NASCAR and the Confederate Flag

[HIU 93]

Very interesting article.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nascar/news?slug=dw-confederateflag100906&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

[citdog]

The Flag of the Southern Confederacy is a symbol of pride, place, and honor. The Confederate Soldier and the privation and hardship that he suffered through against superior numbers and resources is something ALL Americans should be proud of. And boy could he fight! No shoes, very little food, not being paid for months, if the Union Army would have been in
Johnny's shoes he would have packed it up and went home. "God denied us the victory but left us with a glorious heritage to pass down to future generations of Southerners" Gen John Gordon 1866

Deo Vindice

[AppGuy04]

http://img114.imageshack.us/img114/6861/sracistwj8.gif

[RadMann]

The confederate flag means different things to different people. To many white southerners it truly is a flag representing their history and culture and is not necessarily flown for any race related reasons at all. On the other hand, some whites fly it purely because it makes a racist statement that they are unabashedly proud of. To many blacks it is a symbol of racist oppression and hatred. While I have a lot of family/ancestors from the south including those who fought for the southern cause (mostly from Alabama), I think the flag should not be flown in public out of respect for the feelings of those offended....

[citdog]

What's next? Will Southern cities be forced to change street names that honor Confederate Generals? Will the Army be forced to change the names of bases that bear the names of Officers who wore the grey? Why are the people who are the first ones to scream "First Amendement " the first ones to villify and try to silence those who have a different opinion than they do? The South has nothing for which to aplogize, we submitted to the outcome of the sword which we drew to defend the Constitutional form of government that was guaranteed to us when we ratified the Constitution in 1789. SC would never have joined the Union of her own free will and accord if she didn't feel that she could leave it in the same manner. The only difference between President Davis and General Washington is that Washington won.

[GannonFan]

The CSA - they fought to keep men, women, and children in chains. Ahh, heritage. :nonono2: :nonono2: :nonono2: :nonono2: :nonono2:

[unknown-swac]

What's next? Will Southern cities be forced to change street names that honor Confederate Generals? Will the Army be forced to change the names of bases that bear the names of Officers who wore the grey? Why are the people who are the first ones to scream "First Amendement " the first ones to villify and try to silence those who have a different opinion than they do? The South has nothing for which to aplogize, we submitted to the outcome of the sword which we drew to defend the Constitutional form of government that was guaranteed to us when we ratified the Constitution in 1789. SC would never have joined the Union of her own free will and accord if she didn't feel that she could leave it in the same manner. The only difference between President Davis and General Washington is that Washington won.

The south shall rise again huh?: smh :

[HIU 93]

The confederate flag means different things to different people. To many white southerners it truly is a flag representing their history and culture and is not necessarily flown for any race related reasons at all. On the other hand, some whites fly it purely because it makes a racist statement that they are unabashedly proud of. To many blacks it is a symbol of racist oppression and hatred. While I have a lot of family/ancestors from the south including those who fought for the southern cause (mostly from Alabama), I think the flag should not be flown in public out of respect for the feelings of those offended....

The particular situation in this article is a very complex one, if only from a business standpoint. I truly understand NASCAR's corporate dilemma. They want to increase their market share and talent pool, yet they do not want to offend their "traditional" customer base. The best thing for them to do is to issue a statement saying that they do not support discrimination of any kind, nor do they sanction its symbols, but they will not interfere with their fans constitutional rights. That being said, NASCAR is not sanctioning the use of the flag (or any flag other than the NASCAR and US Flags), and the flying of the flag is being done by individuals. Individuals have a right to fly the flag. That is their business. As long as they are not actually harming anyone, flying the flag is a right that they have. However, if I decide to fly a UNIA flag (red, Black, and green) at a NASCAR race, then that is my right as well. Neither of them have anything to do with NASCAR, but what is good for the goose...

[ngineer]

The Confederate battle flag has been hijacked by White Supremists groups and is primarily viewed by those outside of the South as a means of intimidation toward all minorities--primarily people of color, and Jews. Women and Catholics used to be targets as well, but now, seem to have blended into the background.
Ironic that most countries, once they have defeated a 'rebel' force, usually bans any display of their insignias, etc. Not so in our free society. However, if 'heritage' is the issue, why not use the CSA flag that had the large horizonal bands and the blue field on the left? That piece of cloth does not cause the blood pressure rise the 'Stars and Bars' does.

