Irony

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Last season, Colgate lost to 1-10 South Dakota. Seen as a horrible loss for the league. A big factor for a 10-1 Lehigh not getting an at-large bid.

This season, wins over 4-6 South Dakota for "quality wins" are a centerpiece for Montana's, Northern Arizona's, and Youngstown's State's inclusion for the playoffs.

Irony.

[BisonFan02]

USD is a much better team this year than last year. Apples/Oranges.

[Bisonator]

Last season, Colgate lost to 1-10 South Dakota. Seen as a horrible loss for the league. A big factor for a 10-1 Lehigh not getting an at-large bid.

This season, wins over South Dakota for "quality wins" are a centerpiece for Montana's, Northern Arizona's, and Youngstown's State's inclusion for the playoffs.

Irony.

Well that's because USD was horrible last year and are very good team this year!

Any other questions? xcoffeex

[superman7515]

This year, Colgate is going to be 5-7 and be the AQ for the PL. Yet another horrible loss for the league.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

USD is a much better team this year than last year. Apples/Oranges.

Three wins better, I guess.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

This year, Colgate is going to be 5-7 and be the AQ for the PL. Yet another horrible loss for the league.

They should be favored to be the AQ. They play at home, and the last time Lehigh beat them up in Hamilton in November was 2001.

[IBleedYellow]

Your superior Lehigh education doesn't make sense to me. Sorry.

[kalm]

Last season, Colgate lost to 1-10 South Dakota. Seen as a horrible loss for the league. A big factor for a 10-1 Lehigh not getting an at-large bid.

This season, wins over 4-6 South Dakota for "quality wins" are a centerpiece for Montana's, Northern Arizona's, and Youngstown's State's inclusion for the playoffs.

Irony.

The other three get in because they haven't played a PL schedule and they don't have a bad loss on their resume.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

The other three get in because they haven't played a PL schedule and they don't have a bad loss on their resume.

With their "great win" being 4-6 South Dakota.

[ace93]

Well that's because USD was horrible last year and are very good team this year!

Any other questions? xcoffeex

Very good teams don't have 6 losses on their record.

[clenz]

Three wins better, I guess.
I've been as hard as anyone on USD and their place in the MVFC since their move to the conference was announced. USD is head and shoulders better this year compared to last season. They still aren't a "good" team but they are a good team. They get the benefit of a win over UNI at a time when UNI was (and still is) playing guys who wouldn't be seeing the field if half the team wasn't out of the season.

I don't think they are as good as their record, to be honest, but they are a very competitive team at the very least. That couldn't even be said last season. If the team that lost to USD this year, for UNI, took the field last season against USD it would have been a 20 point win for UNI.

[clenz]

The fact is USD would probably be a top half/third PL/MEAC/SoCon/Big South team

[Bill]

Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes....


http://youtu.be/OE8Tc1cvSYM?t=1m40s

[NoDak 4 Ever]

Very good teams don't have 6 losses on their record.

USD's losses include 4 ranked teams and a FBS.

How many ranked teams or FBS does Lehigh/Colgate/Anyone but Fordham have?

[kalm]

With their "great win" being 4-6 South Dakota.

Not sure any of them have a great win. I'm guessing they each can count a better win than USD on their schedule along with several more decent wins because of the strength if their respective conferences. All three are currently unseeded at-large teams. Right where they should be. Is someone claiming they deserve to be in on the strength of beating the mighty USD alone?

[ace93]

USD's losses include 4 ranked teams and a FBS.

How many ranked teams or FBS does Lehigh/Colgate/Anyone but Fordham have?

I am not defending any PL team. That has nothing to do with whether USD is "very good" or not. If they were very good they would have likely pulled out a few more victories. They are better relative to last season.

[FormerPokeCenter]

Very good teams don't have 6 losses on their record.


UNI and UCA disagree with you on that....

[clenz]

UNI and UCA disagree with you on that....
UNI doesn't have 6 losses...

[Bisonator]

UNI doesn't have 6 losses...

Yet. :D

[dbackjon]

Not sure any of them have a great win. I'm guessing they each can count a better win than USD on their schedule along with several more decent wins because of the strength if their respective conferences. All three are currently unseeded at-large teams. Right where they should be. Is someone claiming they deserve to be in on the strength of beating the mighty USD alone?

NAU should be a seed - I can't find 8 teams with a better resume (assuming NAU wins out, of course)

[Bisonator]

I am not defending any PL team. That has nothing to do with whether USD is "very good" or not. If they were very good they would have likely pulled out a few more victories. They are better relative to last season.

OK scratch the "very" part. Does that make you feel better? xblehx

[clawman]

Last season, Colgate lost to 1-10 South Dakota. Seen as a horrible loss for the league. A big factor for a 10-1 Lehigh not getting an at-large bid.

This season, wins over 4-6 South Dakota for "quality wins" are a centerpiece for Montana's, Northern Arizona's, and Youngstown's State's inclusion for the playoffs.

Irony.
I would agree @ 10-1 getting shut out seems unfair.

[NoDak 4 Ever]

NAU should be a seed - I can't find 8 teams with a better resume (assuming NAU wins out, of course)

Would you put Montana State with 3 losses above you since they won head to head?

[clenz]

Yet. :D
With MSU and WIU left I don't know that it will happen...

The offense actually looked pretty good Saturday. Missouri State is like YSU...it's UNI's bitch. No matter how good or bad either team is UNI seems to get the win every single time. I have no doubt we beat WIU. For the first time in ever I may some *some* doubt on the MSU game but I still think UNI wins.

[UNH Fanboi]

It would be ironic if the MVFC or Big Sky AQ gives a 1-11 team their only victory of the year. Oh wait, the PL AQ may do that again this year if Colgate wins this weekend and Albany loses their last 2 games, which is not an unlikely scenario.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

It would be ironic if the MVFC or Big Sky AQ gives a 1-11 team their only victory of the year. Oh wait, the PL AQ may do that again this year if Colgate wins this weekend and Albany loses their last 2 games, which is not an unlikely scenario.

Watch, next season Albany goes 4-6 and then folks will be like "Albany's not the same team they were last year!", while they lobby that 7-5 JMU should be the last team win with their signature win over the Danes.

[kalm]

NAU should be a seed - I can't find 8 teams with a better resume (assuming NAU wins out, of course)

I think that's probably true - especially once Sam and SELA have played. Biggest potential threats would be YSU if they beat NDSU, W&M, Montana State, Chatty, and Montana (ducking behind a couch)

[birdsflyhigh]

UNI is a prime example of a 7-5 team, coming out of the #1 rated MVFC, that should receive serious consideration for the playoffs. Most of you might scoff, but the Panthers are still a darn good team.

