Duquesne Football in Search of New League

[TexasTerror]

Let the mid-major shakeup continue! Patriot or Pioneer for Duquesne? Who will they leave their current abode for? Can they even make amove?

Oh yeah, according to this article, "Duquesne is a member of the A-10 for all of its other sports, which compete in Division I-A." Huh?
------
District spotlight: Duquesne football in search of a league

Saturday, June 03, 2006
By Phil Axelrod, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

Now that Duquesne athletic director Greg Amodio is comfortable Ron Everhart has the men's basketball program headed in the right direction, he is contemplating a new path for the school's highly successful football program.

The Dukes, a perennial NCAA Division I-AA non-scholarship power, have won seven consecutive Metro Atlantic Athletic Conference championships and 37 consecutive league games.

But the MAAC has dwindled from a high of nine teams as recently as 2002 to five schools -- Duquesne, Iona, LaSalle, Marist and Saint Peter's.

"We're committed to competing in the MAAC this season, but it's become increasingly more difficult to compete in a conference with only a four-game schedule," Amodio said. "We have continued to excel in a deluded MAAC, now we want to align ourselves with a solid football conference with a solid future.

"We'd like to be known as a power team in a well-regarded conference."

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/06154/695440-134.stm

[carney2]

Personally, I don't see the Patriot as a good fit, but, on the other hand, the Dukes would be a much better match than Towson.

[Ken_Z]

an additional key excerpt from the article:

"The Patriot League isn't taking any additional members just for football,"

while adding all sports members has been the stated focus of the league, the reality is that this is not likely to happen without scholarships. we were willing to take Richmond for football last year so who knows how strict a statement this is. maybe, we are not willing to take Duquesne for football only, or maybe just maybe Mr. 13's dream is in play.

[*****]

"The Pioneer League seems to make a fit for Duquesne," Amodio said. "The Pioneer League is a bit more stable than the MAAC. If we stay I-AA non-scholarship, the only other real option is the Pioneer League. And in all likelihood, we're going to continue to be I-AA non-scholarship.

"There's already conversation on the table [with the Pioneer League]. I want to make sure we put ourselves in the best situation as quickly as possible."

The Pioneer League is the only option for Duquesne because the Northeast Conference, which includes Robert Morris and St. Francis, Pa., among its members, is offering 30 athletic scholarships for the first time this fall after being a non-scholarship league. The Patriot League also offers the equivalency of athletic scholarships.Another good quote.

[Sly Fox]

Hey, the Big South is looking for another member. And since according to many on this board our league is so bad then they could probably win with little or no scholies, right?

[DFW HOYA]

From the article: "The Patriot League isn't taking any additional members just for football," Amodio said."

So according to the article:
--The NEC is out.
--The A-10/CAA is out.
--The PL isn't interested.
--The MAAC is going nowhere (literally and figuratively).

Short of a bid to the Big South, the Pioneer seems to be the only league in play.

[mainejeff]

From the article: "The Patriot League isn't taking any additional members just for football," Amodio said."

So according to the article:
--The NEC is out.
--The A-10/CAA is out.
--The PL isn't interested.
--The MAAC is going nowhere (literally and figuratively).

Short of a bid to the Big South, the Pioneer seems to be the only league in play.

America East may be an option.

[DFW HOYA]

America East may be an option.

If Duquesne can't afford a scholarship upgrade to the NEC, A-East won't be likely, either.

[Go...gate]

With Austin Peay leaving the Pioneer, DU would be a good fit there, but IMHO, they would also have some good synergies with the Patriot, such as extending the league's footprint about 300 miles to the west.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

This should be required reading for anyone who still thought that Duquesne is a serious consideration for the PL. It's clearly not so. Duquesne is only considering the Pioneer - it simply has to be so.

There's a bigger issue at play here. This move would pull the MAAC apart completely, leaving the MAAC to try to get another member or busting up the MAAC completely. I'd say a bust-up would be more likely in this case.

Then what happens with the other four? LaSalle, St.Peters, Iona, and Marist? Would any of them try to replace Stony Brook in the NEC? That would mean a ramp-up in scholarships Would any of their ADs would be willing to do that?

LaSalle looks pretty doomed, as they would be an affiliate anywhere they went and has shown no inclination they want to even keep football. Would any of the other three consider jumping the MAAC in all sports to another conference like the NEC or Patriot?