[Hammerhead]

I'm a northerner so I have a hard time understanding both sides of the issue.

What's next? Are they going to edit all of the Dukes of Hazzard reruns on CMT to fuzz out the stars and bars on top of the General Lee?xlolx

[ASU Kep]

Personally (growing up in GA), I've never met a non-racist person proud of that flag. It signifies slavery and rebellion against our government. I'm proud to be from the south, I am not in any way proud of that flag.

[unknown-swac]

Personally (growing up in GA), I've never met a non-racist person proud of that flag. It signifies slavery and rebellion against our government. I'm proud to be from the south, I am not in any way proud of that flag.

Likewise. I often approach people that have that flag on their car and ask them are they pro-slavery and the oppression of our people. Most of them are so shocked that I came and asked that they either hurry off or try to find every reason under the stars to support the flag and nothing it stands for. Those that stick around long enough I tell them that wearing a flag that stands for such things tells me what type of person they are. At that point they usually feel threatened and leave.

[bobcatfan06]

Ok this is kinda the same thing but to a greater degree. My stepdad is German and he has a picture of his father infront of a Nazi flag. He has it hanging in the hallway but has to cover it up every time someone comes over because people get offended. His dad was in the German army during WWII, but now lives in the states and is a now an American. Should my stepdad have to cover up the picture just because it has a Swastika on it?

[ASU Kep]

Ok this is kinda the same thing but to a greater degree. My stepdad is German and he has a picture of his father infront of a Nazi flag. He has it hanging in the hallway but has to cover it up every time someone comes over because people get offended. His dad was in the German army during WWII, but now lives in the states and is a now an American. Should my stepdad have to cover up the picture just because it has a Swastika on it?

No. But I don't see why he couldn't find a different picture to put up ;) . Even if his father served for the Nazi's and even if he still supported them (apparently he doesn't) it doesn't mean you still can't love your father, agree with him or not.

BTW, I don't think it should be illegal to sport the Confederate flag at all...I think at least appearing to be a racist backwoods idiot is penalty enough.

[unknown-swac]

I dont have animosity towards anybody that still wears the flag. However, I will NOT have respect for anyone that does knowing what it represents. Sometimes you just have to be on the opposite side of the spectrum to be able to truly understand some things.

[Baldy]

Personally (growing up in GA), I've never met a non-racist person proud of that flag.
Do you ask that question to every single person you meet? :confused:
You need to get out a little bit more.

[bluehenbillk]

I personally believe the Confederate flag is a non-issue.

[AmsterBison]

You can be have lots of admirable qualities and still fight for an unworthy cause.

[citdog]

Personally (growing up in GA), I've never met a non-racist person proud of that flag. It signifies slavery and rebellion against our government. I'm proud to be from the south, I am not in any way proud of that flag.


You sir, have been taught to villify your own ancestors! You have bought the great lie of Yankee Propaganda! If you tell a really big lie often enough, like the Yankees were fighting to "free the slaves", and you write the history books it becomes truth ish.

[Baldy]

The Confederate battle flag has been hijacked by White Supremists groups and is primarily viewed by those outside of the South as a means of intimidation toward all minorities....
Bingo!!!
Maybe if the Sons of Confederate Veterans, et al would have stepped up aggressively and vehemently protested the Skinheads, Neo-Nazis, KKK, white supremacist groups, etc. from using the Confederate battle flag in their racist demonstrations, then we might not have that problem today. Now it's a case of too little too late.

[Baldy]

You can be have lots of admirable qualities and still fight for an unworthy cause.
Spoken like an 18th Century American Tory.

[AmsterBison]

Spoken like an 18th Century American Tory.

Oh, c'mon Baldy, were the American colonists enfranchised? Besides, if the Brits had won, they'd have hung a whole bunch of people as traitors and you sure wouldn't be seeing any stars and stripes around. Big difference.

Anyway, I can't think of a more unworthy cause than the destruction of the Republic in order to keep people in chains

Personally, when I see a Conferederate flag decal on a vehicle in Minnesota or North Dakota, my imaginary profile of the owner is this: Uneducated and looking for some reason to get violent, probably owns some guns and tends to justify unsocial actions by putting themselves into the role of victim. Now, if I saw it down South, I wouldn't jump to that kind of conclusion (context).