[PAllen]

Very good teams don't have 6 losses on their record.

+1

[PAllen]

The fact is USD would probably be a top half/third PL/MEAC/SoCon/Big South team

Not a fact, an opinion. And every time opinions like this are tested on the field they are proved lacking.

[ace93]

OK scratch the "very" part. Does that make you feel better? xblehx

Very much so. It is a very big difference as it makes the comment about USD very different.

[UNH Fanboi]

Watch, next season Albany goes 4-6 and then folks will be like "Albany's not the same team they were last year!", while they lobby that 7-5 JMU should be the last team win with their signature win over the Danes.

You're creating strawmen. No one is holding up USD as a great win this year. You're the one who has brought up USD, and now others are pointing out that USD is indeed a better team then they were last year, which is demonstrably true. No one is saying that a win over USD is the clincher for an at-large bid.

[SUPharmacist]

Watch, next season Albany goes 4-6 and then folks will be like "Albany's not the same team they were last year!", while they lobby that 7-5 JMU should be the last team win with their signature win over the Danes.

Who is claiming USD as their signature win? If you want to guarantee a bid win your conference.

[ace93]

UNI is a prime example of a 7-5 team, coming out of the #1 rated MVFC, that should receive serious consideration for the playoffs. Most of you might scoff, but the Panthers are still a darn good team.

I think when you start taking too many teams from one conference you are potentially setting things up so that you are just playing matchups that have already been settled. It is especially evident in such a small field as the FCS playoffs. At 7-5 to me it would depend on where they finish in the MVFC. Best case is a tie for 5th, no? If they are the best of the 5, then I could see them getting in, but that's still 5 losses all within conference.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

You're creating strawmen. No one is holding up USD as a great win this year. You're the one who has brought up USD, and now others are pointing out that USD is indeed a better team then they were last year, which is demonstrably true. No one is saying that a win over USD is the clincher for an at-large bid.


Who is claiming USD as their signature win? If you want to guarantee a bid win your conference.

I invite you to take a look at Montana and YSU's schedules more closely.

http://www.college-sports-journal.com/index.php/fcs-information-center/conf-scheds-2013/big-sky-sched-2013

http://www.college-sports-journal.com/index.php/fcs-information-center/conf-scheds-2013/mvfc-sched-2013

As for NAU, whether you see USD as their "signature win" depends on whether you think NAU beating Montana at home is a "signature win." After that, what are you going to point to? A tough win against... Cal Poly?

[UNH Fanboi]

I invite you to take a look at Montana and YSU's schedules more closely.

http://www.college-sports-journal.com/index.php/fcs-information-center/conf-scheds-2013/big-sky-sched-2013

http://www.college-sports-journal.com/index.php/fcs-information-center/conf-scheds-2013/mvfc-sched-2013

As for NAU, whether you see USD as their "signature win" depends on whether you think NAU beating Montana at home is a "signature win." After that, what are you going to point to? A tough win against... Cal Poly?

I'm familiar with their schedules. In a 24 team field, not every team is necessarily going to have an impressive signature win. What matters is who the best 13 at-large teams are. Show me a projected bracket that leaves out NAU, Youngstown am Montana. Maybe there will be 13 more deserving teams than them. Last year, I think there were 10 teams more deserving than Lehigh (I personally would have put Towson in over UNH). You obviously disagree, and that's fine. It was a close call.

The point is that signature wins, bad losses, records and everything else are irrelevant in a vacuum. And you can't compare one year with another year. Some years just not having any bad losses may be good enough to be one of the top 13 at larges. It all depends on what the other teams in contention have done.

[semobison]

I've been as hard as anyone on USD and their place in the MVFC since their move to the conference was announced. USD is head and shoulders better this year compared to last season. They still aren't a "good" team but they are a good team. They get the benefit of a win over UNI at a time when UNI was (and still is) playing guys who wouldn't be seeing the field if half the team wasn't out of the season.

I don't think they are as good as their record, to be honest, but they are a very competitive team at the very least. That couldn't even be said last season. If the team that lost to USD this year, for UNI, took the field last season against USD it would have been a 20 point win for UNI.

Clenz, I agree with a lot of what you post, but USD IMO is better than their record indicates. I watched the game this weekend and they totally outplayed Montana. Rushing yards were 235-53 in their favor. Griz needed a fumble recovery td and a kickoff return td in the 4th qtr to win. The week prior they lose to YSU in a last second heartbreaker. They lost by 6 at NAU. I'm not going to call them very good yet. What I though at the beginning of the season to be a cakewalk final home game this season for the Bison has me a little nervous and this is a team we beat by 50+ last year. They run the ball and they can stop the run. They get my vote for most improved team in the Valley.

[Pard4Life]

You have it all wrong LFN... this is Tragic Lehighrony

Lehigh: 10-1!!! YES! PLAYOFFS HERE WE COME!! :D

http://wac.450f.edgecastcdn.net/80450F/xlcountry.com/files/2012/11/2012-FCS-Playoff-Bracket-630x556.jpg

xbawlingx

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Show me a projected bracket that leaves out NAU, Youngstown am Montana.

I could very easily visualize one with one, maybe two, not making it.

[Grizzlies82]

Last season, Colgate lost to 1-10 South Dakota. Seen as a horrible loss for the league. A big factor for a 10-1 Lehigh not getting an at-large bid.

This season, wins over 4-6 South Dakota for "quality wins" are a centerpiece for Montana's, Northern Arizona's, and Youngstown's State's inclusion for the playoffs. Irony.

A 10-1 Lehigh got hosed last year. The South Dakota Coyotes have a pretty good team which has played tough games against some good competition. Yet I didn't see anyone touting a win over South Dakota as a "quality win". So I guess I missed those comments, and missed the irony.

[Bisonator]

Very much so. It is a very big difference as it makes the comment about USD very different.

Whatever dude. xrotatehx

Last year USD was a bad team, this year they are a good team. I don't see how it's that much different whether a "very" is in there or not! But you keep telling yourself that! xsmiley_wix


I think when you start taking too many teams from one conference you are potentially setting things up so that you are just playing matchups that have already been settled.

I don't care, I'd rather watch a great game between 2 deserving teams then a blowout against a lesser opponent!

[ace93]

Whatever dude. xrotatehx

Last year USD was a bad team, this year they are a good team. I don't see how it's that much different whether a "very" is in there or not! But you keep telling yourself that! xsmiley_wix



I don't care, I'd rather watch a great game between 2 deserving teams then a blowout against a lesser opponent! [/COLOR]

I would too, but w/ 5 conference losses, I am not sold they are deserving.

