La Salle

[BaylorTitan]

Sorry I'm a 1-AA noob, but why is La Salle's schedule so short? Infractions?

[UAalum72]

http://www.goexplorers.com/sports/football/schedules/

They have 10 games, only 1 short of the I-AA max. Probably no travel budget, or couldn't find another D-III to play.

[LeopardFan04]

Has anyone been there for a game? It's actually the I-AA school closest to my house...I've thought about checking it out on a Lafayette open date or when they have a road trip I'm not going to make...what's it like there?

[*****]

They have 10 games, only 1 short of the I-AA max...That's what I thought too when I read the I-A avatar member's post about "so short."

[carney2]

'Snot a big deal - at least not at LaSalle. Football and street hockey have about the same priority.

[BaylorTitan]

Oh ok. In Athlon's Preview they only had thier conference schedule on there and I thought it might have been due to infractions. I guess Athlon was too lazy to go back and try to fill it in correctly.

[GannonFan]

Has anyone been there for a game? It's actually the I-AA school closest to my house...I've thought about checking it out on a Lafayette open date or when they have a road trip I'm not going to make...what's it like there?

I've driven by it - I don't work far from there and the wife's father still lives in Olney - don't waste your time - going to a game at Widener is more exciting. La Salle is a classic example of a DIII team (if that) masquerading as a IAA team because they also play DI basketball. They do a disservice to the other non-schollies IAA (the Daytons, the San Diego's) who actually put credible sides out there.

[Marcus Garvey]

What's the over/under on LaSalle dropping the football program?

I'm guessing January 2008.

[GannonFan]

What's the over/under on LaSalle dropping the football program?

I'm guessing January 2008.

What's the over/under on it even being covered by something more than a "in other news" headline in either Philly paper? No chance. Hey, I like LaSalle, but their football program is simply non-existent. Just let it die and move on.

[Mr. C]

you hate to see anyone lose football, even if the program is bad.

[Go...gate]

Actually they did have 11, but The College of New Jersey (Trenton, NJ) had a conference scheduling conflict and had to pull out.

A colleague and LaSalle alum tells me that football has impeoved their visibility, fund-raising and admissions, even on this marginal level.

[Golden Eagle]

Wasn't LaSalle the school that some nutty preseason ranking had in the top 25 last year?

[blukeys]

Has anyone been there for a game? It's actually the I-AA school closest to my house...I've thought about checking it out on a Lafayette open date or when they have a road trip I'm not going to make...what's it like there?


You will do better coming to Wesley College which is the closest to my home. You can stay with me and see a quality d-3 team unlike LaSalle.

[DFW HOYA]

No need to dump on LaSalle--they're still a young team program-wise and are using football to build male enrollment and develop fan interest--not an easy thing to do in the MAAC!

It's politically incorrect to say amongst the playoff elite, but we need more LaSalles to start making a commitment to football so that I-AA can grow and prosper.

[LeopardFan04]

It's funny...semi-intrigued, I checked out their football webpage...the featured pictured player (Josh Brumfield) is the younger brother of a teammate I blocked for during a shortlived h.s. career...small world...

[*****]

... They do a disservice to the other non-schollies IAA (the Daytons, the San Diego's) who actually put credible sides out there.Please quit picking on the I-AA non-schollie teams. They keep football at the school and that's a beginning.

[faxjusfax]

If the MAAC dies because of the "Duquesne Bailout", La Salle will have some decisions to make. The Pioneer League seems to be a real possibility for them, and I think the program will survive. Positive signs include the current installation of new field turf and lights for their McCarthy Stadium.

Because of their high powered offense, some exciting (if not winning) football has been played there the past couple of years, featuring some top-notch IAA talent (QBs Abrams and Jump, RBs Tiboletti, Sullivan, Brumfield, WR Zabel).

This year brings in a new coaching staff and new philosophy. No more "when in doubt, air it out" approach, but a well rounded strategy.

