Big South football AQ on the brink?

[aceinthehole]

With the upcoming announcement that Stony Brook is joining CAA Football for the 2013 season, the Big South will be down to the NCAA-minimum 6 teams to be eligible for the AQ.

2013 Big South
Charleston Southern
Coastal Carolina
Gardner-Webb
Liberty
Presbyterian
Virginia Military Institute

Additionally, Liberty has made clear its FBS aspirations and other Big South schools could be targets of the SoCon, if they lose any members to the CAA.

Any ideas on what the Big South might do to shore up its membership?

[clenz]

I'll be the first to say it....


They don't really "deserve" one.

The playoffs are too big.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

If Campbell leaves the Pioneer and goes scholarship, all their other sports are in the Big South. Problem solved.

Radford and Winthrop, I think, have talked about starting/re-starting football teams at one time or another. But Campbell is the one that could really make a huge difference.

[IaaScribe]

Campbell won't be going the scholarship route. Winthrop and Radford are still far too dominated female wise in the general student population to even think about it.

[Seawolf97]

Would Norfolk St or Delaware St have any interest in the Big South ? They are alot closer to the center of the conference than we are.

[superman7515]

Delaware State wouldn't be interested. The main two reasons they want out of the MEAC is to get away from the south and back into a northeast focus (instead of FAMU, Bethune-Cookman, Savannah St, and the 3 Carolina schools) and to reduce costs, both in travel and in scholarships, which the Big South wouldn't reduce. Norfolk State might be. They're not as tied to the MEAC as most schools, having joined the MEAC during expansion in the late 90's, so not nearly the historical rivalries with the core MEAC teams. If they locked up an annual out of conference game with Hampton in football and basketball, they'd be a lot more receptive.

[alvinkayak6]

I could be wrong, but I think the 6 teams in conference are relatively safe for at least another year. Liberty needed a Sun Belt invitation IMO, and I think that boat has sailed.

[MplsBison]

What about Atlantic Sun teams starting new programs?

North Florida, Kennesaw, ETSU?

There's also North Alabama, they need a home.

[alvinkayak6]

What about Atlantic Sun teams starting new programs?

North Florida, Kennesaw, ETSU?

There's also North Alabama, they need a home.

Good point, but a lot of these are probably more like targets for 2013-2015. Wouldn't you agree?

[MplsBison]

Certainly. But even without Stony Brook, they still have 6 - which is what's needed for the AQ. If Liberty leaves too, then they might need a waiver to hang on until North Alabama can be brought in ASAP.

[kdinva]

Mercer starts in 2013........have no idea where they want to be in 2016, etc......but I think their pockets are deeper than Campbell's..........Jacksonville U. has become decently competitive, has a nice new playing surface in their facility, just need to add 7,000+ actual grandstand seats (and get rid of the 100% hillside seating/lounging).

[BlueHenSinfonian]

Florida Gulf Coast University did a football feasibility study this year, and the Big South was the most likely conference from the potential options listed (Big South, MEAC, and SoCon). Of course, the report also recommended that they build a whole new athletics campus because there is currently no room for a stadium and the associated other buildings/parking/etc needed, so it would be at least several years before a team could be fielded.

[Dane96]

I heard...not shocking...that FGCU wants FBS only.

Sigh...another FBS school in Florida.

[BlueHenSinfonian]

I heard...not shocking...that FGCU wants FBS only.

Sigh...another FBS school in Florida.

The feasibility study only focused on FCS. With the location I guess FBS might be possible, USF is 2.5 hours north, and The U is 2.5 hours southeast, so there isn't another FBS team in the immediate area, but you're right, FL is pretty saturated. They could draw well from Fort Myers and Naples for attendance, but the school itself is in the tory little town of Estero, which might not like the idea of a FBS sized stadium. Plus, the enrollment is only about 12,000, which seems perfectly FCS sized.

[Dane96]

True...on all accounts.

BTW...my "hearing" was from locals...not the actual report, which I have not seen. Some locals are looking for the FBS move. Not surprisingly, they are the people who own businesses such as bars and restaurants.

[superman7515]

Yes, and after the study was complete it found that starting a football program was a terrible idea and the President came out and said they were scrapping any idea of football but would proceed with other recommendations the study made for other sports. FGCU football won't happen any time in the next decade.

[BlueHenSinfonian]

Yes, and after the study was complete it found that starting a football program was a terrible idea and the President came out and said they were scrapping any idea of football but would proceed with other recommendations the study made for other sports. FGCU football won't happen any time in the next decade.

I wouldn't put it quite so harshly. The President of the University basically just said that it didn't make financial sense right now, but that it could as the University grew. There's clearly a demand for it, it might just take a bit of time to get around to it.