And the "very" reply was a joke, that's why I used the word "very" 3 times. xpeacexxpeacexxpeacex

[Bisonator]

I would too, but w/ 5 conference losses, I am not sold they are deserving.

And the "very" reply was a joke, that's why I used the word "very" 3 times. xpeacexxpeacexxpeacex

**** I didn't even pick up on that! xthumbsupx Must be Monday. xlolx

[ursus arctos horribilis]

You're creating strawmen. No one is holding up USD as a great win this year. You're the one who has brought up USD, and now others are pointing out that USD is indeed a better team then they were last year, which is demonstrably true. No one is saying that a win over USD is the clincher for an at-large bid.

This here, and not to mention the fact the three teams he's talking about this year beat the better version of the team that Colgate lost to.

[kalm]

I invite you to take a look at Montana and YSU's schedules more closely.

http://www.college-sports-journal.com/index.php/fcs-information-center/conf-scheds-2013/big-sky-sched-2013

http://www.college-sports-journal.com/index.php/fcs-information-center/conf-scheds-2013/mvfc-sched-2013

As for NAU, whether you see USD as their "signature win" depends on whether you think NAU beating Montana at home is a "signature win." After that, what are you going to point to? A tough win against... Cal Poly?

As mentioned signature wins are not required to earn an at-large. And Poly is a VERY solid team who's literally just a few special teams mistakes from being a playoff team. Their defense has been playing like the team that held last year's SHSU to 17 of late, and I wouldn't be surprised in the least if they beat us this week. They would contend if not win PL titles year in and year out.

[cmaxwellgsu]

Last season, Colgate lost to 1-10 South Dakota. Seen as a horrible loss for the league. A big factor for a 10-1 Lehigh not getting an at-large bid.

This season, wins over 4-6 South Dakota for "quality wins" are a centerpiece for Montana's, Northern Arizona's, and Youngstown's State's inclusion for the playoffs.

Irony.

The irony is lost on me, at least the quality win part. I don't think teams from strong conferences that will probably finish 9-3 and 8-3 are relying on signature wins. Nice spin to blame Colgate for LeHigh going 10-1 against nobody......

[dbackjon]

Would you put Montana State with 3 losses above you since they won head to head?

That's a tough call - had they beaten EWU, they would definitely be ahead. But since they are 6-3 (DI) and NAU is 7-2, NAU has moved ahead of them. Head to Head is important, especially when other factors are close to equal, but in this case, since both schools have a FBS loss and a not close conference loss, MSU's meltdown in SFA drops them.

Similarly, NAU and Montana have two losses, NAU only has one FCS loss to Montana's two. Combined with NAU's win, NAU should be ahead of Montana. If Montana is able to go into Bozeman and beat MSU, then Montana would likely be ranked ahead.

[dbackjon]

I invite you to take a look at Montana and YSU's schedules more closely.

http://www.college-sports-journal.com/index.php/fcs-information-center/conf-scheds-2013/big-sky-sched-2013

http://www.college-sports-journal.com/index.php/fcs-information-center/conf-scheds-2013/mvfc-sched-2013

As for NAU, whether you see USD as their "signature win" depends on whether you think NAU beating Montana at home is a "signature win." After that, what are you going to point to? A tough win against... Cal Poly?

NAU has an all division I full schollie schedule. Montana is top 7-12 in most polls - so an 18 point win (would have been 24 point win if not for a couple of BS calls at end) is not a "signature win", please let us know what is.

[dbackjon]

As mentioned signature wins are not required to earn an at-large. And Poly is a VERY solid team who's literally just a few special teams mistakes from being a playoff team. Their defense has been playing like the team that held last year's SHSU to 17 of late, and I wouldn't be surprised in the least if they beat us this week. They would contend if not win PL titles year in and year out.


Both Montana schools, EWU, Poly, Sac State, NAU and SUU would win the Patriot.

[kingranch]

hey brokebackjon you sound EXACTLY like last year to the letter, than your team took a **** the last two games, better hope and pray it doesn't happen again or you are gonna be labeled chattown 2.0:D

[ace93]

Both Montana schools, EWU, Poly, Sac State, NAU and SUU would win the Patriot.

No they would not, they have been giving scholarships for too long and teams that have been giving scholarships for more than two seasons are not eligible for the PL title. ;)

[ursus arctos horribilis]

No they would not, they have been giving scholarships for too long and teams that have been giving scholarships for more than two seasons are not eligible for the PL title. ;)

He got ya there dback.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

Both Montana schools, EWU, Poly, Sac State, iNAU and SUU would win the Patriot.

EWU would. The rest would not, especially if you include Fordham. NAU and MT would be tough.

I'd love to see a LU-MSU playoff game. LU's speed and style of offense would give the Bobcats fits.

[dbackjon]

hey brokebackjon you sound EXACTLY like last year to the letter, than your team took a **** the last two games, better hope and pray it doesn't happen again or you are gonna be labeled chattown 2.0:D

And who might you be?

King Ranch - sounds like you might know a lot about brokebacking ;)

[ngineer]

They should be favored to be the AQ. They play at home, and the last time Lehigh beat them up in Hamilton in November was 2001.

we beat them a couple years ago in late October up there. Month has nothing to do with it. Weather can be a factor later in the year, but forecast right now looks pretty good -partly cloudy, temps 47-50 F.

[Herder]

I thought the irony was discussing South Dakota and playoffs simultaneously.

[citdog]

EWU would. The rest would not, especially if you include Fordham. NAU and MT would be tough..


http://sugarkikkis.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/facepalmzzzp111.gif?w=604

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

http://sugarkikkis.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/facepalmzzzp111.gif?w=604

Which is why the AGS poll has Fordham ranked above NAU and Montana....

Nebrich is healthy. I laughed when the BSC fans were "shocked" when Yale beat Poly. I'll laugh even harder if/when Fordham does the same....

[Vitojr130]

Very good teams don't have 6 losses on their record.

They just might when they are part of the only FCS conference ranked higher than an FBS conference (let alone 3 FBS conferences)...

I'd still pit USD against Lehigh and would pick USD.

[Doc QB]

Not sure I see the irony either, when discussing USD. But, Colgate losing to them last year as a reason to laugh at our conference's playoff participant, or LU's exclusion is rather shortsighted. Solid teams EVERY YEAR have that one game where they may lose to a much weaker opponent. It happens and as you all know, sometimes it doesnt even change where they are ranked the following week. Let downs happen. Upsets happen. To condemn the whole league because of that is actually rather silly. Overblown.

