Ivy League Week 5 (8) - 2013

[bonarae]

Yikes, Yale imploded itself last game. xsmhx That only leaves Harvard, Princeton and Penn contending for the Ivy title, barring another meltdown by these three teams.

This is also the final non-conference Saturday of Ivy League football for 2013.

Let's get to October 19 now:
Fordham at Yale - Fordham's unstoppable. I think they'll run the table for 2013.
Lafayette at Harvard
Cornell at Monmouth
Penn at Columbia
Bucknell at Dartmouth
Princeton at Brown

[Ivytalk]

Fordham
Harvard
Monmouth
Penn
Dartmouth
Brown


Six weeks of football left. Too early to count out anyone but Columbia and Cornell.

[bulldog10jw]

Fordham
Harvard
Monmouth
Penn
Dartmouth
Brown



Agree

[Pard4Life]

So you've dismissed Dartmouth out of hand already? Princeton is not unbeatable. And Yale can always beat everyone else and share the title.

[Go Green]

So you've dismissed Dartmouth out of hand already? Princeton is not unbeatable. And Yale can always beat everyone else and share the title.

I think what he is saying is that Harvard and the Ps are the only teams without a league loss.

Conventional wisdom is that Dartmouth/Yale/Brown/Princeton are all elimination games against each other, as it's unlikely that any of those teams can beat Harvard and Penn. So you can probably cross of Yale and the loser of the Brown-Princeton game from the league title race.

But we will see how it all shakes out. It's not like Penn's victory over Dartmouth was overwhelming...

[Green26]

If Dartmouth had a kicker, they'd be undefeated in conference play. Kicker missed 2 FG's to win against Penn. Missed 2 very short FG's against Yale. Was a decent kicker last year, at least most of the time.

Dartmouth's running back outplayed Yale's all-conference running back. I think he's now 2d on the Dartmouth all-time career rushing list. Dartmouth's qb is very good and a playmaker. Only a sophomore. Remember the Dartmouth qb recruit from 4 years ago who made himself a name by playing well in that military all star game? He converted to tight end last year, worked hard in the offseason, is the starting tight end, and made some big plays in the win yesterday. Congrats to the kid for finding a way to get on the field and help his team.

[Green26]

I think what he is saying is that Harvard and the Ps are the only teams without a league loss.

Conventional wisdom is that Dartmouth/Yale/Brown/Princeton are all elimination games against each other, as it's unlikely that any of those teams can beat Harvard and Penn. So you can probably cross of Yale and the loser of the Brown-Princeton game from the league title race.

But we will see how it all shakes out. It's not like Penn's victory over Dartmouth was overwhelming...

Again, 2 missed FG's by Dartmouth that could have won the game (4 OT's). Dartmouth led Penn in 1st downs, 25 to 20, and total offense 534 to 449. 2 turnovers a piece. Both teams punted 6 times. Dartmouth was 1-4 in FG's, and Penn was 1-2. TOP was 28.5 to 31.5. Average gain per play was 5.9 to 5.5. Plays were 91 to 8a.

[bulldog10jw]

Again, 2 missed FG's by Dartmouth that could have won the game (4 OT's). Dartmouth led Penn in 1st downs, 25 to 20, and total offense 534 to 449. 2 turnovers a piece. Both teams punted 6 times. Dartmouth was 1-4 in FG's, and Penn was 1-2. TOP was 28.5 to 31.5. Average gain per play was 5.9 to 5.5. Plays were 91 to 8a.

Unfortunately, there is no asterisk for a loss because of a kicker. I would actually be in favor of eliminating kicked extra points and making all conversions 2 points on all TD's. I'm not so sure we shouldn't eliminate FG's, too.

[bulldog10jw]

I think what he is saying......

she

[Go Green]

she

No kidding? I've been trying to get my wife (also a Dartmouth grad) to post on these boards as "Mrs. Go Green" for years. :)

[centraljerseycat]

Dartmouth has some very good playmakers and a decent enough defense. Unfortunately, besides a bad kicker, they also possess the worst coach in the history of college football.

