Anybody need an All American center?

[CID1990]

Looks like we may be losing Sellers to an honor violation. The article also mentions John Brown, who did well at Liberty after having to leave El Cid.

http://www.postandcourier.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=%2F20130211%2FPC20%2F130219876%2F1036% 2Fcitadel-football-career-of-bulldogs-x2019-all-american-mike-sellers-could-be-over

[Laker]

That would be a huge loss. I bet that someone would be eager to pick him up.

[HailSzczur]

We have an all American candidate coming back from an injury, but thanks anyway.

Makes me think of the BYU guy Brandon Davies who got kicked off the team for an honor violation.

[BisonFan02]

Considering the Bison only lose 2 total seniors from the offense (FB Garrett Bruhn and C Joe Lund), the C spot is technically open. :D

[BisonFan02]

68 Ty Beckius OG 6-4 298 Sr. Mahnomen, Minn. (Mahnomen HS)
13 Aireal Boyd CB 6-1 184 Sr. LaPorte, Texas (NDSCS) (LaPorte HS)
47 Garrett Bruhn TE 6-1 241 Sr. Beatrice, Neb. (Beatrice HS)
96 Ricky Hagen DE 6-3 242 Sr. Colfax, Wis. (Colfax HS)
73 Joe Lund C 6-2 303 Sr. Bloomington, Minn. (Kennedy HS)
8 Andre' Martin, Jr. CB 5-10 191 Sr. St. Louis, Mo. (UNI) (McCluer HS)
10 Bobby Ollman SS 5-11 201 Sr. Meqoun, Wis. (Homestead HS)


Bison entire senior class...Ty Beckius missed the entire season as well. 2 Starters on O and 2 on D (1 if you include Heagle instead of Ollman)....could be scary next year.

[Bisonoline]

That would be a huge loss. I bet that someone would be eager to pick him up.

Tough to find a gig for just one year.

[seantaylor]

Thug from a thug school. No surprise. El Chit is like the UGA of the Socon

[CID1990]

Thug from a thug school. No surprise. El Chit is like the UGA of the Socon

The irony of having the biggest GSU troll call anyone a thug is about as rich as it gets.

This kid manhandled that mangoatdonkey of yours on your own field.

The only time GSU will ever let an All American go is if the NCAA or the Ga Dept of Corrections forces the issue.

[CFBfan]

he must've been hanging out with "citdog" !

[citdog]

he must've been hanging out with "citdog" !

Truly a sad situation for ALL involved. I hope he is able to catch on with another school.

[Baldy]

This kid manhandled that mangoatdonkey of yours on your own field.

The only time GSU will ever let an All American go is if the NCAA or the Ga Dept of Corrections forces the issue.
Please explain since ManBearPig was injured and didn't play against your psedo all-american on our own field.

We know what he did last season against your kid...5 solo tackles, 1 sack, and 2 tackles for a loss. #owned

Well, we've never had an All-American get accused of cheating before, so who knows? xrolleyesx


You are correct about one thing....'skins is king of the trolls. xnodx

[CID1990]

Yes it is, but I am sure there is an FCS school out there who could use him. He's a good, safe bet and will probably be getting a sniff at the combine next year.

[CFBfan]

Yes it is, but I am sure there is an FCS school out there who could use him. He's a good, safe bet and will probably be getting a sniff at the combine next year.

how is a cheater "a good safe bet" ???????

[citdog]

how is a cheater "a good safe bet" ???????

there are only TWO schools in the entire country that would have expelled him for what he did. The Citadel and VMI are those two schools. The cheating scandals at the federal service academies, had they occurred at either named school, would have resulted in the expulsion of all involved. Don't kid yourself to think that if YOUR school had a two time All American accused of what Sellers was that you wouldn't give him a second chance. There are NO second chances at The Citadel or VMI.

[CID1990]

Please explain since ManBearPig was injured and didn't play against your psedo all-american on our own field.

We know what he did last season against your kid...5 solo tackles, 1 sack, and 2 tackles for a loss. #owned

Well, we've never had an All-American get accused of cheating before, so who knows? xrolleyesx


You are correct about one thing....'skins is king of the trolls. xnodx

I stand corrected on Russell, I had the seasons switched. I guess if he had had just one more tackle GSU woulda woulda won, right? 23-21.

We don't know if the charge was cheating. Our honor system will boot you just for knowing about someone else's HV and not reporting it. That said, we HV lots of kids every year. I guarantee you that GSU's honor system is not nearly as stringently enforced, and that isn't a knock on GSU. This is not the first time nor will it be the last time that we prioritize the Honor System over the athletic department. Or, maybe we just recruit cheaters. We don't graduate them, though.