Now, ripping us down for soft OOC schedules and a conference that is not as solid as the CAA, MVFC top to bottom may have some merit. But aside from those conferences, there are actually more FCS conferences like us than those. Those guys beat each other up each week and may have 7-4 teams that could miss playoffs and do damage had they been invited. And yes, those same 7-4 teams may be very successful if they were PL teams. But most other conference midlings are no better than the PL programs.

I love FCS and the playoffs. I wish when I played at LU in early '90's that we would have been eligible to compete in the tourney. But I do tire of the PL criticism from a majority of you guys out there. We obvioulsy have a few polarizing posters (but don't we all?). By and large, when LU has been in the tourney, we earned it, and having beaten the CAA and MVFC champs in recent history (Richmond, Western Illinois, UNI, Towson), at their place, does validate our inclusion. Recently when we have lost, the team who beat us went to championship game (UMass, JMU, UDel, NDSU), oftentimes winning it all. Nothing to be ashamed of. Last year, 10-1 or not, we did not belong. Those other years, we did.

[Pards Rule]

Not sure I see the irony either, when discussing USD. But, Colgate losing to them last year as a reason to laugh at our conference's playoff participant, or LU's exclusion is rather shortsighted. Solid teams EVERY YEAR have that one game where they may lose to a much weaker opponent. It happens and as you all know, sometimes it doesnt even change where they are ranked the following week. Let downs happen. Upsets happen. To condemn the whole league because of that is actually rather silly. Overblown.

Now, ripping us down for soft OOC schedules and a conference that is not as solid as the CAA, MVFC top to bottom may have some merit. But aside from those conferences, there are actually more FCS conferences like us than those. Those guys beat each other up each week and may have 7-4 teams that could miss playoffs and do damage had they been invited. And yes, those same 7-4 teams may be very successful if they were PL teams. But most other conference midlings are no better than the PL programs.

I love FCS and the playoffs. I wish when I played at LU in early '90's that we would have been eligible to compete in the tourney. But I do tire of the PL criticism from a majority of you guys out there. We obvioulsy have a few polarizing posters (but don't we all?). By and large, when LU has been in the tourney, we earned it, and having beaten the CAA and MVFC champs in recent history (Richmond, Western Illinois, UNI, Towson), at their place, does validate our inclusion. Recently when we have lost, the team who beat us went to championship game (UMass, JMU, UDel, NDSU), oftentimes winning it all. Nothing to be ashamed of. Last year, 10-1 or not, we did not belong. Those other years, we did.

Yes!! Agree with the Doc! LU has shown itself when its been in there.

[Yote 53]

Not sure I see the irony either, when discussing USD. But, Colgate losing to them last year as a reason to laugh at our conference's playoff participant, or LU's exclusion is rather shortsighted. Solid teams EVERY YEAR have that one game where they may lose to a much weaker opponent. It happens and as you all know, sometimes it doesnt even change where they are ranked the following week. Let downs happen. Upsets happen. To condemn the whole league because of that is actually rather silly. Overblown.

Now, ripping us down for soft OOC schedules and a conference that is not as solid as the CAA, MVFC top to bottom may have some merit. But aside from those conferences, there are actually more FCS conferences like us than those. Those guys beat each other up each week and may have 7-4 teams that could miss playoffs and do damage had they been invited. And yes, those same 7-4 teams may be very successful if they were PL teams. But most other conference midlings are no better than the PL programs.

I love FCS and the playoffs. I wish when I played at LU in early '90's that we would have been eligible to compete in the tourney. But I do tire of the PL criticism from a majority of you guys out there. We obvioulsy have a few polarizing posters (but don't we all?). By and large, when LU has been in the tourney, we earned it, and having beaten the CAA and MVFC champs in recent history (Richmond, Western Illinois, UNI, Towson), at their place, does validate our inclusion. Recently when we have lost, the team who beat us went to championship game (UMass, JMU, UDel, NDSU), oftentimes winning it all. Nothing to be ashamed of. Last year, 10-1 or not, we did not belong. Those other years, we did.


The problem is that USD was not "much weaker" than Colgate last season. USD had a crap record because we played a much tougher schedule. If we played Colgate's schedule we probably would have been 10-1 or better. Seriously. I was at that game and USD dominated from start to finish. The outcome was never in doubt. After that game I never would have imagined we would have gone winless the rest of the season. Colgate was just that weak of a team that played a weak schedule which allowed them to inflate their win total.

[Yotes]

USD is not the 1-10 team they were last year, and are definitely better than the 4-6 record they currently possess. 1-3 start under QB who is now a WR (and likely starting RB this week), and last minute losses to top ten teams the last two weeks. Yeah, we have 6 losses, but we've played top 25 football since the start of October. Would Colgate or Lehigh have a snowball's chance in hell against Montana, Youngstown, or UNI? Doubt it. USD would win the PL if we were in it, handily at that. Two 6 loss teams lead that league right now, and those 6 losses surely did not come against a schedule anything like we are playing this year.

If a team improving greatly is your definition of irony, then yes, we are being ironic. Next year is going to be even more ironic since we only have about 7 seniors out there with their backups playing very well and a boatload of freshmen and sophomores already starting. Not to mention a 3 time NC head coach who wants nothing more than for USD to be big time. If we aren't a playoff team next year it's because we actually have to play teams with a pulse in the MVFC, plus games @Oregon, @Montana, and vs NAU in the non conference. Hope the AD gives our guys a break and schedules a game with a PL team.

[Doc QB]

The problem is that USD was not "much weaker" than Colgate last season. USD had a crap record because we played a much tougher schedule. If we played Colgate's schedule we probably would have been 10-1 or better. Seriously. I was at that game and USD dominated from start to finish. The outcome was never in doubt. After that game I never would have imagined we would have gone winless the rest of the season. Colgate was just that weak of a team that played a weak schedule which allowed them to inflate their win total.

Being that I never saw you guys in action last year, fine, you were not weak. My post had really little to do with USD. However, the overwhelming majority of posters here lashed out as you guys whipped 'Gate, finished with a crap 1-10 record, and by virtue of that fact, 'Gate sucked, too. If you guys did not suck, maybe some of the posters should have cut 'Gate a break, but that didnt occur. I merely thought too much was put on one game where the last MVFC team beat our champ early. Reality was, you guys did nothing to impress nationally last year; 'Gate didnt help us PL folks by bowing out early, either.