[Go Green]

they also possess the worst coach in the history of college football.

He has yet to lose to the current coaches of Princeton, Yale, Columbia, and Cornell.

[Herder]

No offense to anyone here, but who really cares who wins the Ivy? Who really cares who wins any conference, other than it earns you a playoff spot. Could Ivy football be any less revelant than it is? Playing in the Ivy is like being in transition . . . forever . . . yuck! Pull you pants up and get in the playoffs, gee wiz!

[crusader11]

He has yet to lose to the current coaches of Princeton, Yale, Columbia, and Cornell.

Why take an extremely small sample size like that? The coaches at these four schools have been at their respective schools for a combined five years (not including this season).

Why not look at his overall body of work?

He has a woeful winning percentage. Five winning seasons in 23 years as a head coach -- two of those twinning seasons came in his first two years as a head coach at Maine.

Overall record in the Ivy League: 40-50-1.

He is a very arrogant coach and, the funny thing is, I'm not sure what would make him so arrogant.

[crusader11]

It's even uglier when you realize Buddy has had one winning season since he returned to Dartmouth in 2005, and has a 19-37 record during this time.

[Green26]

Why take an extremely small sample size like that? The coaches at these four schools have been at their respective schools for a combined five years (not including this season).

Why not look at his overall body of work?

He has a woeful winning percentage. Five winning seasons in 23 years as a head coach -- two of those twinning seasons came in his first two years as a head coach at Maine.

Overall record in the Ivy League: 40-50-1.

He is a very arrogant coach and, the funny thing is, I'm not sure what would make him so arrogant.

He's not arrogant or an arrogant coach. He's hardly the worst coach around. You obviously don't know what you're talking about. Being the head coach at Maine, Dartmouth twice, Tulane and Stanford, as well as offensive or co-offensive coordinator at Florida and Illinois, makes me think that there have been alot of people who thought Teevens was a good coach.

[Go Green]

Why take an extremely small sample size like that? .

Because that was sufficient to definitively refute the assertion in question. :)

[CFBfan]

If Dartmouth had a kicker, they'd be undefeated in conference play. Kicker missed 2 FG's to win against Penn. Missed 2 very short FG's against Yale. Was a decent kicker last year, at least most of the time.

Dartmouth's running back outplayed Yale's all-conference running back. I think he's now 2d on the Dartmouth all-time career rushing list. Dartmouth's qb is very good and a playmaker. Only a sophomore. Remember the Dartmouth qb recruit from 4 years ago who made himself a name by playing well in that military all star game? He converted to tight end last year, worked hard in the offseason, is the starting tight end, and made some big plays in the win yesterday. Congrats to the kid for finding a way to get on the field and help his team.

and if my aunt had a _______ she'd be my uncle

[Go Green]

And even if you wanted to look at Teevens' entire record, the only place he didn't leave the program in better shape than where he found it was Stanford. And we all know why he didn't succeed at Stanford:

http://www.sfgate.com/sports/article/HIGHER-STANDARDS-Stanford-teams-finding-it-s-2589894.php

To the extent that you're saying that he hasn't won enough (especially since his return), that's fair criticism. Only one other coach in Ivy league history (Columbia's Ray Tellier) has gone a longer stretch without winning a league championship. He's got to win one--and soon. I don't see him surviving another 5-5 season, and even a 6-4 season might not be enough. Winning last Saturday against Yale helped. If we can win the rest (or even just one more loss), we might be able to claim at least part of the title. Here's hoping!!

[CFBfan]

He has yet to lose to the current coaches of Princeton, Yale, Columbia, and Cornell.