Edit:

I've witnessed a couple of discussions like this one (but try not to get involved). However, there is one question I've always wanted to ask the folks involved. If you were sent back to 1860, which side would you fight for if you had to choose and why?

[GannonFan]

If you tell a really big lie often enough, like the Yankees were fighting to "free the slaves", and you write the history books it becomes truth ish.

Typical view now being propogated by revisionist Southern historians that actually want people to believe that the Civil War, and all the issues leading up to it, had nothing to do with slavery and was instead a battle for honor and freedom (ironic in that is was freedom for some and further oppression and slavery of others). Fact of the matter is, slavery was the central issue in virtually all of the most serious crises in America straight from its founding in the 1780's all the way to the Civil War. You take slavery out of the equation, and the Civil War never happens. What some poor soldier on either side thought they were fighting for, and regardless of what governments said the root cause of the disagreement, slavery was the tipping point. Being proud of your ancestors is one thing - carrying forward their blindness to the root evil of their cause (whether they knew it or not) is something else entirely.

[OL FU]

Typical view now being propogated by revisionist Southern historians that actually want people to believe that the Civil War, and all the issues leading up to it, had nothing to do with slavery and was instead a battle for honor and freedom (ironic in that is was freedom for some and further oppression and slavery of others). Fact of the matter is, slavery was the central issue in virtually all of the most serious crises in America straight from its founding in the 1780's all the way to the Civil War. You take slavery out of the equation, and the Civil War never happens. What some poor soldier on either side thought they were fighting for, and regardless of what governments said the root cause of the disagreement, slavery was the tipping point. Being proud of your ancestors is one thing - carrying forward their blindness to the root evil of their cause (whether they knew it or not) is something else entirely.

It is very difficult for Southerners to admit that their ancestors fought for such a despicable institution. It is understandable that southerners would grasp onto to the more noble ideas sovereignty, states rights and northern agression. Understandable, but sad:o

[MoreheadEagle]

It's interesting to me that many of these southernors who glorify a flag of a foreign country (CSA Flag) get upset when Mexican-Americans fly the flag of their home country or don't speak English as well as some Euro-Americans.

To me, the Confederate Flag is a symbol of a nation that rebelled to protect its perceived right to own other human beings as property. Sure, many Yankees didn't fight to free the slaves but isn't it a little odd that not a single "free state" didn't rebel? Like it or not, it's a symbol of slvery and the inherit racism that goes with it. Skinheads and the KKK (which was founded by ex confederate soldiers) continue to fly it because of its association with slavery. Others fly it b/c they think its cool.

I live in KY and I've never met someone outside of historical renactment circles who flys the flag that didn't have some sort of predjudice.

[goasu984Life]

After a decade of massive growth, NASCAR's popularity has slowed and television ratings have slumped. To restart its progress, NASCAR must continue to attract new fans in fresh, more diverse markets, many of whom view the Confederate flag as a symbol of racism and oppression. Yet NASCAR doesn't want to alienate its loyal base, many of whom view the waving flags in the infield as a symbol of honor, history and traditional Southern pride.

That part of the article is ot necessarily true, as many old-school NASCAR fans are upset that tracks like North Wilkesboro and Rockingham in North Carolina don't have a Cup date anymore and the Southern 500 has been moved from Darlington, S.C. on Labor Day.

Also, many old-school fans are not really happy with The Chase for the Nextel Cup, either.

NASCAR has done a lot of things to alienate their older fans, the ones who made the sport what it is today. If NASCAR really wanted to do away with the Confederate Flag at its tracks, it would.

[89Hen]

It's interesting to me that many of these southernors who glorify a flag of a foreign country (CSA Flag) get upset when Mexican-Americans fly the flag of their home country or don't speak English as well as some Euro-Americans.
Very interesting point ME. :nod:

[MarkCCU]

The CSA - they fought to keep men, women, and children in chains. Ahh, heritage. :nonono2: :nonono2: :nonono2: :nonono2: :nonono2:
Come off it. SLAVERY EXISTED BEFORE THE CSA. If the Union was so ****ing high and mighty why wasn't it outlawed from the very beginnig or why didn't they try to rub it out. I'll tell you why, economics.