My post was less on USD, that 'Gate game, and more to the point that when LU earns its way in, we belong. EVERY midling team from the power conferences hangs its hat on the fact that our league schedule and OOC opponents are weak, that they would clean up in our league, or we would suck in their conference. Well, LU has shown we would hang around in any league most years, I doubt may 1-10 campaigns. Obvioulsy not dominate, as playing a tougher weekly slate takes a toll, for sure. But when given the opportunity come playoff time, we have competed well. You had a "crap" record in 2012? Are much better at 4-6 this year? Would tear up the PL? I wouldnt have the foggiest, have not seen you play. I'd happily take your insider word for it. But if you want to change perception or the conversations regarding USD on this board? Get in the damn playoffs.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

Being that I never saw you guys in action last year, fine, you were not weak. My post had really little to do with USD. However, the overwhelming majority of posters here lashed out as you guys whipped 'Gate, finished with a crap 1-10 record, and by virtue of that fact, 'Gate sucked, too. If you guys did not suck, maybe some of the posters should have cut 'Gate a break, but that didnt occur. I merely thought too much was put on one game where the last MVFC team beat our champ early. Reality was, you guys did nothing to impress nationally last year; 'Gate didnt help us PL folks by bowing out early, either.

My post was less on USD, that 'Gate game, and more to the point that when LU earns its way in, we belong. EVERY midling team from the power conferences hangs its hat on the fact that our league schedule and OOC opponents are weak, that they would clean up in our league, or we would suck in their conference. Well, LU has shown we would hang around in any league most years, I doubt may 1-10 campaigns. Obvioulsy not dominate, as playing a tougher weekly slate takes a toll, for sure. But when given the opportunity come playoff time, we have competed well. You had a "crap" record in 2012? Are much better at 4-6 this year? Would tear up the PL? I wouldnt have the foggiest, have not seen you play. I'd happily take your insider word for it. But if you want to change perception or the conversations regarding USD on this board? Get in the damn playoffs.

Colgate's struggles outside of the PL can't be ignored. They simply can't win meaningful OOC games or playoff games. What they did in 2003 was great but it's hard to look at it as anything other than a fluke.

EVERY single Colgate playoff loss has been by double digits. Only one, last year, was less than 20 points. That is not what the PL needs/wants....

For this reason, I do not want them to win the league.

[Yotes]

Being that I never saw you guys in action last year, fine, you were not weak. My post had really little to do with USD. However, the overwhelming majority of posters here lashed out as you guys whipped 'Gate, finished with a crap 1-10 record, and by virtue of that fact, 'Gate sucked, too. If you guys did not suck, maybe some of the posters should have cut 'Gate a break, but that didnt occur. I merely thought too much was put on one game where the last MVFC team beat our champ early. Reality was, you guys did nothing to impress nationally last year; 'Gate didnt help us PL folks by bowing out early, either.

My post was less on USD, that 'Gate game, and more to the point that when LU earns its way in, we belong. EVERY midling team from the power conferences hangs its hat on the fact that our league schedule and OOC opponents are weak, that they would clean up in our league, or we would suck in their conference. Well, LU has shown we would hang around in any league most years, I doubt may 1-10 campaigns. Obvioulsy not dominate, as playing a tougher weekly slate takes a toll, for sure. But when given the opportunity come playoff time, we have competed well. You had a "crap" record in 2012? Are much better at 4-6 this year? Would tear up the PL? I wouldnt have the foggiest, have not seen you play. I'd happily take your insider word for it. But if you want to change perception or the conversations regarding USD on this board? Get in the damn playoffs.
You want to know why it's very hard to take the PL seriously? USD has 4 more losses than Lehigh, but still sits higher in the Sagarin ratings. 9 out of 10 MVFC teams sit higher than Lehigh. You know who belongs in the playoffs more than the team that wins the PL this year? About every team from the MVFC. The MVFC is ranked tougher than the Sun Belt, and a division in both the MAC and C-USA. Patriot comes in at 9th best FCS conference, and I'm sure that all comes from Fordham.

Maybe historically winning the Patriot garnered some respect and Lehigh had some great teams, but that is not the case this year. Fordham is the only good thing about that conference this year, and they aren't even allowed to win it.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

USD is not the 1-10 team they were last year, and are definitely better than the 4-6 record they currently possess. 1-3 start under QB who is now a WR (and likely starting RB this week), and last minute losses to top ten teams the last two weeks. Yeah, we have 6 losses, but we've played top 25 football since the start of October. Would Colgate or Lehigh have a snowball's chance in hell against Montana, Youngstown, or UNI? Doubt it. USD would win the PL if we were in it, handily at that. Two 6 loss teams lead that league right now, and those 6 losses surely did not come against a schedule anything like we are playing this year.

If a team improving greatly is your definition of irony, then yes, we are being ironic. Next year is going to be even more ironic since we only have about 7 seniors out there with their backups playing very well and a boatload of freshmen and sophomores already starting. Not to mention a 3 time NC head coach who wants nothing more than for USD to be big time. If we aren't a playoff team next year it's because we actually have to play teams with a pulse in the MVFC, plus games @Oregon, @Montana, and vs NAU in the non conference. Hope the AD gives our guys a break and schedules a game with a PL team.

I'd love for LU to get a shot at the Griz and MSU in the playoffs! These teams are living off of thr past and aren't as good as previous editions. I get to watch all their games. Lehigh would fair well, especially against MSU. LU's offense and ability to play in space would give MSU fits...

EWU and NDSU are the only teams from the MVFC and BSC that I'd want nothing to do with.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Being that I never saw you guys in action last year, fine, you were not weak. My post had really little to do with USD. However, the overwhelming majority of posters here lashed out as you guys whipped 'Gate, finished with a crap 1-10 record, and by virtue of that fact, 'Gate sucked, too. If you guys did not suck, maybe some of the posters should have cut 'Gate a break, but that didnt occur. I merely thought too much was put on one game where the last MVFC team beat our champ early. Reality was, you guys did nothing to impress nationally last year; 'Gate didnt help us PL folks by bowing out early, either.

My post was less on USD, that 'Gate game, and more to the point that when LU earns its way in, we belong. EVERY midling team from the power conferences hangs its hat on the fact that our league schedule and OOC opponents are weak, that they would clean up in our league, or we would suck in their conference. Well, LU has shown we would hang around in any league most years, I doubt may 1-10 campaigns. Obvioulsy not dominate, as playing a tougher weekly slate takes a toll, for sure. But when given the opportunity come playoff time, we have competed well. You had a "crap" record in 2012? Are much better at 4-6 this year? Would tear up the PL? I wouldnt have the foggiest, have not seen you play. I'd happily take your insider word for it. But if you want to change perception or the conversations regarding USD on this board? Get in the damn playoffs.

Lehigh didn't play USD. Lehigh's lack of "schedule strength" to the masses, though, seemed mostly due to guilt by association, with a huge amount of evidence being Colgate's loss to USD.

Hence my sig: "Since South Dakota Beat Colgate, Lehigh didn't get a playoff bid".