And yes, you guys not only have ManBearPig, you also have Eagleskins.

[CID1990]

how is a cheater "a good safe bet" ???????

He'd be more than fine at 99.9% of all the schools out there.

But I was talking about football.

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

I could see SC State taking him like they took Asheton Jordan.

[kdinva]

there are only TWO schools in the entire country that would have expelled him for what he did. The Citadel and VMI are those two schools. There are NO second chances at The Citadel or VMI.

Liberty believes in 2nd, 3rd, and 4th chances.........he should contact Coach Gill.

[CID1990]

I could see SC State taking him like they took Asheton Jordan.

That is entirely possible.

Wishing him well wherever he goes.

[CFBfan]

there are only TWO schools in the entire country that would have expelled him for what he did. The Citadel and VMI are those two schools. The cheating scandals at the federal service academies, had they occurred at either named school, would have resulted in the expulsion of all involved. Don't kid yourself to think that if YOUR school had a two time All American accused of what Sellers was that you wouldn't give him a second chance. There are NO second chances at The Citadel or VMI.

right and army, navy & air force would look the other way!! AND there are more schools than you want to admitt that would also toss him!!
every ivy MOST PL's and I guarantee FBS schools like ND, Stanford, Northwestern, etc would too!!
stop playing with your cit-saber and get a clue dog!!!

[LeadBolt]

You can never have enough high quality o linemen. Anyone know what he was actually booted for?

[walliver]

At least it wasn't an armed home-invasion of a coach's house this time.

I agree that students expelled for non-criminal reasons have a right to privacy, but sometimes secrecy leads to public to suspect more that is actually present.

He apparently can transfer without penalty, but I suspect he will end up in D2 and then with the Philadelphia Eagles.

[citdog]

right and army, navy & air force would look the other way!! AND there are more schools than you want to admitt that would also toss him!!
every ivy MOST PL's and I guarantee FBS schools like ND, Stanford, Northwestern, etc would too!!
stop playing with your cit-saber and get a clue dog!!!


All three federal acadamies have had cheating scandals involving HUNDREDS of Cadets including the 1976 incident at west point incident which involved HALF of the Junior class. No expulsions.

ND covered up for Teo. Stanford wouldn't have booted Andrew Luck.

FACTS cfb are your ENEMY.

[CID1990]

At least it wasn't an armed home-invasion of a coach's house this time.

Hey, that one will give ya mileage for the next 20 years. That's about how long we go between football players going bad.

[CID1990]

You can never have enough high quality o linemen. Anyone know what he was actually booted for?

No, but it was one of four things; he either

1. lied

2. cheated

3. stole

4. tolerated someone doing the above

I think stealing/shoplifting is pretty much a 'suspended for 2 games' kind of deal at most of the schools where the holier than thou critics on this thread went. We won't even bring up lying.

[CID1990]

right and army, navy & air force would look the other way!! AND there are more schools than you want to admitt that would also toss him!!
every ivy MOST PL's and I guarantee FBS schools like ND, Stanford, Northwestern, etc would too!!
stop playing with your cit-saber and get a clue dog!!!

I have lots of family who went to the USNA. Heck, I even had an appointment there. My cousin was in the athletic program back in the 80s and 90s and believe me, the service academies are not the bastions of integrity that you might think they are, and not just in the venue of the honor systems. But then there are those of us who believe in the infallibility of the federal government, and the academies are run by the federal government, ergo...

Although I know nothing about them, on the surface I would not be surprised if you are right about the Ivies and the PL, but I guarantee you they still do not have honor systems as strict as those at VMI or The Citadel.

[ElCid]

All three federal acadamies have had cheating scandals involving HUNDREDS of Cadets including the 1976 incident at west point incident which involved HALF of the Junior class. No expulsions.

I know the AF Academy has had its share over the years. Right out of the Wiki AF Academy page:

"The first Honor scandal broke in 1965, when a resigning cadet reported knowing of more than 100 cadets who had been involved in a cheating ring. One hundred and nine cadets were ultimately expelled. Cheating scandals plagued the Academy again in 1967, 1972, 1984, 2004 and 2007. Following each of these events, the Academy thoroughly examined the etiology of the mass cheating in addition to alleged excessive pressures that the academic system at the time placed on cadets and made changes in attempts to reduce the opportunities for future incidents."

I have firsthand knowledge of the 1984 one as I knew about 30 of them in the AF and witnessed their culture of "academic cooperation" as they called it. There were no mass expulsions. The only punishment they received was to delay their careers by one year. As a 1985 grad it took me a while to figure out why so many 1984 AFA grads were in training with me. Someone finally spilled the beans. The whole thing was funny as the AF Academy honor code states "We will not lie, steal or cheat, nor tolerate among us anyone who does." Except of course if it involves more than a couple cadets; then it would not be politically correct or economical to boot anyone out.