So, if you really want to check out a game, why not come to one of the night games and check out the La Salle new look .... then make up your own opinion.

[GannonFan]

Please quit picking on the I-AA non-schollie teams. They keep football at the school and that's a beginning.

I believe I was picking on LaSalle and giving props to other non-schollies, spefically Dayton and San Diego so technically I was only picking on one team. :nod: And I reserve my right to pick on LaSalle as well, I'm allowed to, and I happen to be pretty close to that particular school. Frankly, I don't see any real attempt by LaSalle to make anything of their football program and I'll pick on that everyday. I'm not saying that they need to be challenging for the IAA title, but what I see from almost across the street is a football program that gets no support, has little recruiting, and is little more than a high school-level program. If they had any serious aspirations of a solid football program they would've done something by now. And this is from a guy that actually likes the school. I'm not a believer of football at any cost - if they aren't going to support it, don't bother in my opinion. There's more than enough football being played out there by schools who do care - I don't think college football, or IAA football, is such an endangered species that every single program, even the flimsy ones, need my support. So there. :p

[bluehenbillk]

I agree with GF, living in the Philly market LaSalle is an embarassment to 1-AA.

[faxjusfax]

So, are you Delaware guys saying any IAA program that has, oh say, 4-5 straight losing seasons should be jetisoned from your ranks?

Or do you evaluate programs just by the amount of money being spent? If that's the case, should programs like say Georegetown be banished?

Try not to let your view from the penthouse affect your opinions of the struggling masses. Let them do the best they can, with what they have. Live & let live.

[bluehenbillk]

Nope, I look at a team that would get beat by two neighboring D-3 schools, Delaware Valley & Rowan. And a team that plays in what amounts to a high-school stadium that draws high-school sized crowds and that's what I see. Pretty clear?

[faxjusfax]

o Rowan, probably, DelVal, I wouldn't be too sure.

o So what. Some IAA would beat lower eschelon IA teams too.

o 2k-3k crowds are OK for now.

o Let the La Salle-like teams play in their own playground for now, and let's see what happens in the future.

[GannonFan]

For a guy who's username claims to be all about the facts, you have an interesting way of rebutting arguments from people who don't agree with you - attack their credibility. Just because I'm a Delaware fan doesn't disqualify me from commenting on the state of LaSalle's football program. As one of the few people on this board who even know anything about LaSalle, I like to think I carry a bit more credibility than you try to lower me to.

I never said that LaSalle needs to emulate Delaware's success or status - heck, I even went out of my way to say the opposite in my first post. What I was commenting on is the general state of the LaSalle program - BHBK was right, they would get their shirts handed to them by the likes of Rowan and Delaware Valley (you must have missed Delaware Valley's resurgence over the past few years - 2 straight 12-1 seasons and they were tied with Rowan late in the 3rd in last year's DIII quarters before falling by 6) - heck, LaSalle has troubles every year with tiny Ursinus (actually lost to Ursinus this year), who I can guarantee you is a lightweight on the DIII circuit. With all the DIII's in the southeastern PA area, LaSalle would be lucky to beat most any of them, and outside of Rowan, Widener, and Del Valley the rest of them aren't even big time DIII schools (Gettysburg, Muhlenburgh, and the like). And attendance wise, they do pull in their fair share of crowds of barely over 1,000, and I know they comp a fair amount as well so even those numbers are a little iffy.

I like LaSalle, but I can't buy into this thing that they're using football to really sell people on coming to LaSalle. Do you honestly think applications are up at LaSalle because they play the quality of football they do? They have a tough location in the city, they aren't known as a great academic university, and they are well down the totem pole of schools when you rank the Philly schools - heck, even Textile (I know, they renamed it) is probably a better option. I'm sure having a football team means that most of the guys on the team pick LaSalle and very likely the vast majority, if not all, wouldn't be there if they didn't have a football team, but that's not really a surge in applications. LaSalle's program is about as bare bones as you can get - like I said, if that's what they want, more power to them. But as for me, I'll reserve my right to comment on what I see as an anemic and weak attempt at a football program with no discenible effort in sight to do anything more with it.