Ironically, a 9-3 or 8-4 Youngstown State team may be hanging their hat on that win over South Dakota as evidence that they belong in the playoffs. This year, a win 4-6 USD could be a key element in YSU's inclusion. Last year, I feel it contributed to Lehigh, a 10-1 team that didn't even play USD not getting in.

[Grizalltheway]

I could very easily visualize one with one, maybe two, not making it.

A gimmie win over Weber and Montana is in, if they then beat MSU the cats are right on the bubble. If YSU splits with the xDSUs (very likely IMO), they're definitely in. So I think the most likely senario has the Bobcats being one of the last teams in or one of the first left out.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

You want to know why it's very hard to take the PL seriously? USD has 4 more losses than Lehigh, but still sits higher in the Sagarin ratings. 9 out of 10 MVFC teams sit higher than Lehigh. You know who belongs in the playoffs more than the team that wins the PL this year? About every team from the MVFC. The MVFC is ranked tougher than the Sun Belt, and a division in both the MAC and C-USA. Patriot comes in at 9th best FCS conference, and I'm sure that all comes from Fordham.

Gee, some might see that as the fundamentally flawed nature of the Sag ratings... xrolleyesx

[Lehigh Football Nation]

A gimmie win over Weber and Montana is in, if they then beat MSU the cats are right on the bubble. If YSU splits with the xDSUs (very likely IMO), they're definitely in. So I think the most likely senario has the Bobcats being one of the last teams in or one of the first left out.

YSU could lose both and be 8-4.

If Montana State loses twice they'd be 7-5 and 100% on the bubble.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

You want to know why it's very hard to take the PL seriously? USD has 4 more losses than Lehigh, but still sits higher in the Sagarin ratings. 9 out of 10 MVFC teams sit higher than Lehigh. You know who belongs in the playoffs more than the team that wins the PL this year? About every team from the MVFC. The MVFC is ranked tougher than the Sun Belt, and a division in both the MAC and C-USA. Patriot comes in at 9th best FCS conference, and I'm sure that all comes from Fordham.

Maybe historically winning the Patriot garnered some respect and Lehigh had some great teams, but that is not the case this year. Fordham is the only good thing about that conference this year, and they aren't even allowed to win it.

No matter what Lehigh does it simply isn't enough. Last year it was you didn't beat anyone so you stink. This year Lehigh is one if only a FEW teams to have two wins over ranked teams and it still doesn't matter. 2-1 record against the AGS Top 25 is pretty good imo....

[tribe_pride]

YSU could lose both and be 8-4.

If Montana State loses twice they'd be 7-5 and 100% on the bubble.

Montana State would be 7-5 but 6-5 in D-I games if they were to lose the next 2 games almost likely out especially since they would have lost their last 3 games. Not saying they will lose 3 straight but just playing out a scenario.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

Montana State would be 7-5 but 6-5 in D-I games if they were to lose the next 2 games almost likely out especially since they would have lost their last 3 games. Not saying they will lose 3 straight but just playing out a scenario.

No chance MSU gets in losing their final 3. If they beat SUU and lose to the Griz they should be on the road for the first round imo.

[Twentysix]

No chance MSU gets in losing their final 3. If they beat SUU and lose to the Griz they should be on the road for the first round imo.

That is not how the first round works.

Montana State would certainly play at home in the first round.... Their 20,000 fans demand it.

[Go Lehigh TU Owl]

That is not how the first round works.

Montana State would certainly play at home in the first round.... Their 20,000 fans demand it.

I completely understand that. Still, imo, they don't deserve to be at home with 4 losses and 7 D1 wins.

[ysubigred]

YSU could lose both and be 8-4.

If Montana State loses twice they'd be 7-5 and 100% on the bubble.

If YSU goes 8-4 ~ losing their last 3, I'd hope they are left out.. @ 9-3 we'll get one maybe two home playoff games.. @10-2 we'll be seeded between 3 -7.

[Lehigh'98]

USD is not the 1-10 team they were last year, and are definitely better than the 4-6 record they currently possess. 1-3 start under QB who is now a WR (and likely starting RB this week), and last minute losses to top ten teams the last two weeks. Yeah, we have 6 losses, but we've played top 25 football since the start of October. Would Colgate or Lehigh have a snowball's chance in hell against Montana, Youngstown, or UNI? Doubt it. USD would win the PL if we were in it, handily at that. Two 6 loss teams lead that league right now, and those 6 losses surely did not come against a schedule anything like we are playing this year.



If a team improving greatly is your definition of irony, then yes, we are being ironic. Next year is going to be even more ironic since we only have about 7 seniors out there with their backups playing very well and a boatload of freshmen and sophomores already starting. Not to mention a 3 time NC head coach who wants nothing more than for USD to be big time. If we aren't a playoff team next year it's because we actually have to play teams with a pulse in the MVFC, plus games @Oregon, @Montana, and vs NAU in the non conference. Hope the AD gives our guys a break and schedules a game with a PL team.

How many teams with winning records has SD beat this year? Zero you say? Basing your teams strength on good losses is a problem with all computer system. That is why every single human voter, including yourself, has Lehigh ranked ahead of SD this year. Good losses and a dollar get you a cup of coffee.

[cmaxwellgsu]

I completely understand that. Still, imo, they don't deserve to be at home with 4 losses and 7 D1 wins.

Deserving went out the door when the bidding walked in. Bidding for home games and regionalization would be the first things I would scrap if I ran the playoffs. Off soapbox now....

[clenz]

How many teams with winning records has SD beat this year? Zero you say? Basing your teams strength on good losses is a problem with all computer system. That is why every single human voter, including yourself, has Lehigh ranked ahead of SD this year. Good losses and a dollar get you a cup of coffee.
FWIW UNI is 5-5 and likely to finish 7-5

[Yotes]

FWIW UNI is 5-5 and likely to finish 7-5
Likely outcomes should not be discussed when referring to UNI this season.

[clenz]

I suppose...


Although it says something about the program when the third stringers on the field are taking other teams first stringers to OT.

[Doc QB]

Lehigh didn't play USD. Lehigh's lack of "schedule strength" to the masses, though, seemed mostly due to guilt by association, with a huge amount of evidence being Colgate's loss to USD.

Hence my sig: "Since South Dakota Beat Colgate, Lehigh didn't get a playoff bid".

Ironically, a 9-3 or 8-4 Youngstown State team may be hanging their hat on that win over South Dakota as evidence that they belong in the playoffs. This year, a win 4-6 USD could be a key element in YSU's inclusion. Last year, I feel it contributed to Lehigh, a 10-1 team that didn't even play USD not getting in.

