Walter Payton and Buck Buchanan Lists Announced

[smallcollegefbfan]

http://www.sportsnetwork.com/default.asp?c=sportsnetwork&page=cfoot2/news/AGN4037325.htm

[AppGuy04]

I think Trey Elder will be on that list at seasons end

[Pard4Life]

Glad to see Clifton Dawson - Harvard and Jordan Scott - Colgate, make the list... pretty much no brainers..

[GoBears]

I'm sorry, but why isn't Andre Wilson from Northern Colorado not on that list? He averaged more yards per game last year than Clifton Dawson, and he ran for 1,034 yards in nine games last year (actually eight full games since he only played a couple of downs against North Dakota State). He'll also face a lot of nickel defenses this year, as the Bears will be going with a spread offense. With Lex Hilliard out, I'd say look for Wilson to be 1st team All-Big Sky.

[AppGuy04]

I'm sorry, but why isn't Andre Wilson from Northern Colorado not on that list? He averaged more yards per game last year than Clifton Dawson, and he ran for 1,034 yards in nine games last year (actually eight full games since he only played a couple of downs against North Dakota State). He'll also face a lot of nickel defenses this year, as the Bears will be going with a spread offense. With Lex Hilliard out, I'd say look for Wilson to be 1st team All-Big Sky.

going 0-fer in the conference and 4-7 overall doesn't help his chances

[poly51]

Can a Cal Poly player win the Buck Buchanan 3 years in a row. Kyle Shotwell could do it. Behind him we have Ryan Shotwell, a 6'3" 220 lb red shirt freshman defensive end for next year. He may be better than Kyle.

[ncbears]

I'm sorry, but why isn't Andre Wilson from Northern Colorado not on that list? He averaged more yards per game last year than Clifton Dawson, and he ran for 1,034 yards in nine games last year (actually eight full games since he only played a couple of downs against North Dakota State). He'll also face a lot of nickel defenses this year, as the Bears will be going with a spread offense. With Lex Hilliard out, I'd say look for Wilson to be 1st team All-Big Sky.


I hope Andre can produce another great season as well as our offense. I have heard from some players they can't stand the new offensive coordinator though.

[Mr. C]

Can a Cal Poly player win the Buck Buchanan 3 years in a row. Kyle Shotwell could do it. Behind him we have Ryan Shotwell, a 6'3" 220 lb red shirt freshman defensive end for next year. He may be better than Kyle.
On the conference media day circuit this summer, there were some discussions that Shotwell might not even be the best player on the Cal Poly defense, on a unit with four preseason All-Americans. Personally, I think Chris White, the defensive tackle might be a more important cog to the Mustang defense. How about Courtney Brown, maybe the best cornerback in I-AA? Or safety Kenny Chichione? But the word is that Cal Poly is pushing Shotwell.

Another team like that is Appalachian State. Do you push the better known defensive end Marques Murrell for the Buchanan, or do you promote one of the other two All-Americans, Corey Lynch or Jeremy Wiggins. ASU's defensive coordinator says Wiggins is the best player on the Mountaineers' defense.

[Mr. C]

I'm sorry, but why isn't Andre Wilson from Northern Colorado not on that list? He averaged more yards per game last year than Clifton Dawson, and he ran for 1,034 yards in nine games last year (actually eight full games since he only played a couple of downs against North Dakota State). He'll also face a lot of nickel defenses this year, as the Bears will be going with a spread offense. With Lex Hilliard out, I'd say look for Wilson to be 1st team All-Big Sky.
Having seen both a few times, Dawson is much more multi-dimensional than Wilson and he also plays on a much better team. You have to remember that Dawson played through some serious injuries last season. His sophomore season is more in line with what to expect from him this year and more the reason he is on the Payton watch list. Wilson is a quality back, but is probably a notch below the elite backs in I-AA (like Whitlock, Dawson, Richardson, Cuff, Noble and Coleman).

