FCS teams that utilize a 3-4 defense

[football expert]

Hello AGS, been lurking for a while, first post.. I have a kid that I'm helping in the recruiting process. He is a 2013
OLB/DE thats has been rated by some recruitniks as a potential mid-major FBS or FCS recruit. With your help, I would like to compile a list of FCS 3-4 teams. Any help is appreciated..!

Thanx!

[blueballs]

Appalachian State is probably the highest profile FCS team running a 3-4, but with the coaching changes a switch might be in order.

Generally it is hard for FCS teams to be effective in a 3-4 because the better run stuffing DL get snapped up by FBS.

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

Appalachian State is probably the highest profile FCS team running a 3-4, but with the coaching changes a switch might be in order.

Generally it is hard for FCS teams to be effective in a 3-4 because the better run stuffing DL get snapped up by FBS.

I would be willing to bet a good bit of money Satterfield will not keep the 3-4 at App. I don't think there are any dominant 3-4 defenses below the very highest rungs of college football.

If I were the OP I would encourage my son to consider schools that do not run the 3-4. IMO you may not have all that great a defensive coach if you have someone running a 3-4 at a mid-major school.

[SpeedkingATL]

Appalachian State is probably the highest profile FCS team running a 3-4, but with the coaching changes a switch might be in order.

Generally it is hard for FCS teams to be effective in a 3-4 because the better run stuffing DL get snapped up by FBS.
I agree and with 3 option teams in the SoCon, it is more likely that our base defense will return to a 4-3 as it has been more effective in the last 2 years than the 3-4 (neither have been very good) against the option.

[heath]

Dear expert,if your kid doesn't already have offers,then look at DIII.(unless you actually mean he is a HS junior) If he grows like most he will probably end up as a DE. The most important aspect of being recruited is to make sure the kid feels comfy with the players and coaches.A really good player that is unhappy will never reach his potential. -Good Luck as the recruiting process is stressful, but also a learning experience.

[slostang]

University of North Dakota runs the 3-4 defense.

[FCS_pwns_FBS]

University of North Dakota runs the 3-4 defense.

Doesn't surprise me seeing how many points they gave up this year.

[BisonFan02]

A good chunk of the MVC runs a 3-4. NDSU struggles against it.

[RichH2]

Lehigh also uses 3-4 D. In NE passing more common than option.

[MarkyMark]

A good chunk of the MVC runs a 3-4. NDSU struggles against it.

Do you think thats still true? Is it the scheme or just plain good defenses?

[football expert]

Thanks for the responses so far. Prospect is not my son, he's a kid I help coach in rec ball and hs coach is kinda sleep -walking regarding recruitment. He is a classic tweener, really good pass rusher, not stout enough to play DE. On the flip side, he is excellent in pass drop/coverage when playing LB off the line, however sometimes struggles get off OL blocks vs run.. May be better fit as Hybrid in 3-4.... played HS in Metro Atl..

[breezy]

Holy Cross has used a 3-4 under Coach Gilmore.

[asumike83]

Appalachian has run a 3-4 the past several years. As was mentioned earlier, that could certainly change with a new defensive coordinator. Of course, it can never hurt to get his name out there and a good pass rusher is always an asset. Here is a link to the ASU Recruiting Questionnaire if you'd like to submit his info:

http://www.goasu.com/quest/Questionaire.dbml?QID=3629&DB_OEM_ID=21500

[rmutv]

Robert Morris runs the 3-4 in the NEC, and they've run it effectively some years.

[ursus arctos horribilis]

Hey guys, this is sort of an interesting thing that I'd like to have a separate forum for possibly. I noticed we have had a couple of thiese over the last few days so I'm wondering if this is something that might be a useful forum of it's own (not on this forum) or what y'all think? Would there be a problem with getting any of these kids in trouble or even maybe a guy posting something like this?


I could use your feedback if you have some experience or ideas on this.

[lionsrking2]

Southeastern Louisiana, in the Southland Conference, runs a combination of 3-3-5 and 3-4 under first year head coach, Ron Roberts ... we had a senior this year (Devan Walker) switch from a traditional 4-3 DE to OLB in new scheme and really flourished ... has a good chance to land in an NFL camp, with a chance to stick.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-87hWo3x9VU

[401ks]

xcoffeex

This may not be the answer for which you are looking, however...

I have always believed (particularly when it comes to "tweeners" who aren't being recruited by BCS-level programs) that a student-athlete should look for:

1.) the academic institutions that he/she would want to attend even if he/she could no longer participate in athletics. i.e. Does the college offer a Major in the student-athlete's preferred area(s) of study.

2.) the institutions (from #1 above) that offer the student-athlete's sport at the level that the student-athlete may reasonably expected to compete. i.e. The tweener student-athlete may want to play football and study Film Production, but the likelihood of playing football for USC or UCLA may be remote. What other schools offer good Film Production majors that also offer non-BCS level football?

3.) a college that is geographically preferable. Everyone's idea of geographic preference is different. Some want to stay close to home. Others want to go far away in order to experience something different. With my Southern California born-and-bred sons, I told them before they even entered High School that I hoped they attended a college where there were NO PALM TREES. After living in numerous places around this great country of ours, I knew that my sons needed to get out of "The Bubble" that is Southern California.