LFN, I get it. But you did say, "I feel..." I just dont. There were a number of 7-4 and 8-3 teams with a better resume than our beloved LU last year that got left out, and I think that may have been what did them in and kept them home at 10-1. I think some of those teams would have done some damage (i.e. Towson). I "feel" the playoff committee felt it was more of a SOS schedule issue for LU and not the USD beating Colgate effect that kept them home. It was mostly the MVFC posters who put all the stock in the Colgate-USD game. And 'Gate laying an egg only hurt us a league.

[clenz]

LFN, I get it. But you did say, "I feel..." I just dont. There were a number of 7-4 and 8-3 teams with a better resume than our beloved LU last year that got left out, and I think that may have been what did them in and kept them home at 10-1. I think some of those teams would have done some damage (i.e. Towson). I "feel" the playoff committee felt it was more of a SOS schedule issue for LU and not the USD beating Colgate effect that kept them home. It was mostly the MVFC posters who put all the stock in the Colgate-USD game. And 'Gate laying an egg only hurt us a league.The USD/Colgate game is a perfect example of the crap SOS of Lehigh though.

USD was 1-10 last season...1-10 with their 1 win being a 2 score win over the PL co-champion that BEAT LEHIGH. USD kind of controlled that game too after the half. USD outgained Colgate, over 1 yard more per rush, 2 yards more per passing attempt, all while losing the TOP battle by 5 minutes.

That same USD team out rushed by 900 yards on the season, out passed by 300 yards on the season, and they had 25% of the season sacks in that one game, and were outscored by nearly 200 points in their other 10 games.



Maybe that game was an anomaly for both, but it's hard to ignore that game when looking at the SOS/quality of the PL.

[Doc QB]

No matter what Lehigh does it simply isn't enough. Last year it was you didn't beat anyone so you stink. This year Lehigh is one if only a FEW teams to have two wins over ranked teams and it still doesn't matter. 2-1 record against the AGS Top 25 is pretty good imo....

Oftentimes, very true. Typically on this board, if you are not a traditional power, it is not how many ranked teams you beat. Its often that you are a midling program in a tougher, power conference where you exchange wins and losses against similar unranked, midling conference foes who are en route to a 5-6 or 6-5...but you are better because you hail from said power conference. There may be some validity to this argument, but it becomes just as stale as the peseveration regarding the true merit our program's successes.

[Doc QB]

The USD/Colgate game is a perfect example of the crap SOS of Lehigh though.

USD was 1-10 last season...1-10 with their 1 win being a 2 score win over the PL co-champion that BEAT LEHIGH. USD kind of controlled that game too after the half. USD outgained Colgate, over 1 yard more per rush, 2 yards more per passing attempt, all while losing the TOP battle by 5 minutes.

That same USD team out rushed by 900 yards on the season, out passed by 300 yards on the season, and they had 25% of the season sacks in that one game, and were outscored by nearly 200 points in their other 10 games.



Maybe that game was an anomaly for both, but it's hard to ignore that game when looking at the SOS/quality of the PL.

Clenz, I find one game easier to ignore. Our lesser conference and OOC scheduling strength I cannot ignore. Teams change throughout a season, for better or worse, explained (injuries) or unexplained. Your squad this year is a prime example. Last year, 10-1 or not, there were other worthy teams ahead of us, we did not win out league, we sat home. I am okay with that.

[clenz]

Clenz, I find one game easier to ignore. Our lesser conference and OOC scheduling strength I cannot ignore. Teams change throughout a season, for better or worse, explained (injuries) or unexplained. Your squad this year is a prime example. Last year, 10-1 or not, there were other worthy teams ahead of us, we did not win out league, we sat home. I am okay with that.
I'd still put money on this 5-5 UNI team to beat the vast majority (75-80%) of the FCS.

[Doc QB]

I'd still put money on this 5-5 UNI team to beat the vast majority (75-80%) of the FCS.

That may be entirely true, and if some of your injured guys get back in especially. But from 16 to now 24 spots in the tourney, some teams with 7-5 rescords are going to passed over for as long as there are only 24 spots (and less at-large berths). Autobids from lesser deserving teams/conferences can and will occur, too. Nature of the tourney. Thats not my or LU's fault. But going back to the main point of my post several pages back, when LU earns a berth, we perform okay. Ask Tirrelle Rennie.

[clenz]

That UNI team didn't deserve to be in the playoffs...they got in because they were the least ****ty of a ****ty conference in 2010. Seriously, we won the conference at 7-4 and went 0-2 in OOC by a combined score of 49-20. I've said this many times before, Lehigh was the better team that day.

Rennie was playing at about 60% that day. He was taken out of the game the week before at Western Illinois with a knee injury and out back up situation was so bad that year that we had no choice but to trot Rennie out that day. Remember UNI lost to WIU 30-14 the week before that Lehigh game. WIU then went on to the playoffs and App State and got CRUSHED 42-10

I'm not sure any MVFC team finished that season in the top 25, and if they did was it was based on history alone.

I don't expect a 7-5 UNI team to be in, but I wouldn't be shocked if they did get in - especially if they get healthy by that time. Remember, the healthy UNI team dominated an FBS Iowa State (who isn't good, I realize), dominated PFL champ Drake, dominated UNC (not good I realize) and completely dismantled top 10 McNeese State by 4 scores, and lead #1 NDSU AT NDSU for 57 minutes and were 2 iffy penalties away from walking out with a W...then we lost half of our starters in that game and the following week...and then we lost our back ups at positions...last week we were able to run mostly our second string the majority of the game and beat #8 Youngstown State.


A healthy UNI team is very good this year....the banged up UNI team is...well...average

[Lehigh Football Nation]

A 7-5 UNI team will have a very interesting resume for the playoffs if they win out. They'd have a better resume than Youngstown if the Penguins lose out.

I don't have a huge problem with UNI in the field if they make it, because they - without question - played a tough schedule and beat some tough opponents. A win over an FBS and a Top 25 FCS team (and probable playoff participant) makes them a real interesting candidate. If the committee has to/needs to dip to 7 D-I win/5 loss teams, UNI has to be on the top of the list, followed closely by Villanova.

But according to the latest SRS numbers - if you put stock in them - Youngstown State played a less tough schedule than Lafayette. Is it enough for their "schedule strength" that the SRS schedule toughness puts eight of their conferencemates in the Top 16?

[clenz]

YSU did play a complete dog **** OOC SOS other than Michigan State. They played Dayton, Morehead State, and Duquense. You see how SOS is hurt by doing that?


Is SOS that hard to understand?

[Lehigh'98]

YSU did play a complete dog **** OOC SOS other than Michigan State.

That will kill the entire SOS for the season.