[AppGuy04]

On the conference media day circuit this summer, there were some discussions that Shotwell might not even be the best player on the Cal Poly defense, on a unit with four preseason All-Americans. Personally, I think Chris White, the defensive tackle might be a more important cog to the Mustang defense. How about Courtney Brown, maybe the best cornerback in I-AA? Or safety Kenny Chichione? But the word is that Cal Poly is pushing Shotwell.

Another team like that is Appalachian State. Do you push the better known defensive end Marques Murrell for the Buchanan, or do you promote one of the other two All-Americans, Corey Lynch or Jeremy Wiggins. ASU's defensive coordinator says Wiggins is the best player on the Mountaineers' defense.

Hey C,

Why did the Apps push Murrell last year instead of Hunter, the senior?

[Mr. C]

I think Trey Elder will be on that list at seasons end
Elder should have a good year, but it isn't often that two players from the same team are on the list and when they are, they split votes. David Ball probably cost Ricky Santos the Payton Award last season (Santos only lost a handful of votes to EWU's Erik Meyer in the closest voting ever). I for one thought Ball was the better player and voted him higher than Santos. Ball would be my favorite for the Payton this year. Kevin Richardson should post such big numbers this year that Elder will be considered more of a supporting player (though Trey would probably get the vote of a certain female AGS poster, if she had a ballot). When DaVon Fowlkes and Richie Williams were on the list in 2005, Williams really didn't get a lot of support. Same for Eric Kimble when he was on with Meyer, his EWU teammate.

[Mr. C]

Hey C,

Why did the Apps push Murrell last year instead of Hunter, the senior?
I asked that very question myself. If you watched App State at all last year, you know that Hunter received more attention and double teams than Murrell. No knock on Marques (who is a great kid, by the way), but I think ASU figured that if they pushed Murrell last season, he would have more name recognition this year and would start the year as one of the favorites for the Buchanan.

[JMU2004]

quick question.... can we have a thread WITHOUT ASU homers taking over.....it has gotten REALLY friggin old

[*****]

quick question.... can we have a thread WITHOUT ASU homers taking over.....it has gotten REALLY friggin oldsame old same old with champ team posters taking over threads...

[Mr. C]

quick question.... can we have a thread WITHOUT ASU homers taking over.....it has gotten REALLY friggin old
Give me a break:bang: :bang: :bang:

Marques Murrell is one of the favorites for the Buchanan Award. Kevin Richardson is on the list for the Payton Award. How is this in any way off-topic? If you read the entire thread, you would see that I talked about a player from Harvard in comparison to one from Northern Colorado and that I also had a post about Cal Poly's candidate and potential other candidates. How is that being a homer?

If you don't like what we're discussing, why not post something about Rascati and LeZotte and their chances, instead of complaining about another team being talked about. Be positive instead of negative.
:cool: :) :D :rolleyes: ;) :nod:

[griz&beer]

I am sure sad Lex doesn't get a shot at it.

[JMU2004]

Give me a break:bang: :bang: :bang:

Marques Murrell is one of the favorites for the Buchanan Award. Kevin Richardson is on the list for the Payton Award. How is this in any way off-topic. If you read the entire thread, you would see that I talked about a player from Harvard in comparison to one from Northern Colorado and that I also had a post about Cal Poly's candidate and potential other candidates. How is that being a homer?

If you don't like what we're discussing, why not post something about Rascati and LeZotte and their chances, instead of complaining about another team being talked about. Be positive instead of negative.
:cool: :) :D :rolleyes: ;) :nod:


because it would only take an ASU poster about 2 seconds to 1. tell me that Rascati and Lezotte have never played at the ROCK and will cream themselves in September, and 2. that Murell and Richardson are far and above anything that JMU has ever seen. It get old......and I have held my tounge for quite some time.


The last time I posted on here in the most active I-AA boards thread, an ASU fan quickly replied to my post saying that the ASU fan board was far busier than JMU's. I had to laugh....its like everything is an ego trip for ya'll...... I have seen both, and JMU is indeed more active.

[Mr. C]

because it would only take an ASU poster about 2 seconds to 1. tell me that Rascati and Lezotte have never played at the ROCK and will cream themselves in September, and 2. that Murell and Richardson are far and above anything that JMU has ever seen. It get old......and I have held my tounge for quite some time.


