UTC turned down the Sun Belt

[chattownmocs]

http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/2013/mar/28/utc-is-not-interested-in-fbs-move/?sportscollege

[Smitty]

Well on a side note if WCU could ever get their crap together and grow a little more, we could be in the Sun Belt (in 20 years)...

[walliver]

I commend the UTC administration for looking honestly at the numbers, and not being lured away. Unless a team is routinely pulling in 20,000-25,000 fans every home game, there is no reason to look at FBS.

[chattownmocs]

Unfortunately they claim they are satisfied with the socon and havent looked at the OVC.

[mountaineer in Cane Land]

said it before, Chatt becouse of its tv market, is very attractive to mid major conferences, great stadium, easy access to great recruiting areas, etc. But Chatts past administrations were basically idiots when to came to growing the athletic dept. there should be 25,000 at every home game, easy. Given this administration credit for staying put at this time, I believe they will not be ready for the move atleast for 10 years

[asumike83]

I commend the UTC administration for looking honestly at the numbers, and not being lured away. Unless a team is routinely pulling in 20,000-25,000 fans every home game, there is no reason to look at FBS.

Exactly. UTC is going to get some looks because they have a great basketball arena, easily expandable football stadium and are in a solid TV market/recruiting area. However, if you're only getting 10K to your football games, it does not make financial sense.

This is the most telling segment:

Financially, making the numbers work would be very difficult. The FCS scholarship limit is 63; in the FBS, it's 85. UTC also doesn't fully fund all of its sports, so, Herron said, it would be hard to justify spending millions on moving to the FBS when not all programs are at their scholarship limits.

"We're trying to be as competitive as we can on this level," she said.

Scholarship funding is maxed out even without all sports fully funded. They'd have to add 22 football scholarships and start a baseball program along with fully funding the programs they already sponsor. Honestly, I'd like to keep playing them but it will be a while, if they're even interested down the road.

[SpeedkingATL]

UTC would be a great natural fit in the Sunbelt. My only question is how do schools get around the rules of average attendance when being considered for FBS? UTC doesn't meet the criterial and there was one other recent move up that also didn't meet the requirement (UMass??). What gives?

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

Unfortunately they claim they are satisfied with the socon and havent looked at the OVC.

Again, why on Earth move to the OVC where you will have a sparse chance of a seed or at-large bid to the FCS playoffs and a larger geographic footprint? Especially with ETSU possibly coming in soon? The OVC isn't being considered by your admin because it's a nutty idea.

[Apphole]

Nothing in this article suggests UTC turned down an official invite as the thread title suggests. Benson has stated before that he's weighing ALL his options from the most likely to the least likely. I'm sure he's had similar contact with other FCS schools, gauging their interest as well as the feasibility of each school making the move. I highly doubt UTC would have been invited even if they wanted to join the SBC.

[chattownmocs]

Nothing in this article suggests UTC turned down an official invite as the thread title suggests. Benson has stated before that he's weighing ALL his options from the most likely to the least likely. I'm sure he's had similar contact with other FCS schools, gauging their interest as well as the feasibility of each school making the move. I highly doubt UTC would have been invited even if they wanted to join the SBC.

Yes clearly the Sun Belt called everyone else before finally settling for App State and Georgia Southern. I agree, obviously there wouldn't be an invite unless they were sure yes would be the answer.

[walliver]

... Scholarship funding is maxed out even without all sports fully funded. They'd have to add 22 football scholarships and start a baseball program along with fully funding the programs they already sponsor. Honestly, I'd like to keep playing them but it will be a while, if they're even interested down the road.


Baseball is not required for FBS (I don't know if the SBC requires it). In fact, many schools are dropping baseball for Title IX reasons. However, in addition to 22 new FB scholarships, the school has to come up with 22 new female scholarships. One of the problems UTC faces, is that just like UL-L and UL-M, it is in a state where there is ONE big time football program, and just about everyone is a fan of that one team.

[asumike83]

Yes clearly the Sun Belt called everyone else before finally settling for App State and Georgia Southern. I agree, obviously there wouldn't be an invite unless they were sure yes would be the answer.

I think the point is that "being contacted" does not equal "invited". Trust me, nobody knows that more that App State. If that were the case, I guess we "turned down" C-USA and the MAC.

[dgtw]

It is not required to have a baseball program to be in the FBS. In fact, a number of BCS level schools don't have a baseball team, but those are mostly northern schools.