This little bit of homework (that is substantially quicker and easier in the internet age) will produce a focus list for the student-athlete and his family. It will also be far better when contacting the coaches at the schools on the focus list to be able to tell them (honestly) that the student-athlete is REALLY interested in that particular school because of "this" list of reasons.

Finally, I would say that I wouldn't worry about current defensive schemes too much. Schemes change. And coaches are always looking for the best athletes. A good thing about High School athletes is... POTENTIAL. College coaches recruit potential. I wouldn't reject a college football program because you think that their current defensive scheme does not favor the student-athlete. Contact them. Sell yourself (the student-athlete). The worst they can say is, "No". DON'T SAY "NO" FOR THEM. You may overlook a perfect situation.

Good luck!

xthumbsupx

[Kemo]

I would say one of the better 3-4 defenses out there is Southern Illinois. They had a few ups and downs since it's been implemented by Dale Lennon, but overall it's been pretty stout. After the debacle against EIU this year, they seemed to find their groove and really gave a lot of teams fits (shut out a very potent Illinois State offense).

[bjtheflamesfan]

Liberty ran a 3-4 when Danny Rocco was at Liberty. I dont know if he transitioned that over to Richmond this past season though...any Spider fans care to shed some light on that?

[THE HERD]

I would say one of the better 3-4 defenses out there is Southern Illinois. They had a few ups and downs since it's been implemented by Dale Lennon, but overall it's been pretty stout. After the debacle against EIU this year, they seemed to find their groove and really gave a lot of teams fits (shut out a very potent Illinois State offense).

The Egyptian dogs do run it well. Doesn't Breske from Montana prefer the 3-4?

[Snowgoose]

I would say one of the better 3-4 defenses out there is Southern Illinois. They had a few ups and downs since it's been implemented by Dale Lennon, but overall it's been pretty stout. After the debacle against EIU this year, they seemed to find their groove and really gave a lot of teams fits (shut out a very potent Illinois State offense).

Interesting tidbit on Lennons 3-4 as he started running it in the late 80's or early 90's to stop the NDSU veer option offense and he was very successful with it. This is the most effective defense against the option as long as you have a great nose guard. If you don't you get eaten alive.

[deez_na]

University of North Dakota runs the 3-4 defense.

Explains why they were garbage this year defensively.

[ngineer]

Lehigh also uses 3-4 D. In NE passing more common than option.



Yes, Lehigh went to the 3-4 in 2006 when Coen took over and his DC was Dave Kotulski. Though he left, the new DCs of Roberts and Wilcher have stayed with the format. With the emphasis on LBs and need for big NG, it appears we're staying in that mode. Only other PL school that regularly uses a 3-4, I think, is Bucknell.

[Go Green]

Cornell runs the 3-4. But they were dead last in the Ivy in most defensive categories this past season.

Whether or not their (yet to be named) new coach next year keeps the 3-4 is anyone's guess, though.

[darell1976]

Explains why they were garbage this year defensively.

Just part of the reason our D was garbage, the other parts are bad coaching and players who would rather two hand touch than tackle.

[Brad82]

3-4 defense is not aggressive enough.
O-lines are too big now.
Offenses too quick strike.
Anyone who runs it is an "outlier".
My opinion.

[Brad82]

Football expert-post his info.,I will forward it.
Perfectly legal.

[Brad82]

Ursus-yes. Let's help the kids and the schools out!
Many are under-funded in recruiting budgets.

[Houndawg]

3-4 defense is not aggressive enough.
O-lines are too big now.
Offenses too quick strike.
Anyone who runs it is an "outlier".
My opinion.

xeyebrowx

Not agressive enough? It's tailor-made for blitzing from all over the field.

[penguinpower]

Appalachian State is probably the highest profile FCS team running a 3-4, but with the coaching changes a switch might be in order.

Generally it is hard for FCS teams to be effective in a 3-4 because the better run stuffing DL get snapped up by FBS.

When App was on the run their DE's defined their defense IMOP. I have never seen better DE play in the 25+ years of watching I-AA FB.

[lionsrking2]

3-4 defense is not aggressive enough.
O-lines are too big now.
Offenses too quick strike.
Anyone who runs it is an "outlier".
My opinion.

Couldn't be further from the truth unless your DC doesn't know what he's doing or you don't have the personnel to run it.

[Brad82]

Yes,you have to blitz a lot to make it effective.
How many play-off teams run the 3-4?
That will tell me a lot.

[TTUEagles]

TTU runs it...always recruits the ATL area

[swaghook]

A good chunk of the MVC runs a 3-4. NDSU struggles against it.

And NDSU runs the Tampa 2 and the rest of the MVC struggles against that. I think it is the level of defensive play in the conference more then the scheme.

[clenz]

UNI ran the 3-4 when we had Ben Boothby for his JR and SR years, but that wasn't a full time 3-4


For the most part UNI runs a 4-3 tampa 2 zone scheme.

[lionsrking2]

Yes,you have to blitz a lot to make it effective.
How many play-off teams run the 3-4?
That will tell me a lot.