The last time I posted on here in the most active I-AA boards thread, an ASU fan quickly replied to my post saying that the ASU fan board was far busier than JMU's. I had to laugh....its like everything is an ego trip for ya'll...... I have seen both, and JMU is indeed more active.
That's not the response you would have gotten from me. And frankly, this thread has been pretty genial so far.

What I would have told you is LeZotte (who I watched in person play a great game in the national championship contest against Montana in 2004 and whom I've seen a number of times on TV as well) is indeed one of the top defensive players in the country and should be right in the thick of the balloting. He has a very good chance.

Rascati, on the other hand, is a guy who plays pretty mistake-free football, but probably won't post the kind of numbers you look for in a QB to be a serious candidate. He's kind of like this year's version of Joel Sambursky, the Southern Illinois quarterback from the past four years. Not all AGS posters are block heads.

[birdsflyhigh]

Congrats to Illinois State WR Laurent Robinson for making the Payton Watch list and to Illinois State LB Cameron Siskowic for making the Buchanan list. Keep an eye out for ISU's QB Luke Drone because he should be making plenty of noise this year after putting up some mighty impressive numbers in his sophmore season. :thumbsup:

[*****]

... Shotwell might not even be the best player on the Cal Poly defense...Are you still seriously questioning Shotwell?

[Mr. C]

Are you still seriously questioning Shotwell?
Not questioning whether he is a great player. Just not sure he is the best player on Cal Poly's defense. I here that White is a stud at DT and so is Courtney Brown.

[*****]

Not questioning whether he is a great player. Just not sure he is the best player on Cal Poly's defense. I here that White is a stud at DT and so is Courtney Brown.and last year we heard that Shotwell chased the QBs into the hands of Gocong... CAL POLY = DEFENSE U.

[seantaylor]

Appy finishes 3rd or 4th in the Socon. :smiley_wi Not that good. They caught GSU in a Sewak mode, and Furman in an Ingle Martin mode. Mohring is the next John Lynch.

[mikebigg]

Congrats to all the young men nominated...

[AppGuy04]

Appy finishes 3rd or 4th in the Socon. Not that good. They caught GSU in a Sewak mode, and Furman in an Ingle Martin mode. Mohring is the next John Lynch.

This isn't a predictions thread

And no Appy is hijacking any thread, I asked C a simple question and he answered.

[Saint3333]

because it would only take an ASU poster about 2 seconds to 1. tell me that Rascati and Lezotte have never played at the ROCK and will cream themselves in September, and 2. that Murell and Richardson are far and above anything that JMU has ever seen. It get old......and I have held my tounge for quite some time.


The last time I posted on here in the most active I-AA boards thread, an ASU fan quickly replied to my post saying that the ASU fan board was far busier than JMU's. I had to laugh....its like everything is an ego trip for ya'll...... I have seen both, and JMU is indeed more active.

Has anyone here said anything bad about the JMU players nominated or compared the JMU players to the ASU players? :confused:

I've never seen them play, but their stats are impressive and the media must think they're pretty good to be on those lists. Sounds like someone is a little over sensitive.

As for the boards does it really matter, I've been to both and would have to disagree with you, but again it doesn't matter as long as ASU wins Sept. 9th. See you there.

[Appstate03]

because it would only take an ASU poster about 2 seconds to 1. tell me that Rascati and Lezotte have never played at the ROCK and will cream themselves in September, and 2. that Murell and Richardson are far and above anything that JMU has ever seen. It get old......and I have held my tounge for quite some time.


The last time I posted on here in the most active I-AA boards thread, an ASU fan quickly replied to my post saying that the ASU fan board was far busier than JMU's. I had to laugh....its like everything is an ego trip for ya'll...... I have seen both, and JMU is indeed more active.


:bawling:

[DetroitFlyer]

Wow, I am sure suprised that not a single player from the NEC, PFL or MAAC is mentioned, yet again.... What is next, a "non or limited scholarship" Payton and Buchanan list? Let the discrimination continue....