For the Patriot, Marist seems like the only school that would have an outside shot to be admitted, and it would be an awful tough sell. It's also very unclear if any of these teams would leave the MAAC in all sports. Certainly Iona seems very unlikely to go, as their big rival is Manhattan College.

Finally, are there any D-II or D-III teams looking to jump to I-AA non-scholly that might replace Duquesne? I certainly don't see any.

I see the long-term survival of the MAAC as the key takeaway from this article.

[UAalum72]

MAAC football is already virtually dead, but I don't see these Catholic schools leaving to be all-sports members of the NEC or PL- their attitude is that the MAAC is SUCH a superior basketball conference, they wouldn't associate with a lesser league, and hoops is all they really care about anyway.

[maacfb]

I agree UAalum

[DFW HOYA]

The MAAC is a failing basketball conference. Where once it had momentum (in the Lionel Simmons days), the remaining schools seem in a time warp of sorts.

Basketball wise, it has been passed over by the Colonial with the America East and Patriot not far behind.

Football-wise, it was a league with some early momentum too--how many I-AA leagues got a game on ESPN2 in its second year? There were plans brewing to expand the MAAC to 12 teams by 1996, including Fordham and Holy Cross, but the MAAC opted to protect the low-budget schools by seeking a strict no scholarship, no equivalency policy, essentially a "no growth" policy that drove St. John's and Georgetown out, sank Siena and Canisius, and to which Fairfield ultimately gave up on. Ironically, Fairfield would have likely been a better PL target than Duquesne had it kept football. By not expanding, the NEC picked up the ball among this group and passed the MAAC by.

I think Amodio's comment speak of the frustration of a league which has no idea of what it wants for football, and no effort to build a long term option for its member schools.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

DFW or anybody, think there is a chance that some of these MAAC schools might be a target for PL expansion in all sports? Although academically a stretch, Iona, St. Peter's and Marist are private schools that could fit a la Holy Cross.

I tend to still have a pretty decent regard for MAAC basketball. They always have a pretty good representative in the tourney, and they've made it out of the first round a couple times. Is it really behind PL basketball?

[I-AA Fan]

Personally, I don't see the Patriot as a good fit, but, on the other hand, the Dukes would be a much better match than Towson.

Sorry if you were being sarcastic, but just in case. Duquesne is non-scholarship ...the PL is not ...clearly not a choice (let's not get into the idiotic scholarship vs. grant discussion). Secondly, Towson (with only a decent team) would walk all over the Dukes. This is not meant to be an attack on Duquesne, or a praise of Towson; just the reality of non-scholarship football ...and the level they play.

[maacfb]

out of the MAAC schools listed Marist would be the closest to PL standards but they are still below the league's academic rep although they would love to get to that level. (Their avg SAT is in the high 1100's and I know the existing PL schools are in the mid 1200-1300 range)I just dont see Marist stepping up the football funding and as a basketball school I wonder if Matt Brady signed up to be a PL bball coach. Imo either conference is fine for bball as neither conference will ever get more than 1 autobid to the NCAA tournament but that isnt how the administration sees it.

[TheValleyRaider]

out of the MAAC schools listed Marist would be the closest to PL standards but they are still below the league's academic rep although they would love to get to that level. (Their avg SAT is in the high 1100's and I know the existing PL schools are in the mid 1200-1300 range)I just dont see Marist stepping up the football funding and as a basketball school I wonder if Matt Brady signed up to be a PL bball coach. Imo either conference is fine for bball as neither conference will ever get more than 1 autobid to the NCAA tournament but that isnt how the administration sees it.

The MAAC as a BBall conference is also a collection of Catholic or formerly Catholic colleges. While Marist might have (or want) some connection with Holy Cross, other than that the MAAC is more of the kind of place they want to be. Remeber the MAAC was one of the mid-major conferences du jour when Iona and Manhattan were winning the conference. Once every few years their champ is going to be an upset special in the first round, but I can't see Marist gaining much more traction in the PL then they'd already have. All that, and I'd like to have Marist in the PL, as having a school from my home town in my school's conference is a nice idea to me. :twocents:

[Go...gate]

If the PL is going to have another member, associate or all-sports, I have a feeling it is going to be one of those "right place at the right time with the right credentials" deals. :twocents:

[colgate13]

If the PL is going to have another member, associate or all-sports, I have a feeling it is going to be one of those "right place at the right time with the right credentials" deals. :twocents:

ABSOLUTELY.