[89Hen]

So, are you Delaware guys saying any IAA program that has, oh say, 4-5 straight losing seasons should be jetisoned from your ranks?

Or do you evaluate programs just by the amount of money being spent? If that's the case, should programs like say Georegetown be banished?

Try not to let your view from the penthouse affect your opinions of the struggling masses. Let them do the best they can, with what they have. Live & let live.
:confused: What does being a Delaware fan have to do with any of this? I think you're hearing Delaware fans speak up because many Hen fans are familiar with LaSalle. Are you expecting commentary from Montana or Georgia Southern fans on a non-schollie team from Philly? :confused:

Do you really consider LaSalle to be one of the "struggling masses" in I-AA? They are at the very bottom of I-AA and are I-AA only because of the stupid NCAA mandate that forces them to be.

BTW, LaSalle is 0-2 vs Delaware Valley.

[faxjusfax]

Attacking your credibility? When did I do that? I directed my response to your statement ...

"I'm not a believer of football at any cost - if they aren't going to support it, don't bother in my opinion".

The Explorer fans all wish there was more $ support, but we count our blessings in tiny steps. Have your opinion, but there are a base of supporters who want to keep the program going.

... and where did I ever say La Salle is using football to 'sell' people to come to La Salle (talk about how to rebut arguements!).

Expressing opinions? All for it. On this one I'm simply stating let the different programs find there own levels and go from there. Embarrassment?, I won't even comment on that bit of elitism

[DFW HOYA]

McCarthy Stadium is as nice as any other MAAC field and at least one other Patriot field.

http://www.ecampustours.com/VirtualTours/Default.aspx?FafsaCode=003287&login=false%20

[GannonFan]

McCarthy Stadium is as nice as any other MAAC field and at least one other Patriot field.

http://www.ecampustours.com/VirtualTours/Default.aspx?FafsaCode=003287&login=false%20

I'm not sure what to make of that - LaSalle's field isn't even the best football field in the Northeast part of the city - heck, Edison High School's field and stadium are just as nice and Philadelphia Public League football isn't very good.

[GannonFan]

Attacking your credibility? When did I do that? I directed my response to your statement ...

"I'm not a believer of football at any cost - if they aren't going to support it, don't bother in my opinion".

The Explorer fans all wish there was more $ support, but we count our blessings in tiny steps. Have your opinion, but there are a base of supporters who want to keep the program going.

... and where did I ever say La Salle is using football to 'sell' people to come to La Salle (talk about how to rebut arguements!).

Expressing opinions? All for it. On this one I'm simply stating let the different programs find there own levels and go from there. Embarrassment?, I won't even comment on that bit of elitism

First, it was DFW Hoya who made the comment about attracting more males to LaSalle as a reason to have football, so apologies there for attributing that to you, although I wasn't the one who called LaSalle an embarassment, so I'll take an apology for that one and we're even.

And I don't doubt that LaSalle has supporters, I'm sure they do. I just don't see the program ever being able to move beyond the level where it is now, and I think that level is even well beneath the level of other IAA non-schollies. LaSalle is the quintessential IAA school that would be lucky to be competitive at the DIII level - it's almost a disservice to the good IAA non-scholly programs (Dusquene, Dayton, San Diego, etc) to throw them in the mix. And that's where my take on this topic started from - a person asking about the experience of seeing IAA football at LaSalle - I just don't think it's all that. To each their own.

[Marcus Garvey]

John Gianni (sp?) really has the LaSalle men's basketball team turned around after 2 seasons. Especially when you consider how rock bottom they hit. Only St. Bonnies was worse in the A-10.

If LaSalle becomes a contender for the A-10 title, NCAA bids are sure to follow, with NIT bids during "off" years. Should that happen, the football program becomes superfluous. When the budget needs slashing, the football team will be one of the first casualties.