That's an irrelevant statement/arguement: Princeton has been turned around and headed in the right direction and their HC has not been there as long as Teevens has been at Dartmouth, Yale is headed in the right direction after only 2 years under current HC, Cornell has a 1st year coach and Columbia will always suck

[Go Green]

Princeton has been turned around and headed in the right direction

Who wrecked Princeton in the first place? The program was medicore/middle of the pack when Hughes left, and became Ivy bottom-feeder when Surace took over. It's great that they are competitive again, but they fell into the hole in the first place under Surace's watch.

And if you want to give Surace a couple of mulligan years for inheriting a bare cupboard, then you have to do the same for Teevens. It's not like he was given the keys to the Bentley at any of his stops...

[CFBfan]

Who wrecked Princeton in the first place? The program was medicore/middle of the pack when Hughes left, and became Ivy bottom-feeder when Surace took over. It's great that they are competitive again, but they fell into the hole in the first place under Surace's watch.

And if you want to give Surace a couple of mulligan years for inheriting a bare cupboard, then you have to do the same for Teevens. It's not like he was given the keys to the Bentley at any of his stops...

it's nice that you like your coach and defend him, good luck the rest of the way

[Skyhawk71]

Fordham @ Yale
Lafayette @ Harvard
Cornell @ Monmouth
Penn @ Columbia
Bucknell @ Dartmouth
Princeton @ Brown

[crusader11]

He's not arrogant or an arrogant coach. He's hardly the worst coach around. You obviously don't know what you're talking about. Being the head coach at Maine, Dartmouth twice, Tulane and Stanford, as well as offensive or co-offensive coordinator at Florida and Illinois, makes me think that there have been alot of people who thought Teevens was a good coach.

Some coaches are better off as lifetime coordinators, rather than head coaches.

[crusader11]

And even if you wanted to look at Teevens' entire record, the only place he didn't leave the program in better shape than where he found it was Stanford. And we all know why he didn't succeed at Stanford:


Teevens was 11-45 in five years at Tulane. Really don't think he left that program better than he found it.

Record-wise, he was pretty good from 1985-91, compiling a record of 39-31-2 at Maine and Dartmouth. Since then, it ain't pretty: 46-123. Staggering.

[CFBfan]

Teevens was 11-45 in five years at Tulane. Really don't think he left that program better than he found it.

Record-wise, he was pretty good from 1985-91, compiling a record of 39-31-2 at Maine and Dartmouth. Since then, it ain't pretty: 46-123. Staggering.

clearly his time is far off in the rear view mirror

[Go Green]

Teevens was 11-45 in five years at Tulane. Really don't think he left that program better than he found it.


And how did Tulane do the two years after Teevens left?

You do get that those were Teevens' recruits, right?

[crusader11]

And how did Tulane do the two years after Teevens left?

You do get that those were Teevens' recruits, right?

I understand that, but I think Tommy Bowden is just a little better than Buddy Teevens.

How Teevens would have done in 1997 we will never know because he won 11 games over five seasons and was sent packing.

[Go Green]

How Teevens would have done in 1997 we will never know because he won 11 games over five seasons and was sent packing.

And that was a shame. But it is what it is.

I think that Dartmouth is in a similar place as Tulane was back then. We have talent to play with anyone (except maybe Harvard) but need to find a way to get over the hump. Maybe Teevens can do it. Maybe we need someone else to return to championship football.

And if Teevens is let go, his successor will be walking into a good situation--just like Bowden did at Tulane.

[CFBfan]

And how did Tulane do the two years after Teevens left?

You do get that those were Teevens' recruits, right?


and Moorehead is working with Macella's recruits at FU BUT and he's winning because HE is a good HC and Macella was NOT!!!

[bonarae]

Final scores:
Fordham 52, Yale 31 - has Yale tailed off so quickly? xsmhx
Harvard 35, Lafayette 16
Monmouth 48, Cornell 23 - Mathews should be off the Payton list because he can't win games.
Penn 21, Columbia 7
Bucknell 17, Dartmouth 14 - the Big Green are bipolar...
Princeton 39, Brown 17 - Princeton is a contender for the Ivy title now...