[GlassOnion]

The AF Academy isnt exactly a fair representation of the other two, is it? Nor is the AF as a branch representative of how the others operate.

[Baldy]

And yes, you guys not only have ManBearPig, you also have Eagleskins.
ManBearPig is gone, but eagleskins isn't. :(

[ElCid]

The AF Academy isnt exactly a fair representation of the other two, is it? Nor is the AF as a branch representative of how the others operate.

No, they are all separate, but the same issue has applied at all three. There are no more mass expulsions for cheating at any of them. I guess someone decided that if that many cheated it must not be their fault.xconfusedx

[CID1990]

ManBearPig is gone, but eagleskins isn't. :(

That's what you call a lose-lose situation.

[CID1990]

The AF Academy isnt exactly a fair representation of the other two, is it? Nor is the AF as a branch representative of how the others operate.

No, they are different in many ways, but when it comes to separating service members they follow the same rules. In theory.

AFA and West Point have both had scandals involving large amounts of organized cheating. In those situations, the service academies usually try to find a way to avoid expelling people.

I imagine that if we or VMI had a situation where 100 or more cadets were involved in a cheating ring, the temptation would be there to try to find ways to be lenient (because after all, 100 less cadets means 100 less tuition paying sources), but 1. we have never had mass cheating scandals (that might be a function of the fact that you don't joke around with the honor systems in those schools) so we have not had to face that, and 2. if we did, I am confident that both schools would stand by their principles and boot each and every one of them out.

Another difference between the service academies and VMI and The Citadel are that at the service academies there are standardized curricula across all majors. I cannot speak to AFA and West Point, but at the USNA EVERYBODY takes engineering. Period. When you have the entire student body taking the same very difficult course, that might lend a little more to the incidence of large numbers of student "collaborating". VMI and El Cid do not have standardized curricula in that way (except in ROTC... and who the hell needs to cheat at THAT? Its a GPA helper!), and therefore group cheating, if it occurred, would be isolated to much smaller groups of cadets.

[ElCid]

When I first read the artilce in the Courier I was shocked. In everything I have ever read about him, this kid seemed to have it together.

Unfortunately my first thought was, crap, we just lost atleast two more games next season, or worse.

Then I thought crap, this kid may have just blown his life. Yeah, there is no room for honor violators and he will be gone, but let's hope he recovers.

I also hope our Offensive Line recovers.

[344Johnson]

All three federal acadamies have had cheating scandals involving HUNDREDS of Cadets including the 1976 incident at west point incident which involved HALF of the Junior class. No expulsions.

ND covered up for Teo. Stanford wouldn't have booted Andrew Luck.

FACTS cfb are your ENEMY.

Really? Smacking on the schools that get the elite officer prospects? Strength in numbers just like a college party when the cops show up. The more involved, the fewer punished.


The AF Academy isnt exactly a fair representation of the other two, is it? Nor is the AF as a branch representative of how the others operate.

The Air Force Academy is a perfectly fair representation of what a service academy is.

Hope the kid finds a new school without too much trouble.

[GlassOnion]

No, they are all separate, but the same issue has applied at all three. There are no more mass expulsions for cheating at any of them. I guess someone decided that if that many cheated it must not be their fault.xconfusedx

Mass cheating is more a sign of 18-22 year old college students than anything else IMO. Doesnt take much in this culture and time to lead others off the correct path. This society is "Lemming-izing," technology is just speeding up the process.

[GlassOnion]

The Air Force Academy is a perfectly fair representation of what a service academy is.



The AF Academy is a fair representation of what the AFA is.

[CID1990]

Mass cheating is more a sign of 18-22 year old college students than anything else IMO. Doesnt take much in this culture and time to lead others off the correct path. This society is "Lemming-izing," technology is just speeding up the process.

I think there is merit to this, as well. The academies and the state military colleges are by no means immune. But it comes down to how you deal with it. I am proud that The Citadel has stuck to its guns on the honor system. it sucks to lose players, but you have to play within the system, and the system is unforgiving. There's a lesson in that.

On the up side, before Sellers' departure, we had all 5 OLs returning. He will be sorely missed, but we still have a very experienced OL and will still be stout. Sellers' likely replacement will be Sam Frye. He's a good one. I was in school with his brother, Chris Frye, who was on the team that beat up on all those FBS schools back in the late 80s-early 90s.

[GlassOnion]

I think there is merit to this, as well. The academies and the state military colleges are by no means immune. But it comes down to how you deal with it. I am proud that The Citadel has stuck to its guns on the honor system. it sucks to lose players, but you have to play within the system, and the system is unforgiving. There's a lesson in that.