[AppGuy04]

I'm sure there wasn't an influx of JMU fans after they won the NC, give me a break

[PaladinFan]

quick question.... can we have a thread WITHOUT ASU homers taking over.....it has gotten REALLY friggin old

I was going to say something after the first response of the thread.

"yeah, uh, is there anyway that Kevin Richardson can be in his own category, like, 'most likely to win.' Because, lets be honest, he's going to dominate the SoCon this year."


....Trey Elder won't be on that list. He's good, but no where near the calibre of Santos and Rascati.

[UAalum72]

Wow, I am sure suprised that not a single player from the NEC, PFL or MAAC is mentioned, yet again.... What is next, a "non or limited scholarship" Payton and Buchanan list? Let the discrimination continue....

Now, now, Albany's Gary Jones was on the preseason Payton list in 2003.

[psc2445]

I am an ASU fan, and think that Richardson will have a big year, will that translate into the Walter Payton?(to me: not likely). And I also agree that Elder should not be on the list and i doubt he will emerge later. He is a first year full time starter so lets dont get carried away.

I am relatively new to this board posting but have read for a while. I have drawn this conclusion. Everybody is a homer, and they should be. this is what preseason polls, rankings, lists, etc. are about. Quality discussions. Atleast that is what I hope for. Some of you are too defensive.
Anyway, just my thoughts as an ASU homer who also tries to be a realist.

[GannonFan]

Now, now, Albany's Gary Jones was on the preseason Payton list in 2003.

Wasn't Bullock from Dusquene on the Buchanan list last year? And the Monmouth coach on the Eddie Robinson list the year before? Again, the same maxim applies to this as it does to the playoffs - play a competitive OOC schedule, win versus it, and people will notice. It's no secret. Play a weak schedule, boost stats versus the weak competition and little or nothing versus the only tough teams you play, and representation on lists like this will be few and far between. Imagine if all the effort and energy that goes into the whining here could be spent on finding a better schedule - like I said before, some schools are doing it (Albany has a better schedule this year for instance) - if a guy from Albany does well in those games as well as the rest of the season he will be noticed - nothing difficult to understand there.

[smallcollegefbfan]

I was going to say something after the first response of the thread.

"yeah, uh, is there anyway that Kevin Richardson can be in his own category, like, 'most likely to win.' Because, lets be honest, he's going to dominate the SoCon this year."


....Trey Elder won't be on that list. He's good, but no where near the calibre of Santos and Rascati.

I agree on Elder. I actually believe Felton is one of the best players in the nation but I doubt he ends up on the postseason list. I just don't see a FB putting up the numbers to stay on but I do believe he is one of the best in the nation. He will be like David Pittman. He will be an All-American who goes first day in the NFL Draft but he does not have the numbers to win the award.

I don't know why people get on App State for mentioning their guys in threads. I mean they won the national title, return 6 All-Americans, and anyone who believes they are not the best on paper in the SoCon and possibly the nation right now is just plain ignorant. They are the best until proven otherwise. So until they are knocked out of playoff consideration or knocked out of the playoffs once they get there you really can not smack on them.

And why is it that mid-major fans always complain their guys are not on the lists? I mean are you serious? The only mid-major guys worth looking at are Phaydavong, Johnson, Disch, etc. Those guys are all juniors. They are not playing top competition and they are underclassmen. The same things happens in I-A with MAC, Sun Belt, etc. players versus ACC and SEC players. Just be patient. It is just the preseason. Everything will play itself out. It is way too early to be complaining about preseason coverage. ASU should complain that they were not a preseason top 5 pick last year but at the time people would have said you are stupid to say that. Anything can happen so nobody should dismiss any player or team at this point. Players like Elder do not deserve to be on preseason lists now but could easily be there when the season is over. I agree Elder is not deserving now and even though I don't think he will be on the postseason list it does not mean he can't be. Heck Andrew Jones could win the Buchanan Award... You know you like the sound of that but I am sure noone in the country thinks he will. We just never know.

Ralph, why do these people get so anal about preseason stuff? It means NOTHING! If it meant anything James Madison and ASU would not have won the national titles the last two years.