I don't know if it is a Sun Belt rule, but everyone in the league right now has a team, along with the five schools who will soon join as a full member.

[chattownmocs]

Baseball is not required for FBS (I don't know if the SBC requires it). In fact, many schools are dropping baseball for Title IX reasons. However, in addition to 22 new FB scholarships, the school has to come up with 22 new female scholarships. One of the problems UTC faces, is that just like UL-L and UL-M, it is in a state where there is ONE big time football program, and just about everyone is a fan of that one team.

Not true at all. Chattanooga faces a larger problem. Chattanooga is located right in the center of UA UT and UGA and te fans here are SEC bandwagon fans. They cant even capitalize on the downturn of Tennessee football or schedule to avoid going against UT football because there is still UGA and Alabama to compete against. Chattanooga benefits from having a team that plays on a lower level and does not create a direct conflict of interest with those schools. If Chattanooga became an annual contender in the FCS their following would be greater than if they were an SBC also-ran.

[chattownmocs]

I think the point is that "being contacted" does not equal "invited". Trust me, nobody knows that more that App State. If that were the case, I guess we "turned down" C-USA and the MAC.

Being contacted to gauge interest and being called back as a courtesy arent the same either.

[asumike83]

Baseball is not required for FBS (I don't know if the SBC requires it). In fact, many schools are dropping baseball for Title IX reasons. However, in addition to 22 new FB scholarships, the school has to come up with 22 new female scholarships. One of the problems UTC faces, is that just like UL-L and UL-M, it is in a state where there is ONE big time football program, and just about everyone is a fan of that one team.

True, it is not an FBS requirement (not sure about SBC policy) but the Sun Belt is typically a multi-bid baseball conference rated in the 7-10 range and all the current members participate in baseball. With the conference having 12 members for all sports, it would throw off the 6/6 divisional balance to add a school without baseball, although I suppose anything is possible.

[chattownmocs]

True, it is not an FBS requirement (not sure about SBC policy) but the Sun Belt is typically a multi-bid baseball conference rated in the 7-10 range and all the current members participate in baseball. With the conference having 12 members for all sports, it would throw off the 6/6 divisional balance to add a school without baseball, although I suppose anything is possible.

I think a 16 team basketball and football conference and a 14 team baseball league would be perfectly acceptable for the SUN Belt.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

"I let them know that that was not on our radar at this time, but you never know, with a change in chancellor and a change in AD, what the future might hold," Herron told the Times Free Press. "It's not anything we've looked at."

1. This seems to imply that the president is against going to FBS.
2. Isn't it weird that they haven't even looked at the possibility? I don't think Lehigh's ever going to be an FBS school, but I'd want my AD to at least analyze every option available. Especially if a conference was on the phone asking about us.

[ASUMountaineer]

Yes clearly the Sun Belt called everyone else before finally settling for App State and Georgia Southern. I agree, obviously there wouldn't be an invite unless they were sure yes would be the answer.

xlolx

[Apphole]

I think the point is that "being contacted" does not equal "invited".

This. This is a more concise version of my previous post. Chattown's spin job is a fail.

[HappyAppy]

Haha what a joke of a thread. The Sun Belt did their due diligence, and had a big list of schools early on. From an actual e-mail from Karl Benson, there were 15 schools on this list including the likes of Towson, Illinois State, Lamar, and Liberty. They were covering all of their bases and considering all of their options early in the process. They made a call to UTC to see if they would have any interest in even being considered, just like they called the other 15 schools. UTC knew they had no shot at raising the support or budget to move to FBS, so they said no. If they had said yes, they would have been considered for two seconds like the other schools at the bottom of the list. A quick look at program support, facilities, and budget would have gotten them a “thanks but no thanks” from the Sun Belt.

If you want to tell yourself that = “Turned down the Sun Belt”, good for you. Everybody knows that = “No way in hell we could compete financially or athletically with FBS schools”.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

The title is UTC turned down the Sun Belt. As he said conferences don't make official invites unless they are positive it will be accepted. I don't see anything wrong with what is titled or that he is doing a spin job? I'll admit I skimmed though.

[HappyAppy]

The title is UTC turned down the Sun Belt. As he said conferences don't make official invites unless they are positive it will be accepted. I don't see anything wrong with what is titled or that he is doing a spin job? I'll admit I skimmed though.

That might fly if it was any other poster, but everybody knows what he is trying to imply.