I am Southern born and raised from Charleston, i have confederate ancestors. I respect the Stars and Bars(the Naval Jack and Battle Flag) and I honor those that died for what they believed, after all it was a volunteer army for hte most part. But, groups that use it for hate, discrimination are pathetic. And anyone that treats a whole group differently b/c of the opinions of a few are dead wrong and should get off thier pillars of arrogance.:twocents: :bang:

[GannonFan]

If NASCAR really wanted to do away with the Confederate Flag at its tracks, it would.

How could they do that? As far as I know, it's not NASCAR or the tracks that are flying the Confederate Flag, it's the thousands of people that flock to the track every weekend that do. You just walk through the tailgating on raceday and the amount of Confederate Flags are astounding - as far as they eye can see. I'm personally against flying the flag and I'm personally against the emerging school of thought that whitewashes (no pun intended) the ugly side of what the Confederacy was largely about (the right to enslave), but I don't see how NASCAR can do anything to bar the flying of the flag by the thousands who do so every week from their own RV's, trucks, or cars.

[GannonFan]

Come off it. SLAVERY EXISTED BEFORE THE CSA. If the Union was so ****ing high and mighty why wasn't it outlawed from the very beginnig or why didn't they try to rub it out. I'll tell you why, economics.


And if the CSA lasted past 1865 slavery would have existed too. Blinders, man. People doing the fighting may have reconciled themselves to protecting their homes, or protecting states rights, but the bigger picture, and the bigger cause, was the right to keep people in bondage, whether those fighting knew it or not.

[MarkCCU]

http://img114.imageshack.us/img114/6861/sracistwj8.gif

American Flag, slavery from 1619-1865(passing of the 13th Amendment, not that useless war measure the Emancipation Proclamation)
http://re3.mm-a1.yimg.com/image/136480916

Confederate States of America, Slavery from 1861-1865
http://re3.mm-a8.yimg.com/image/2925187874

[MarkCCU]

And if the CSA lasted past 1865 slavery would have existed too. Blinders, man. People doing the fighting may have reconciled themselves to protecting their homes, or protecting states rights, but the bigger picture, and the bigger cause, was the right to keep people in bondage, whether those fighting knew it or not.

Well they didn't. I'm using Facts here. So we fought to keep it, and we would've eventually dropped it b/c of the economics of continuing, and it's too long and go into detail. read anything by Thomas D. Lorenzo, he does a great job of showing the Truth of Linclon and the war and tries to be unbiased

[89Hen]

American Flag, slavery from 1619-1865(passing of the 13th Amendment, not that useless war measure the Emancipation Proclamation)
http://re3.mm-a1.yimg.com/image/136480916

Confederate States of America, Slavery from 1861-1865
http://re3.mm-a8.yimg.com/image/2925187874
Big difference IMO. The one on top stands for a lot more than slavery. BTW, the Stars and Stripes didn't come into existance until 1777.

[goasu984Life]

How could they do that? As far as I know, it's not NASCAR or the tracks that are flying the Confederate Flag, it's the thousands of people that flock to the track every weekend that do. You just walk through the tailgating on raceday and the amount of Confederate Flags are astounding - as far as they eye can see. I'm personally against flying the flag and I'm personally against the emerging school of thought that whitewashes (no pun intended) the ugly side of what the Confederacy was largely about (the right to enslave), but I don't see how NASCAR can do anything to bar the flying of the flag by the thousands who do so every week from their own RV's, trucks, or cars.

Someone in a leadership role has to step up and do something if the problem needs to be addressed. The story is about the Confederate Flag and NASCAR, so you would think that NASCAR would be able to do somethign about people bringing items that are "offensive" into their tracks and to their events.

[GannonFan]

Well they didn't. I'm using Facts here. So we fought to keep it, and we would've eventually dropped it b/c of the economics of continuing, and it's too long and go into detail. read anything by Thomas D. Lorenzo, he does a great job of showing the Truth of Linclon and the war and tries to be unbiased

Hey, I believe that economically slavery in it's 1860's form would run it's course, but how many more years? 2? 5? 50? 150? And it's not as if once it did serve its purpose they would all be freed and be able to live peacefully in the glorious CSA. And who's to say a whole new industry that could use slave labor wouldn't have popped up? With the Industrial Revolution sweeping through America in the 1800's it isn't far-fetched to see how slave labor could be used in that area (heck, many equated the low wages and poor living conditions of factories in the 1880's and onward as slave-type labor). The cause may have been thought of, by those fighting it, as a freedom fight or a states sovereignty fight, but it was about the ability to own slaves and to spread the use of slaves. You can't escape that reality and it overshadows the more honorable distinctions you prefer to focus on.