[DFW HOYA]

If LaSalle becomes a contender for the A-10 title, NCAA bids are sure to follow, with NIT bids during "off" years. Should that happen, the football program becomes superfluous. When the budget needs slashing, the football team will be one of the first casualties.

I don't understand the logic. NCAA bids are sure to follow at Villanova or Georgetown, yet is neither superfluous nor a casualty. Maintaining basketball and football is not a zero-sum game.

There are clear patterns which skew a student body in schools which have dropped football. Santa Clara dropped from 51% to 41% male enrollment in the 12 years after dropping football, and its main arts and sciences college is now 65% female.

Women now constitute 60% of LaSalle's student enrollment vs. just 53% at Villanova and 51% at Penn. Football is not responsible for all the variance among the three, but a well-rounded campus experience is certainly enhanced when there are more opportunities for male student-athletes, as well as for applicants drawn to a diverse campus life.

[blukeys]

I don't understand the logic. NCAA bids are sure to follow at Villanova or Georgetown, yet is neither superfluous nor a casualty. Maintaining basketball and football is not a zero-sum game.

There are clear patterns which skew a student body in schools which have dropped football. Santa Clara dropped from 51% to 41% male enrollment in the 12 years after dropping football, and its main arts and sciences college is now 65% female.

Women now constitute 60% of LaSalle's student enrollment vs. just 53% at Villanova and 51% at Penn. Football is not responsible for all the variance among the three, but a well-rounded campus experience is certainly enhanced when there are more opportunities for male student-athletes, as well as for applicants drawn to a diverse campus life.


As someone who has coached girls since 1990 I can tell you that a football team also attracts female applicants to a school. Many girls have applied to football schools with the idea that it will have an interesting social life in addition to the academics they are looking for (typically their first priority). While it is not the primary factor in their decision, it is a factor. Those school that have football as an event have an advantage.

If a student is Harvard bound they will not really care about the football team but for the average college bound student who is looking at the full college experience a football team and the atmosphere that surrounds it is indeed a factor. Female applicants do not have to be rabid football fans to appreciated the social aspect of fall football games. :nod: :nod:

This is the reason football makes sense for so many schools who on paper are losing money on the sport. :nod: :nod:

[Tribe4SF]

Why pick on La Salle? They outdrew 9 other I-AA programs last year, and have upgraded their facilities. As their program improves, they may outdraw some of our A-10 brethren. Northeastern has issues, and a "high school field"....should they give up football as well?

I'm with FJF on this. Smells of Blue Hen elitism.:nono:

[Marcus Garvey]

I don't understand the logic. NCAA bids are sure to follow at Villanova or Georgetown, yet is neither superfluous nor a casualty. Maintaining basketball and football is not a zero-sum game.

I have no idea what you mean by that statement.

Football at 'Nova and G'town is a much bigger deal than at LaSalle. It was instituted almost with a "why the hell not?" attitude. Anyway, LaSalle isn't in the Big East getting huge TV contract money either, so you can't compare those two schools to them.

[DFW HOYA]

I have no idea what you mean by that statement.

Football at 'Nova and G'town is a much bigger deal than at LaSalle. It was instituted almost with a "why the hell not?" attitude. Anyway, LaSalle isn't in the Big East getting huge TV contract money either, so you can't compare those two schools to them.

The post was in response to the claim that 'When the budget needs slashing, the football team will be one of the first casualties." That's not a certainty unless we know where football fits into the overall picture at LaSalle.

LaSalle gets criticized for not spending as much on football as its conference peers, but why whould LaSalle throw money at a five team league which is perpetually on the critical list? A new, more stable conference might compel them to build its budget, much as it did when GU was spending LaSalle-type money in the MAAC and moved up to the Patriot.

[GannonFan]

I'm with FJF on this. Smells of Blue Hen elitism.:nono:

Or, it could be people who have an actual idea and proximity to the situation? Hmmmm.