There will be no band-aid schools unless there needs to be. The next football affiliate school will probably be a no-brainer associate that forces us to bend our ideal situation (Richmond/Villanova come to mind). When basketball jumps up several more notches in mid-major play and stays there, then we will see the options open up wide.

Duquesne/Marist/etc. as an affiliate is a quick fix in case a team like Holy Cross dropped football or a team like Fordham left. :twocents:

BTW, I thought this quote was hysterical:



A-10 members Massachusetts, Rhode Island and Richmond offer 60-65 athletic scholarships and compete in the football-only Colonial League.
"That's not even on our radar," Amodio said of joining the Colonial League. He added with emphasis, "There's no thought in having a university without a football team."


The Colonial League? I bet this reporter hasn't been around long enough to understand mentioning the Patriot League (formerly the Colonial League) and the Colonial League (actually the Colonial Athletic Association) in the same sentence is too much! xlolx

[Pard4Life]

ABSOLUTELY.

There will be no band-aid schools unless there needs to be. The next football affiliate school will probably be a no-brainer associate that forces us to bend our ideal situation (Richmond/Villanova come to mind). When basketball jumps up several more notches in mid-major play and stays there, then we will see the options open up wide.



But will there ever be a 'right place, right time' in the future? Richmond seems to have voted to stay in the A10, I have no clue about Villanova's intentions and there is no reason to believe they would want to leave. Aside from the 'quick fixes' of Marist and the Dukes, which do not even match-up with the PL profile, there are no other schools that are suitable for the PL. So, is this PL expansion issue a moot point? Will it ever go anywhere? I don't see us expanding, :twocents: , although I'd like to get one more solid school in our league.

[colgate13]

But will there ever be a 'right place, right time' in the future? Richmond seems to have voted to stay in the A10, I have no clue about Villanova's intentions and there is no reason to believe they would want to leave. Aside from the 'quick fixes' of Marist and the Dukes, which do not even match-up with the PL profile, there are no other schools that are suitable for the PL. So, is this PL expansion issue a moot point? Will it ever go anywhere? I don't see us expanding, :twocents: , although I'd like to get one more solid school in our league.
PL expansion hinges on two things, in this order:

1 - a stronger, significantly stronger, basketball profile. Think about having at least 3 if not 4 or more 'Bucknell's". Sure, Holy Cross is probably one of them, but not definitely. Who's next? Lafayette with scholarships? Lehigh? American?

This is the cash cow sport that needs to grow in stature. IF that can happen and...

2 - football scholarships are allowed, suddenly we might be a good place for teams to park their allegiance.

First things first; we've got to take care of hoops. We do that, and maybe in 10 years Duquense says "how about all sports?"

[Pard4Life]

PL expansion hinges on two things, in this order:

1 - a stronger, significantly stronger, basketball profile. Think about having at least 3 if not 4 or more 'Bucknell's". Sure, Holy Cross is probably one of them, but not definitely. Who's next? Lafayette with scholarships? Lehigh? American?

This is the cash cow sport that needs to grow in stature. IF that can happen and...

2 - football scholarships are allowed, suddenly we might be a good place for teams to park their allegiance.

First things first; we've got to take care of hoops. We do that, and maybe in 10 years Duquense says "how about all sports?"

Even if we raise our profile internally, would there even be a market of teams to court for the expansion process? Marist is the only one coming to mind. I don't think the PL wants another American in our midst.

[colgate13]

Even if we raise our profile internally, would there even be a market of teams to court for the expansion process? Marist is the only one coming to mind. I don't think the PL wants another American in our midst.

If the PL got on par with the A-10 basketball conference, our options increase. There are schools out there...

[Pard4Life]

If the PL got on par with the A-10 basketball conference, our options increase. There are schools out there...

The A10 is in a free fall in terms of basketball quality, but I think it would be hard to match the A10. We only have 8 teams. Army.. always bad, American... good, not stellar; Bucknell... we all know their story; Colgate - they couldn't care about hoops; Holy Cross... definete power that won't stay down; Lafayette.. we will be back to the top; Lehigh... unknown but they can rise; Navy.. unknown.

So are you hinting at the PL picking up A10 schools? They just expanded, I don't know how fast the league could disintegrate. Even if Fordham came back to the PL they would not enhance our image. Fordham is rarely competitive in basketball as it is. And they are already a football member.

I don't see any teams out there 13.