That's not true either ... 3-4 or 3-3-5 personnel certainly makes it easier to mix blitz packages and coverages, but you don't have to be a heavy blitz team to be productive ... often times what may appear to be a blitz is really 4 man pressure coming from different places ... like any base defensive scheme, be it a 3-4, 4-3, 4-2-5, etc., you need the right players to run it and in and odd front defense, it helps to have three big guys who can play 2 gap and occupy blockers, especially the nose. The best program in college football, and probably the most influential defensive mind in the game, runs a 3-4.

[Brad82]

LionsR-,"knowing without doing,is like not knowing".-Dr. Stephen Covey. I played in the 3-4 on two of the best teams in the country, also have the individual honors to know the effectiveness of it. SE Louisiana and Tenn. Tech know how to run it? How many teams in 2012 FCS play-offs run it? You guys can't name one team.
The single wing and Wing T can be run effectively also,but again how many play-off teams use them? Great schemes are copied,not evaded.

[spdram]

Richmond played some 3-4 on a limited basis this past year. I think it was more necessity than desire.

[Houndawg]

LionsR-,"knowing without doing,is like not knowing".-Dr. Stephen Covey. I played in the 3-4 on two of the best teams in the country, also have the individual honors to know the effectiveness of it. SE Louisiana and Tenn. Tech know how to run it? How many teams in 2012 FCS play-offs run it? You guys can't name one team.
The single wing and Wing T can be run effectively also,but again how many play-off teams use them? Great schemes are copied,not evaded.


SIU has a playoff caliber 3-4 that scored 10 TDs this year.

[Brad82]

Houndawg-agreed on SE Lou.. I respect anybody that puts on the pads.
How many 2012 play-off teams copied their 3-4?
That speaks volumes about the current effectiveness of the 3-4 defense.

[deez_na]

Just part of the reason our D was garbage, the other parts are bad coaching and players who would rather two hand touch than tackle.

Yes part of the reason, Mussman needs to go imo. He's not a very good coach, he doesn't seem to understand the concept of the game it seems like. It's brutal.

[darell1976]

Yes part of the reason, Mussman needs to go imo. He's not a very good coach, he doesn't seem to understand the concept of the game it seems like. It's brutal.

His days are numbered. If it wasn't for the contract extension he would definitely be on the hot seat as of now. If UND bottoms the BSC again in 2013 (especially after having 7 home games) then a replacement will be in the works.

[lionsrking2]

LionsR-,"knowing without doing,is like not knowing".-Dr. Stephen Covey. I played in the 3-4 on two of the best teams in the country, also have the individual honors to know the effectiveness of it. SE Louisiana and Tenn. Tech know how to run it? How many teams in 2012 FCS play-offs run it? You guys can't name one team.
The single wing and Wing T can be run effectively also,but again how many play-off teams use them? Great schemes are copied,not evaded.

If you really did play or coach in a 3-4 scheme then you know it can be an effective scheme against a variety of offensive attacks. Again, it's about players and imagination if you have both, it doesn't matter what defense you run. I have no idea how many FCS playoff teams are currently using an odd front defense nor do I care.... Still doesn't change the fact it's a a good scheme if you know what you're doing and have the personnel.

[deez_na]

His days are numbered. If it wasn't for the contract extension he would definitely be on the hot seat as of now. If UND bottoms the BSC again in 2013 (especially after having 7 home games) then a replacement will be in the works.

Yeah your best bet is hoping they do finish low and bring in a solid coach.

[darell1976]

Yeah your best bet is hoping they do finish low and bring in a solid coach.

Dale Lennon? Isn't SIU about to boot him yet?

[centexguy]

Lamar University switched to the 3-4 defense with the hiring of Bill Bradley as their defensive coordinator.

[Mr. C]

When App was on the run their DE's defined their defense IMOP. I have never seen better DE play in the 25+ years of watching I-AA FB.

ASU had quite a string of All-American defensive ends from the time Sparky Woods arrived through most of the Jerry Moore era. In 2005, it was two NFL-bound players with Marquis Murrell and Jason Hunter. Gary Tharrington replaced Hunter in 2006-07 and Tony Robertson came in for Murrell in 2007.

The concept that then-defensive coordinator John Wiley used for the most part was that limited run responsibilities for the DEs, allowing them to concentrate almost solely on pass rush and containing the outside against QB scrambles. If you had DEs that could get consistent pressure on the QBs, then you didn't have to blitz very much and could let the LBs worry about stopping the run and dropping into coverage. The defense also used the strong safety as a big element of run stoppage. And it also helped that they had CBs that could handle a lot of man coverage.

One of the more innovative schemes in recent years at the FCS level has been the 3-3-5 employed by Villanova, which allows for a lot of confusing looks and the opportunity to blitz a lot if the DC so desires. The 2007 game between Villanova and Delaware was interesting in that the Wildcats kept changing looks on almost every down on Joe Flacco and the the Blue Hen offense and it really confused him. DC Mark Reardon did an awesome job developing that scheme and helping Villanova to a national championship in 2009, along with the QF run in 2008 and the SF run in 2010.