On the up side, before Sellers' departure, we had all 5 OLs returning. He will be sorely missed, but we still have a very experienced OL and will still be stout. Sellers' likely replacement will be Sam Frye. He's a good one. I was in school with his brother, Chris Frye, who was on the team that beat up on all those FBS schools back in the late 80s-early 90s.

Wow, thats quite a freakin gap, what is that, 20-25 years between brothers?

BTW, hope Seller's ends up ok. These kind of dismissals, to me, are more of an example for those that remain than a punishment to the individual. I bet it sure hurts though.

[BEAR]

Nope. Got one. xlolx

[344Johnson]

The AF Academy is a fair representation of what the AFA is.

Don't understand your beef with the Air Force Academy...or the Air Force in general. Get denied admission bro?

[ElCid]

Another difference between the service academies and VMI and The Citadel are that at the service academies there are standardized curricula across all majors. I cannot speak to AFA and West Point, but at the USNA EVERYBODY takes engineering. Period. When you have the entire student body taking the same very difficult course, that might lend a little more to the incidence of large numbers of student "collaborating". VMI and El Cid do not have standardized curricula in that way (except in ROTC... and who the hell needs to cheat at THAT? Its a GPA helper!), and therefore group cheating, if it occurred, would be isolated to much smaller groups of cadets.

Overall a real good analysis. But I think there are still a couple liberal arts classes that are mandatory across the board. Not the kind that lend themselves to cheating though. Kind of hard to cheat when writing a composition in class. Maybe they don't do that anymore.

And yes.......thank God for AF ROTC!

[GlassOnion]

Don't understand your beef with the Air Force Academy...or the Air Force in general. Get denied admission bro?

Nope. No beef. The Air Force's scope alone dictates big differences from the other academies. Then you have the huge disparity in how long each academy has been operating, and refining what it does. I "like" and am thankfull for all branches of the military, although I do hold a special preferance for the Navy and Marines. And in having preferences, I highly doubt Im alone, whether they are the same as mine or not.

[ElCid]

Really? Smacking on the schools that get the elite officer prospects?

Prospects being the key word here. I have seen both dirt bags and great officers come out of the Academy. The same goes for ROTC, including The Citadel and VMI. Once on active duty, Officer prospects, like a recruiting class, begin to show their true capability and the outcome is not necessarily what you would think. In other words it is usually more hype than reality.

[CFBfan]

All three federal acadamies have had cheating scandals involving HUNDREDS of Cadets including the 1976 incident at west point incident which involved HALF of the Junior class. No expulsions.

ND covered up for Teo. Stanford wouldn't have booted Andrew Luck.

FACTS cfb are your ENEMY.

not distorted facts......the 70's was a different world and teo did NOT cheat (not a fan of his but he did NOT cheat)
Since Luck did NOT cheat you are clearly NOT dealing in facts
now go back under your moss covered rock

[CFBfan]

I have lots of family who went to the USNA. Heck, I even had an appointment there. My cousin was in the athletic program back in the 80s and 90s and believe me, the service academies are not the bastions of integrity that you might think they are, and not just in the venue of the honor systems. But then there are those of us who believe in the infallibility of the federal government, and the academies are run by the federal government, ergo...

Although I know nothing about them, on the surface I would not be surprised if you are right about the Ivies and the PL, but I guarantee you they still do not have honor systems as strict as those at VMI or The Citadel.

that said, i played with a RB who was thrown out of annapolis for cheating....many years ago

[citdog]

not distorted facts......the 70's was a different world and teo did NOT cheat (not a fan of his but he did NOT cheat)
Since Luck did NOT cheat you are clearly NOT dealing in facts
now go back under your moss covered rock


dude it'll go in easier if you just say you didn't know what the **** you were talking about.

[citdog]

not distorted facts......the 70's was a different world and teo did NOT cheat (not a fan of his but he did NOT cheat)
Since Luck did NOT cheat you are clearly NOT dealing in facts
now go back under your moss covered rock

many of those former Cadets from the hudson high class of '76 have held and then RESIGNED from senior level posts in the Army for less than honorable conduct.....coincidence? i think not.

the spanish moss is on TREES schleprock.

[blueballs]

That's unfortunate for the young man and his now former teammates.

Getting dismissed from the Citadel is a real left turn in the road of life. Say what you want about them but they stick together for life, it is a true brotherhood, and a LOT of wealthy and influential people are Citadel alums. He pissed away a lot of potential opportunity there.

Hopefully for him he'll learn from his errors and overcome them to find success in life elsewhere.