They didn't turn the Sun Belt down. They got a call to see if they had any interest (just like 14 other schools), they said they could possibly have interest in the future with a new AD/Chancellor, and that was the end of it.

If the Carolina Panthers called me and asked if I would like to try out at QB with 14 other guys, and I said "No thanks, I have a broken leg and couldn't possibly compete with those other guys", I didn't turn down the Carolina Panthers. I turned down the chance to waste my time trying to get something I know I had no shot at.

[Sandlapper Spike]

1. This seems to imply that the president is against going to FBS.
2. Isn't it weird that they haven't even looked at the possibility? I don't think Lehigh's ever going to be an FBS school, but I'd want my AD to at least analyze every option available. Especially if a conference was on the phone asking about us.

No, UTC didn't have a chancellor. I think its new one comes on board in July. UTC also doesn't have an AD right now.

[chattownmocs]

Haha what a joke of a thread. The Sun Belt did their due diligence, and had a big list of schools early on. From an actual e-mail from Karl Benson, there were 15 schools on this list including the likes of Towson, Illinois State, Lamar, and Liberty. They were covering all of their bases and considering all of their options early in the process. They made a call to UTC to see if they would have any interest in even being considered, just like they called the other 15 schools. UTC knew they had no shot at raising the support or budget to move to FBS, so they said no. If they had said yes, they would have been considered for two seconds like the other schools at the bottom of the list. A quick look at program support, facilities, and budget would have gotten them a “thanks but no thanks” from the Sun Belt.

If you want to tell yourself that = “Turned down the Sun Belt”, good for you. Everybody knows that = “No way in hell we could compete financially or athletically with FBS schools”.

They called 2 months ago. What facilities are you talking about BTW?


17639

17640

17641

17642

You are asserting that the Sun Belt did no homework whatsoever before picking up the phone and calling us 2 months ago?

[chattownmocs]

That might fly if it was any other poster, but everybody knows what he is trying to imply.

They didn't turn the Sun Belt down. They got a call to see if they had any interest (just like 14 other schools), they said they could possibly have interest in the future with a new AD/Chancellor, and that was the end of it.

If the Carolina Panthers called me and asked if I would like to try out at QB with 14 other guys, and I said "No thanks, I have a broken leg and couldn't possibly compete with those other guys", I didn't turn down the Carolina Panthers. I turned down the chance to waste my time trying to get something I know I had no shot at.

The Panthers wouldn't call you. They definitely wouldn't call you if they had Tom Brady and Peyton Manning on the other line. Don't you get that?

[Skjellyfetti]

I think we've known this for awhile. UTC was listed as one of Benson's "potential members" in the FOIA request by AppStateNation:


Appalachian State
Delaware
Georgia Southern
Idaho
Illinois State
Jacksonville State
James Madison
Lamar
Liberty
Missouri State
New Mexico State
Richmond
Sam Houston State
Towson
UT Chattanooga

http://www.appstatenation.com/2013/02/01/exclusive-e-mail-obtained-via-foia-request-reveals-sun-belt-expansion-candidates/

Probably a lot on that list weren't ready/weren't interested in a move. Nothing shocking about that.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

I think we've known this for awhile. UTC was listed as one of Benson's "potential members" in the FOIA request by AppStateNation:



http://www.appstatenation.com/2013/02/01/exclusive-e-mail-obtained-via-foia-request-reveals-sun-belt-expansion-candidates/

Probably a lot on that list weren't ready/weren't interested in a move. Nothing shocking about that.

Exactly.

[TheRevSFA]

I think I speak for a majority of the country when I state: "Who Cares?"

[chattownmocs]

I think I speak for a majority of the country when I state: "Who Cares?"

Heterosexual Males that aren't obsessed with Purple.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

That might fly if it was any other poster, but everybody knows what he is trying to imply.

They didn't turn the Sun Belt down. They got a call to see if they had any interest (just like 14 other schools), they said they could possibly have interest in the future with a new AD/Chancellor, and that was the end of it.

If the Carolina Panthers called me and asked if I would like to try out at QB with 14 other guys, and I said "No thanks, I have a broken leg and couldn't possibly compete with those other guys", I didn't turn down the Carolina Panthers. I turned down the chance to waste my time trying to get something I know I had no shot at.

Or it could have something to do with some of you guys' overreactions to anything he posts. If you called 10 girls and said "hey, would you be interested if I were to ask you out for a beer in the future?" and you were asking them because you wated ONE of them to accept it doesn't mean that those that said "can't do it" didn't decline...for whatever reason.