“Is now the time for football?” Bradshaw asked. “I have said in the past and I will say going forward: I believe that Florida Gulf Coast will have football. I don’t believe now is the time.”[



“I believe when we get to 18 or 20,000 students we can reexamine it,” Bradshaw said. “The good thing is we have a feasibility study already.”

[Lehigh Football Nation]

Between Campbell, Stetson, Mercer, Jacksonville... I get the impression the Big South will be just fine. Personally, I wouldn't brush the idea of Campbell going full-scholarship off so easily. They will have enormous pressure to do so from their fellow presidents.

[BlueHenSinfonian]

Between Campbell, Stetson, Mercer, Jacksonville... I get the impression the Big South will be just fine. Personally, I wouldn't brush the idea of Campbell going full-scholarship off so easily. They will have enormous pressure to do so from their fellow presidents.

If the Big South were to institute a rule saying that all conference members must play a sport in the conference if the conference offers it, what would Campbell do? Would they drop football, play in the Big South without scholarships, or just bite the bullet and start offering aid?

[kdinva]

.....Personally, I wouldn't brush the idea of Campbell going full-scholarship off so easily. They will have enormous pressure to do so from their fellow presidents.

and with 6,900 full time students, it can be done. Heck, there are 3 or 4 1-A programs with fewer students. And how many 1-AA full scholly programs are there, with those schools having fewer than 4,000 students? Richmond is a Baptist-affiliated school, like Campbell, but with about 3200 students, and they are doing just fine.

[clenz]

Of those small schools with football in FBS how many of them have killer basketball programs?

[Dane96]

Wake Forest and Tulsa.

That's about the list.

[Professor]

Delaware State wouldn't be interested. The main two reasons they want out of the MEAC is to get away from the south and back into a northeast focus (instead of FAMU, Bethune-Cookman, Savannah St, and the 3 Carolina schools) and to reduce costs, both in travel and in scholarships, which the Big South wouldn't reduce. Norfolk State might be. They're not as tied to the MEAC as most schools, having joined the MEAC during expansion in the late 90's, so not nearly the historical rivalries with the core MEAC teams. If they locked up an annual out of conference game with Hampton in football and basketball, they'd be a lot more receptive.

Lol, NSU isn't going anywhere. Now Hampton was looking to go to the CAA but were rejected. No way Hampton leaves for Big South. Its not an upgrade from the MEAC.

What you say about DSU is true, they are looking for a conf in their geographic area, but i doubt they move either

[MplsBison]

Of those small schools with football in FBS how many of them have killer basketball programs?

Private schools with I-A football and total enrollment solidly under 10k:

Wake Forest
Tulsa
Rice

(per Wikipedia)

Texas Christian is right under 10k but I have to imagine they'll easily grow past that with the football team going big time.

[superman7515]

Lol, NSU isn't going anywhere. Now Hampton was looking to go to the CAA but were rejected. No way Hampton leaves for Big South. Its not an upgrade from the MEAC.

What you say about DSU is true, they are looking for a conf in their geographic area, but i doubt they move either

The Big South isn't an upgrade from the MEAC unless you look at basketball payouts: $1,677,648.00 vs $1,437,984.00; FCS playoffs: last win 2011 vs last win 1999; men's basketball RPI; women's basketball RPI; conference Sagarin ratings in FCS football; and 54-33 record vs the MEAC. But once you throw out all the objective measures... Sure, you could say that.

[MplsBison]

The Big South isn't an upgrade from the MEAC unless you look at basketball payouts: $1,677,648.00 vs $1,437,984.00; FCS playoffs: last win 2011 vs last win 1999; men's basketball RPI; women's basketball RPI; and conference Sagarin ratings in FCS football. But once you throw out all the objective measures... Sure, you could say that.

Not to disagree from your excellent post...but Stony Brook the real reason for the football stuff? They were never going to be in the Big South for the long term.

That's why I love the conference membership timelines in Wikipedia. Lets you really get a good look at the history of the conference.

Chuck South, Coastal and Liberty. That's the real Big South, at least in football.

[superman7515]

Not to disagree from your excellent post...but Stony Brook the real reason for the football stuff? They were never going to be in the Big South for the long term.

That's why I love the conference membership timelines in Wikipedia. Lets you really get a good look at the history of the conference.

Chuck South, Coastal and Liberty. That's the real Big South, at least in football.

Stony Brook has never faced a MEAC team, the 54-33 vs the MEAC is just the southern schools.

[MplsBison]

Stony Brook has never faced a MEAC team, the 54-33 vs the MEAC is just the southern schools.

That's a fair point, but not the points I was replying to in your post (last playoff win and Sagarin conf rating).

Without Stony Brook, I bet it looks a lot more comparable?