldn't be surprised to see him go pro ala Towson's West. If he gets signs that he would get drafted, he may decide to get the money, now, (i.e. 2015)rather than wait another season and risk injury.

[JimboCBA72]

Just to put a period on the Nebrich discussion, Mike tore a knee early in our third game vs Cornell in 2012 and missed the rest of the season.

[JoltinJoe]

No apology needed!! it was jolted, er i mean joltin joe that got carreid away with himself! and I agree that he's the cream of the crop,

How did I get carried away with myself? I pointed, correctly, that Nebrich qualified for a red-shirt because of his injury in 2012.

You then tried to put words in my mouth (based on someone else's post), as if I said he qualified due to his injury in 2013.

Apology accepted, when and if you are man enough to admit YOUR mistake.

[JimboCBA72]

If the game had meant something, Nebrich would have started.

Nebrich played in fewer than three games in 2012. He has already qualified for a medical red-shirt and will get it when and if he applies for it.

Here is an article from the NY Post from August 2013 which correctly refers to Nebrich as a red-shirt sophomore: http://nypost.com/2013/08/11/fordham-football-looking-to-take-next-step-2/

I spoke with Coaches who told me Nebrich was not ready to start the Laf. game. It would have required an extraordinary set of circumstances for Mike to have seen the field that day.

[CFBfan]

I spoke with Coaches who told me Nebrich was not ready to start the Laf. game. It would have required an extraordinary set of circumstances for Mike to have seen the field that day.

are you sure? jj seems to be an expert on FU football

[JimboCBA72]

are you sure? jj seems to be an expert on FU football

Can't comment on JJ's expertise. What I posted was told to me by HC Moorhead after I attended one of the practices leading up to the Colgate game (game following Laf.)

[CFBfan]

Can't comment on JJ's expertise. What I posted was told to me by HC Moorhead after I attended one of the practices leading up to the Colgate game (game following Laf.)

Jimbo i appreciate your post, it was just a little sarcasim towards jj, sorry for the confusion

[Fordham]

I know this whole back and forth is no big deal but I can actually vouch that JJ is an expert on FU football fwiw. I've learned more from him about the history of the program than I did from my years wearing the uni. I've been part of exchanges where he has helped educate our staff and admin on things as well. Great guy too.

The thread really just got off the rails due to my poor wording about which season justified his medical redshirt. Again, my bad.

Onto more important things - interested in the next Patsy team rating as well as to hear from FU fans about how our team's biggest weakness last year (arguably) could be turning into a positive on the DL. Yancey coming back, Klecko, the returning frosh who played a ton last year and will have a year of weight training under their belts and some promising incoming frosh all bode well for us there imo.

[JimboCBA72]

I know this whole back and forth is no big deal but I can actually vouch that JJ is an expert on FU football fwiw. I've learned more from him about the history of the program than I did from my years wearing the uni. I've been part of exchanges where he has helped educate our staff and admin on things as well. Great guy too.

The thread really just got off the rails due to my poor wording about which season justified his medical redshirt. Again, my bad.

Onto more important things - interested in the next Patsy team rating as well as to hear from FU fans about how our team's biggest weakness last year (arguably) could be turning into a positive on the DL. Yancey coming back, Klecko, the returning frosh who played a ton last year and will have a year of weight training under their belts and some promising incoming frosh all bode well for us there imo.

Let's not forget to add Biestek to that mix as well. Coaches were high on Adeyeye coming out of HS last year and by season's end he seemed to be getting his sea legs under him. It's interesting that the guy from last year's crop of frosh d-lineman who was making the most progress was Vaughan out of Canada. Unfortunately he hurt his shoulder early in the year so I am anxious to see how he bounces back. The kid from this year's class I really like is LB Thorpe. If the big guys up front can keep the OGs occupied and let him run free, he has the potential to be a special player for us.

[JoltinJoe]

I spoke with Coaches who told me Nebrich was not ready to start the Laf. game. It would have required an extraordinary set of circumstances for Mike to have seen the field that day.

I didn't speak to anyone directly, but I was told by someone who is credible that a player on the team told him that Nebrich could have played, if necessary, and Nebrich in fact wanted to play. The coaching staff held him out to avoid a risk of further injury, he was told by the player.

[Fordham]

Let's not forget to add Biestek to that mix as well. Coaches were high on Adeyeye coming out of HS last year and by season's end he seemed to be getting his sea legs under him. It's interesting that the guy from last year's crop of frosh d-lineman who was making the most progress was Vaughan out of Canada. Unfortunately he hurt his shoulder early in the year so I am anxious to see how he bounces back. The kid from this year's class I really like is LB Thorpe. If the big guys up front can keep the OGs occupied and let him run free, he has the potential to be a special player for us.

good point about Biesteck. His return is huge for the program. In terms of freshmen from last year I think Adayeye is going to be tremendous. I don't know much of Vaughan but Alex Washington really surprised as a true frosh at DT to get a ton of time as well. Very fiery. Future of DL is bright. Very cool to have us see an area of weakness and 'poof', Coach M addresses it. I've never had this level of confidence in any coach we have interacted with. He's just incredible IMO.

[carney2]

Nebrich may be the best QB in the Patriot League in a long time. Is he good enough to opt out of his redshirt year and make himself eligible for the NFL draft?

[Gater]

Seems like Nebrich should go pro right now. So should Reed and Pujals. These guys are too good to waste time playing another down in the Patriot League. I wish them all the best of luck in the pro careers. This year. As in right now.