[Lehigh Football Nation]

The A10 is in a free fall in terms of basketball quality, but I think it would be hard to match the A10. We only have 8 teams. Army.. always bad, American... good, not stellar; Bucknell... we all know their story; Colgate - they couldn't care about hoops; Holy Cross... definete power that won't stay down; Lafayette.. we will be back to the top; Lehigh... unknown but they can rise; Navy.. unknown.

So are you hinting at the PL picking up A10 schools? They just expanded, I don't know how fast the league could disintegrate. Even if Fordham came back to the PL they would not enhance our image. Fordham is rarely competitive in basketball as it is. And they are already a football member.

I don't see any teams out there 13.

This Wednesday, I'm tackling this one on my blog. You'll have to wait to see the analysis... ;)

Rest assured, there are some possibilities. How likely are they? That's the question.....

[kardplayer]

I'll admit it, I'm a snob - and I want the best of both worlds. If a school isn't solid academically, I don't want them. They also have to be athletically competitive as well. I'm ok with an athletic adjustment period, but the Patriot League is a good academic brand and I don't want to f with it by lowering the bar (American is low enough, thank you very much).

I'm indifferent to schollies vs. grants and about funding - I'm going to assume for this analysis that can be worked out before any expansion/completion were to occur.

I don't want to expand the footprint unless absolutely necessary - these kids are supposed to be students first, and I don't want some Holy Cross tennis player to have to get to Ohio for a Wednesday afternoon match.

With that established, I looked at US News & World Reports school rankings. The PL schools are on 2 scales - some are universities, some are colleges (and I don't understand the split), but here are the rankings (Army and Navy don't appear to be ranked, but I didn't look that hard for them either)...

"Uni's"
Georgetown - 23
Lehigh - 32
Fordham - 68
American - 85

"Colleges"
Colgate - 15
Bucknell - 27
Lafayette - 27
Holy Cross - 32

With that in mind, there really are only a few schools that currently play I-AA football that make any sense to me:

Universities
Villanova (#1 on the Masters list)
William and Mary - 31
Delaware - 66
Stony Brook as a RIDICULOUS stretch at 97
Marist is also #16 on the Masters list, but I'm not sure how that calibrates with the rest of the University list
Colleges
Richmond - 34
Furman - 41 (and they're outside of the current footprint, but with their academics, I could make this exception)
Wofford - 55 (also outside the footprint, but solid academically)That's it - and frankly I don't see how any of those schools would work, unless something massive and odd happens with the CAA and/or the Southern Conference...

I may be shortsighted here, but I don't see how the PL can expand without deluting the academic standing...

[carney2]

This Wednesday, I'm tackling this one on my blog. You'll have to wait to see the analysis... ;)

Rest assured, there are some possibilities. How likely are they? That's the question.....

13 suggested Johns Hopkins at one point. Is it on your list?

[ngineer]

13 suggested Johns Hopkins at one point. Is it on your list?

Don't know if they would want elevate all of their sports...but having their LAX program in the PL would certainly create a stir!

[ngineer]

I'll admit it, I'm a snob - and I want the best of both worlds. If a school isn't solid academically, I don't want them. They also have to be athletically competitive as well. I'm ok with an athletic adjustment period, but the Patriot League is a good academic brand and I don't want to f with it by lowering the bar (American is low enough, thank you very much).

I'm indifferent to schollies vs. grants and about funding - I'm going to assume for this analysis that can be worked out before any expansion/completion were to occur.

I don't want to expand the footprint unless absolutely necessary - these kids are supposed to be students first, and I don't want some Holy Cross tennis player to have to get to Ohio for a Wednesday afternoon match.

With that established, I looked at US News & World Reports school rankings. The PL schools are on 2 scales - some are universities, some are colleges (and I don't understand the split), but here are the rankings (Army and Navy don't appear to be ranked, but I didn't look that hard for them either)...

"Uni's"
Georgetown - 23
Lehigh - 32
Fordham - 68
American - 85

"Colleges"
Colgate - 15
Bucknell - 27
Lafayette - 27
Holy Cross - 32

With that in mind, there really are only a few schools that currently play I-AA football that make any sense to me:

Universities
Villanova (#1 on the Masters list)
William and Mary - 31
Delaware - 66
Stony Brook as a RIDICULOUS stretch at 97
Marist is also #16 on the Masters list, but I'm not sure how that calibrates with the rest of the University list
Colleges
Richmond - 34
Furman - 41 (and they're outside of the current footprint, but with their academics, I could make this exception)
Wofford - 55 (also outside the footprint, but solid academically)That's it - and frankly I don't see how any of those schools would work, unless something massive and odd happens with the CAA and/or the Southern Conference...