They wouldn't be interested if you ask, you don't ask. If all are interested then great you ask the one that's best for you. In all honesty if UTC had said yes we are interested then it may very well have changed who was maing announcements yesterday. App/GSU have advantages in some regards and UTC has advantages in other regards.

[TheRevSFA]

Heterosexual Males that aren't obsessed with Purple.

That's the best retort you have? Come on now. You're supposed to rise up now that App and Georgia Southern are leaving.

Get better, then come back and try again.

[ASUMountaineer]

I think I speak for a majority of the country when I state: "Who Cares?"

Knock, knock?


I agree with you.

[chattownmocs]

That's the best retort you have? Come on now. You're supposed to rise up now that App and Georgia Southern are leaving.

Get better, then come back and try again.

17643

[NoDak 4 Ever]

Or it could have something to do with some of you guys' overreactions to anything he posts. If you called 10 girls and said "hey, would you be interested if I were to ask you out for a beer in the future?" and you were asking them because you wated ONE of them to accept it doesn't mean that those that said "can't do it" didn't decline...for whatever reason.

They wouldn't be interested if you ask, you don't ask. If all are interested then great you ask the one that's best for you. In all honesty if UTC had said yes we are interested then it may very well have changed who was maing announcements yesterday. App/GSU have advantages in some regards and UTC has advantages in other regards.

I agree. Chattown's a total dip**** but even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while.

[TheRevSFA]

Knock, knock?


I agree with you.

I am going to miss the knock knock jokes....

[ASUMountaineer]

I am going to miss the knock knock jokes....

xlolx

[Appaholic]

Unfortunately they claim they are satisfied with the socon and havent looked at the OVC.

I'm sure they are...they couldn't compete with App & GSU as FCS, no way they stand a chance when those schools are sporting 80+ schollies. By staying on the porch in the SoCon, they should at least compete for 3rd place on a consistent basis...

[Appaholic]

Or it could have something to do with some of you guys' overreactions to anything he posts. If you called 10 girls and said "hey, would you be interested if I were to ask you out for a beer in the future?" and you were asking them because you wated ONE of them to accept it doesn't mean that those that said "can't do it" didn't decline...for whatever reason.

They wouldn't be interested if you ask, you don't ask. If all are interested then great you ask the one that's best for you. In all honesty if UTC had said yes we are interested then it may very well have changed who was maing announcements yesterday. App/GSU have advantages in some regards and UTC has advantages in other regards.

Yes, like chattownmocs as their message board spokesman..xlmaox

[EmeryZach]

UTC would be a great natural fit in the Sunbelt. My only question is how do schools get around the rules of average attendance when being considered for FBS? UTC doesn't meet the criterial and there was one other recent move up that also didn't meet the requirement (UMass??). What gives?

Here's how you do it. You have one of your larger sponsors, say Coca Cola, buy a very large amount of tickets. In exchange, Coca Cola does not have to pay for their advertising for that year (or at least part of it). That way you have sold enough tickets to average 15,000 once every two years. The NCAA counts any paid tickets towards the 15,000 average number. It doesn't matter if no one shows up to sit in those seats. You can't just hand out free tickets, they have to be paid for to count, so that's why having the big sponsors buy the tickets in exchange for free advertising works.

The MAC has been using this loophole for years.

[chattownmocs]

http://www.gomocs.com/mediaPortal/player.dbml?catid=55712&id=2049905

WE SHALL ACHIEVE!!!

[NoDak 4 Ever]

http://www.gomocs.com/mediaPortal/player.dbml?catid=55712&id=2049905

WE SHALL ACHIEVE!!!

Achieve what? 4th in the SoCon?

A 29th straight year of no playoffs?

[SpeedkingATL]

Here's how you do it. You have one of your larger sponsors, say Coca Cola, buy a very large amount of tickets. In exchange, Coca Cola does not have to pay for their advertising for that year (or at least part of it). That way you have sold enough tickets to average 15,000 once every two years. The NCAA counts any paid tickets towards the 15,000 average number. It doesn't matter if no one shows up to sit in those seats. You can't just hand out free tickets, they have to be paid for to count, so that's why having the big sponsors buy the tickets in exchange for free advertising works.

The MAC has been using this loophole for years.

Thanks for the explaination. That makes sense..............