[JimboCBA72]

Seems like Nebrich should go pro right now. So should Reed and Pujals. These guys are too good to waste time playing another down in the Patriot League. I wish them all the best of luck in the pro careers. This year. As in right now.

Ha! I take it you were one of the few Gate fans who saw Mike's performance in Hamilton last November. That 80+ yd pass to T.Jones was a thing of beauty. If he was wearing a Colgate uni I would want to see him go pro tooxlolx

[RichH2]

Seems like Nebrich should go pro right now. So should Reed and Pujals. These guys are too good to waste time playing another down in the Patriot League. I wish them all the best of luck in the pro careers. This year. As in right now.

xlolx Oh,I so agree.

[van]

Seems like Nebrich should go pro right now. So should Reed and Pujals. These guys are too good to waste time playing another down in the Patriot League. I wish them all the best of luck in the pro careers. This year. As in right now.

+1, any way I can help with this?

[Go...gate]

I know this whole back and forth is no big deal but I can actually vouch that JJ is an expert on FU football fwiw. I've learned more from him about the history of the program than I did from my years wearing the uni. I've been part of exchanges where he has helped educate our staff and admin on things as well. Great guy too.

The thread really just got off the rails due to my poor wording about which season justified his medical redshirt. Again, my bad.

Onto more important things - interested in the next Patsy team rating as well as to hear from FU fans about how our team's biggest weakness last year (arguably) could be turning into a positive on the DL. Yancey coming back, Klecko, the returning frosh who played a ton last year and will have a year of weight training under their belts and some promising incoming frosh all bode well for us there imo.

Agree as to the Jolter. He is a class act and great contributor on Fordham and FCS football. His posts are always informative.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

It's pretty telling that of the 30ish posts on this thread, the great majority of them discuss Nebrich, a guy who yielded 0 Patsy Points - a guy who could be the best QB to come out of the Patriot League in a very long time.

This is why transfers need to be a part of the Patsy Point calculus.

[Fordham]

Agreed. At a minimum I would think the committee could consider them with regard to the "Committee Adjustment" category. Seems a natural spot to give a hamfisted effort at SOMETHING until some better methodology is agreed upon imo.

Regardless, it's all in fun. When is HC going to be released?

[CFBfan]

Agreed. At a minimum I would think the committee could consider them with regard to the "Committee Adjustment" category. Seems a natural spot to give a hamfisted effort at SOMETHING until some better methodology is agreed upon imo.

Regardless, it's all in fun. When is HC going to be released?

maybe a 2nd category rating each team on xfers? most xfers do so beacause they aren't seeing the field where they are coming from so i suppose you would have to go back to their recruiting info?

[Lehigh Football Nation]

maybe a 2nd category rating each team on xfers? most xfers do so beacause they aren't seeing the field where they are coming from so i suppose you would have to go back to their recruiting info?

Therein lies the rub. Suppose a CB tests with a 4.54 40 in his high school combine, but gets hurt in college before he transfers to, say, Bucknell. Is it fair to use that number?

Furthermore, the fact that they were signed by an FBS team will likely give them ** or *** regardless of talent.

[RichH2]

Agree transfers s/b included. It is likely we will have more on a regular basis with schollies. Until there i smore of a track record ,Committe adjustment best for them. Each has to be considered separately IMO. Committee should solicit comments from that school's partisans,
** s still a factor but much less of one. We've seen how they change depending on where a kid originally commits. LU had a couple that went up from 0 to 2 on commit,last yr 2 that went down when kids switched fron FBS to us.

[breezy]

I respectfully disagree. The focus of the Patsy ratings has been solely on the incoming freshman recruit class, not all changes from last year to next year. It is rare that a transfer comes in with 4 years of eligibility; almost all have either 2 or 3 years of eligibility left. If transfers are considered, it should only be in a separate category.

Of course, if The Committee feels otherwise, I will defer to its discretion.

[CFBfan]

I respectfully disagree. The focus of the Patsy ratings has been solely on the incoming freshman recruit class, not all changes from last year to next year. It is rare that a transfer comes in with 4 years of eligibility; almost all have either 2 or 3 years of eligibility left. If transfers are considered, it should only be in a separate category.

Of course, if The Committee feels otherwise, I will defer to its discretion.

it's a very good point breezy, that's why i think a seperate category to just rank xfers, it won't impact the true patsy for incoming frosh and will also provide a little insight into who is bring in "what" with xfers......

[RichH2]

I respectfully disagree. The focus of the Patsy ratings has been solely on the incoming freshman recruit class, not all changes from last year to next year. It is rare that a transfer comes in with 4 years of eligibility; almost all have either 2 or 3 years of eligibility left. If transfers are considered, it should only be in a separate category.

Of course, if The Committee feels otherwise, I will defer to its discretion.

Good point but I think the amt of eligibility left for a transfer is merely another factor in weighing their impact on the current yr's recruit class.along with stars,team need etc. Certainly s/b included in total number of recruits in class.

[CFBfan]

Good point but I think the amt of eligibility left for a transfer is merely another factor in weighing their impact on the current yr's recruit class.along with stars,team need etc. Certainly s/b included in total number of recruits in class.

i agree rich, i think a seperate category for xfers will solve this, will still have a good read (as good as patsies get!) on the incoming frosh and a seperate ranking on xfers by school.....am i missing something with this thought?

[RichH2]

All agreed transfers s/b included in some form. I really dont care how, but their existence and impact s/b acknowledged

Patsys are labor intensiveto say the least. Bio info ( not always readily available)s/b gotten by our respective recruiting mavens. Yeah,me included