[GannonFan]

Someone in a leadership role has to step up and do something if the problem needs to be addressed. The story is about the Confederate Flag and NASCAR, so you would think that NASCAR would be able to do somethign about people bringing items that are "offensive" into their tracks and to their events.

I agree - that could do it. I'm sure NASCAR would take a hit from taking such a political and social stand, but I think you're right - an outright banning and confiscation could stop the flag flying. It would be quite a political firestorm though, but probably one worth having nonetheless.

[MarkCCU]

Big difference IMO. The one on top stands for a lot more than slavery. BTW, the Stars and Stripes didn't come into existance until 1777.

Techincally, 1776-1865

but the first slaves came around 1619,

[MarkCCU]

NASCAR doesn't have any authority over what patrons of the sport believe in, wear or fly on thier person or thier motorcars, prohibiting that is illegal so is there really anything that can be done?

[89Hen]

NASCAR doesn't have any authority over what patrons of the sport believe in, wear or fly on thier person or thier motorcars, prohibiting that is illegal so is there really anything that can be done?
Tracks are private property AFAIK.

[GannonFan]

NASCAR doesn't have any authority over what patrons of the sport believe in, wear or fly on thier person or thier motorcars, prohibiting that is illegal so is there really anything that can be done?

Technically speaking NASCAR does - or at least the owners of the tracks do - I don't think any of these tracks are considered publicly-owned tracks so those that own them do have a say over what can be worn or flown when you're inside those locations. Certain banners are banned all the time from sports stadiums (i.e. banners criticizing team owners and such) - wouldn't be any different in this situation. You don't have freedom of speech in someone else's home.

[GannonFan]

Tracks are private property AFAIK.

No fair, you used less words! ;)

[MarkCCU]

btw, i don't support the CSA as a whole, states rights is important but slavery is horrible. also, you had a have a passport to travel between states, forget that. IAA games would be impossible to get to sometimes under that

[MarkCCU]

Tracks are private property AFAIK.

i don't know what AFAIK means. And i didn't know tracks are private proptery. i hate nascar

[GannonFan]

i don't know what AFAIK means. And i didn't know tracks are private proptery. i hate nascar

AFAIK = as far as I know

[MarkCCU]

Technically speaking NASCAR does - or at least the owners of the tracks do - I don't think any of these tracks are considered publicly-owned tracks so those that own them do have a say over what can be worn or flown when you're inside those locations. Certain banners are banned all the time from sports stadiums (i.e. banners criticizing team owners and such) - wouldn't be any different in this situation. You don't have freedom of speech in someone else's home.

i didn't know that, as previously stated i don't like NASCAR. Going 200 mph on a continous left turn isn't exciting to me:twocents:

[unknown-swac]

i didn't know that, as previously stated i don't like NASCAR. Going 200 mph on a continous left turn isn't exciting to me:twocents:


I feel the SAME way. I've never liked NASCAR and I dont understand the excitement of a car going in a circle 500 times. I'd be in terrible agony watching that. Now the NHRA is another story.

[89Hen]

I feel the SAME way. I've never liked NASCAR and I dont understand the excitement of a car going in a circle 500 times. I'd be in terrible agony watching that. Now the NHRA is another story.
Yeah, a car that doesn't turn. :rolleyes:

[AZGrizFan]

No fair, you used less words! ;)

Shocking. :eyebrow:

[unknown-swac]

Yeah, a car that doesn't turn. :rolleyes:

It turns on and off of the track, thats enough for me. 500 freakin times around the same circle? Pssh: smh :

[RadMann]

Agreed... I'm convinced that NASCAR is a cultural phenomenom because the spectator sport aspect is puzzling. At least horse races only go around at most once.... 500 miles of exhaust and cars streaking by, no thanks.... I mean I can understand liking fast cars for myself to drive (I do) and being interested in cars and mechanical things (I am), but watching an entire NASCAR race? jeez.... lol

[89Hen]

It turns on and off of the track, thats enough for me. 500 freakin times around the same circle? Pssh: smh :
C'mon unk, it's no contest. Every track is different length, width, shape with different banking, some concrete, some asphalt, different pit lanes, etc... and the entire field runs at the same time. NHRA - 1/4 mile straight and flat only two cars at a time. xcoffeex

[unknown-swac]

After the first 100 laps i'd be sitting in my car.