The entire MVFC OOC SOS minus 1 SDSU win vs SELA is contingent on NDSU and UNI. The circle jerk that is USD, SIU, ISUr, MSU & YSU have 0 good OOC wins. The fact that UNI was unhealthy when most of them beat them and no one has sniffed NDSU yet leads me to believe the middle of the pack MVFC teams are all slightly overrated(Not including a healthy UNI). If YSU loses its last 2, they are in big trouble ending the season on a 3 game slide in their toughest stretch.

[clenz]

The MVFC/Gateway has always been that way. Before it was NDSU/UNI it was SIU/UNI and before that it was UNI/WKU and before that it was UNI/WIU

Normally though the other MVFC teams hold their own in the OOC.

[BisonFan02]

That UNI team didn't deserve to be in the playoffs...they got in because they were the least ****ty of a ****ty conference in 2010. Seriously, we won the conference at 7-4 and went 0-2 in OOC by a combined score of 49-20. I've said this many times before, Lehigh was the better team that day.

Rennie was playing at about 60% that day. He was taken out of the game the week before at Western Illinois with a knee injury and out back up situation was so bad that year that we had no choice but to trot Rennie out that day. Remember UNI lost to WIU 30-14 the week before that Lehigh game. WIU then went on to the playoffs and App State and got CRUSHED 42-10

I'm not sure any MVFC team finished that season in the top 25, and if they did was it was based on history alone.

I don't expect a 7-5 UNI team to be in, but I wouldn't be shocked if they did get in - especially if they get healthy by that time. Remember, the healthy UNI team dominated an FBS Iowa State (who isn't good, I realize), dominated PFL champ Drake, dominated UNC (not good I realize) and completely dismantled top 10 McNeese State by 4 scores, and lead #1 NDSU AT NDSU for 57 minutes and were 2 iffy penalties away from walking out with a W...then we lost half of our starters in that game and the following week...and then we lost our back ups at positions...last week we were able to run mostly our second string the majority of the game and beat #8 Youngstown State.


A healthy UNI team is very good this year....the banged up UNI team is...well...average

The 2010 Bison finished in the top 25 after losing to EWU in the quarters. That was a very young team that didn't hit their stride till the post season (last team in.....UNI crushed us that year, and I think we were 4-4 in the conference).

[Vitojr130]

The 2010 Bison finished in the top 25 after losing to EWU in the quarters. That was a very young team that didn't hit their stride till the post season (last team in.....UNI crushed us that year, and I think we were 4-4 in the conference).

That's an understatement. I was at that game and not only did they crush us, they powdered us up and mixed us with their favorite drinks.

[clenz]

Yeah...that 16-9 score doesn't show the complete ass kicking.

I do wonder though, is that the game that turned things for NDSU? Did that game show Bohl and crew their biggest weaknesses and force some drastic changes that maybe weren't planned?

That's a serious question too. I had never thought of that till just now

Sent from my S4 using Tapatalk

[Bisonoline]

Yeah...that 16-9 score doesn't show the complete ass kicking.

I do wonder though, is that the game that turned things for NDSU? Did that game show Bohl and crew their biggest weaknesses and force some drastic changes that maybe weren't planned?

That's a serious question too. I had never thought of that till just now

Sent from my S4 using Tapatalk

Its was ugly. How we were still in the game is still a question.

[clenz]

A couple bad fumbles by UNI and it was Rennies first game

Sent from my S4 using Tapatalk

[Bisonoline]

A couple bad fumbles by UNI and it was Rennies first game

Sent from my S4 using Tapatalk.

Your D-line kicked our ass. Seriously it was embarrassing. I remember one play where the OG was knock back on his azz in to the back field.

[BisonFan02]

Yeah...that 16-9 score doesn't show the complete ass kicking.

I do wonder though, is that the game that turned things for NDSU? Did that game show Bohl and crew their biggest weaknesses and force some drastic changes that maybe weren't planned?

That's a serious question too. I had never thought of that till just now

Sent from my S4 using Tapatalk

It was the catalyst for change on the OL, but the offense still had ups/downs as the year went on.

[clenz]

.

Your D-line kicked our ass. Seriously it was embarrassing. I remember one play where the OG was knock back on his azz in to the back field.

Ben mother ****ing Boothby

Sent from my S4 using Tapatalk

[clenz]

It was the catalyst for change on the OL, but the offense still had ups/downs as the year went on.

I would say that your ol is your greatest offensive strength right now. You have good weapons at the skill positions, no doubt, but they are made infinitely better by that OL.

In other words...you're welcome...lol

Sent from my S4 using Tapatalk

[Grizzlies82]

I do wonder though, is that the game that turned things for NDSU? Did that game show Bohl and crew their biggest weaknesses and force some drastic changes that maybe weren't planned?

I saw a dramatic change when they met Montana State in the playoff game. A rather modest bobcat team was kicking their butt and it appeared to be a blowout in the making. NDSU looked downright lousy at worst, or very pedestrian at best. Then like flipping a switch (I believe mid 3rd qt.?) the Bison linemen started dominating on both sides of the ball. The final score was not even close and it was a blowout, except it was a blowout in the Bison's favor. Then ND State took that same attitude over to E. WA and were inches away from winning that one too. I'm sure there were other key moments but from what I've seen North Dakota State has never looked back since that game in Bozeman.

[IBleedYellow]

And yet, two years later, UNI fell and NDSU is sitting here with 2 National Titles in the trophy case, and hoping for a third.

[Bisonoline]

I saw a dramatic change when they met Montana State in the playoff game. A rather modest bobcat team was kicking their butt and it appeared to be a blowout in the making. NDSU looked downright lousy at worst, or very pedestrian at best. Then like flipping a switch (I believe mid 3rd qt.?) the Bison linemen started dominating on both sides of the ball. The final score was not even close and it was a blowout, except it was a blowout in the Bison's favor. Then ND State took that same attitude over to E. WA and were inches away from winning that one too. I'm sure there were other key moments but from what I've seen North Dakota State has never looked back since that game in Bozeman.

The switch was we wore them out. The refs for the game stayed at our hotel. The next day they told a friend of mine that during the game they were all wondering how long MSU was going to last because of the physical line play.

[Grizzlies82]

The switch was we wore them out. The refs for the game stayed at our hotel. The next day they told a friend of mine that during the game they were all wondering how long MSU was going to last because of the physical line play.

It was wild. A bit like watching two entirely different teams playing two separate games. It wasn't merely a matter of momentum. I don't remember seeing anything so extreme before. The first half it appeared NDSU had no business being in the playoffs. In the second half NDSU made MT State appear as if they were a high school team. In the end it was a great dominating win by the Bison.