[goasu984Life]

This is the official NASCAR fan response

Go to a race. You can't get the full effect of NASCAR from television. You have to actually go to race to appreciate it.

[MarkCCU]

alright, he's making a left turn. and now he's making a left turn. and another left turn, and another left turn.

No thank you. Don't those cars get about 4-6 gallons a mile?

[goasu984Life]

There's a lot more to it than just turning in circles. There relly is. I understand why some people are anti-NASCAR, and I'm not wanting to start an argument over that. I grew up in a rcing family, so I have always been a fan. Now, I get to work in the racing business.

[MarkCCU]

what do you do in the racing buisness?

[ASU Kep]

You sir, have been taught to villify your own ancestors! You have bought the great lie of Yankee Propaganda! If you tell a really big lie often enough, like the Yankees were fighting to "free the slaves", and you write the history books it becomes truth ish.

Actually, my ancestors were Yankees (the American ones, anyway).

...so are you telling me the Confederacy would've freed the slaves if they had won?

[ASU Kep]

There are so many wonderful things that symbolize the south...why must people support THAT one?

[GannonFan]

This is the official NASCAR fan response

Go to a race. You can't get the full effect of NASCAR from television. You have to actually go to race to appreciate it.

I agree with that - I'm no hard core racing fan by any stretch of the imagination, but the one time I went to a NASCAR race just the being there was mighty impressive. It's a good show, even if they only drive straight and turn left. :thumbsup:

[MarkCCU]

There are so many wonderful things that symbolize the south...why must people support THAT one?

b/c they don't know any better. Did you know in the CSA you needed a passport to go from state to state and intrastate travel was difficult
i likethe beaches, chicken, warmth, generoisty, etc...god i love being a southerner

[goasu984Life]

Some people would say that football is boring. We call those people communists.

[citdog]

Actually, my ancestors were Yankees (the American ones, anyway).

...so are you telling me the Confederacy would've freed the slaves if they had won?

The Confederate Government in the last days before the fall of Petersburg and Richmond actually had black troops drilling and being organised into companies, etc. these black Confederates were to be freed after the war. Of course slavery was a dying institution, and would have ended in time, imho probably before 1900.

[Appstate29]

I used to think NASCAR was boring and pointless , but then I had a roomate who watched it a lot, and explained to me some of the finer details of it, and I found out its actually pretty cool. Then he took me to Bristol, which isn't far away from ASU, and its freaking cool at a race. You just get drunk, throw on a cowboy hat and yell and feel the cars. Its like going to a concert only better if you ask me.

[walliver]

I used to think NASCAR was boring and pointless , but then I had a roomate who watched it a lot, and explained to me some of the finer details of it, and I found out its actually pretty cool. Then he took me to Bristol, which isn't far away from ASU, and its freaking cool at a race. You just get drunk, throw on a cowboy hat and yell and feel the cars. Its like going to a concert only better if you ask me.

Wouldn't it be more fun to feel the women? If you're drunk and wearing a cowboy hat, that seems like the natural thing to do. Especially if the women are drunk and wearing cowbot hats.

I doubt I could tolerate sitting in the stands for four hours, but, if I could have one of those RV's in the infield and sit on top and drink beer all day, I probably would try a NASCAR race. I'd need somebody to drive me home of course.

I doubt NASCAR really wants to get rid of the Stars and Bars. I suspect that they are protesting just loud enough to satisfy their sponsors who don't want Jesse Jackson beating on their door.

[goasu984Life]

NASCAR paid Jesse off already. About two years ago, they made a donation to the Rainbow Coalition. Haven't heard a peep out of Jesse since.

[UMass922]

You just get drunk, throw on a cowboy hat and yell and feel the cars.

Wow, sounds even worse than I thought. To each his own, I guess.

[MarkCCU]

NASCAR paid Jesse off already. About two years ago, they made a donation to the Rainbow Coalition. Haven't heard a peep out of Jesse since.
of course, Jesse doesn't give a **** about racial harmony, he's a shakedown artist

[goasu984Life]

Trust me, I know.