I may be shortsighted here, but I don't see how the PL can expand without deluting the academic standing...

William & Mary was an original member of the Colonial/PL in 1986, but bailed when the alumni found out they had to ditch the scholarships--so unless that issue is resolve, first, a number of these schools won't give it the time of day. Richmond, Furman, and Wofford would fit the PL mold, but geography becomes a problem.

[DFW HOYA]

I'd add VMI and Boston U. (with football) to that candidates list as well.

[JoltinJoe]

The A10 is in a free fall in terms of basketball quality, but I think it would be hard to match the A10. We only have 8 teams. Army.. always bad, American... good, not stellar; Bucknell... we all know their story; Colgate - they couldn't care about hoops; Holy Cross... definete power that won't stay down; Lafayette.. we will be back to the top; Lehigh... unknown but they can rise; Navy.. unknown.

So are you hinting at the PL picking up A10 schools? They just expanded, I don't know how fast the league could disintegrate. Even if Fordham came back to the PL they would not enhance our image. Fordham is rarely competitive in basketball as it is. And they are already a football member.

I don't see any teams out there 13.

I think it's a stretch to say that a conference that placed two teams in the final eight just two years ago is in a "free fall." And both those teams would have made the Final Four if the refs didn't make some dubious calls down the stretch.

The A-10 consistently finishes in the Top 10 in RPI, and usually finds its place at No. 7, behind the six "BCS" conferences. I think it was a down year for the A-10. Two years ago, the A-10 lost many, many talented seniors and has been a young conference the last two seasons. But I don't see the CAA, the Missouri Valley, or the Mountain West finishing ahead of the A-10 again next year in RPI, or establishing any long-term trend of superiority over the A-10.

As for Fordham, the Rams are an NCAA contender next year. They return a great young team.

[Ken_Z]

If the PL got on par with the A-10 basketball conference, our options increase. There are schools out there...

you all need to think BIG. Mr. 13 is being uncharacteristically reserved in his statements regarding the potential impact on the PL. Point being, the PL needs to continue to work and improve, but does not even have to reach par with the current A10 basketball for some very attractive schools to jump on board.

the A10 is the MAAC on steroids, but the pimples are showing.

[Pard4Life]

I think it's a stretch to say that a conference that placed two teams in the final eight just two years ago is in a "free fall." And both those teams would have made the Final Four if the refs didn't make some dubious calls down the stretch.

The A-10 consistently finishes in the Top 10 in RPI, and usually finds its place at No. 7, behind the six "BCS" conferences. I think it was a down year for the A-10. Two years ago, the A-10 lost many, many talented seniors and has been a young conference the last two seasons. But I don't see the CAA, the Missouri Valley, or the Mountain West finishing ahead of the A-10 again next year in RPI, or establishing any long-term trend of superiority over the A-10.

As for Fordham, the Rams are an NCAA contender next year. They return a great young team.

I'm not so sure about that. The MVC has steadily increased its profile over the past several seasons. You have Creighton, So. Illinois, N. Iowa, that have been consistently good. Wichita St. finally got over the hump.

What credibilty does the A10 have? St. Joseph's in 2004 was an anomaly. Xavier's run was magic. But after that, the league has seriously been only one or two team worthy. GW was a prime example of how weak the A10 is. They tear through the conference with a guady record, struggle in close games at the end of the year, and bow out in the NCAAs. Nobody else in that league was competitve. St. Joes got beat by Bucknell.. again.. Temple has played with a whimper. Cheney is gone. No team strikes fear in the A10. I'd be more fearful and pumped to play if an MVC team came to town.

[Pard4Life]

William & Mary was an original member of the Colonial/PL in 1986, but bailed when the alumni found out they had to ditch the scholarships--so unless that issue is resolve, first, a number of these schools won't give it the time of day. Richmond, Furman, and Wofford would fit the PL mold, but geography becomes a problem.

Why would Furman and Wofford ever want to leave the prime I-AA conference with multitudes of exposure to the PL?

[Pard4Life]

I'll admit it, I'm a snob - and I want the best of both worlds. If a school isn't solid academically, I don't want them. They also have to be athletically competitive as well. I'm ok with an athletic adjustment period, but the Patriot League is a good academic brand and I don't want to f with it by lowering the bar (American is low enough, thank you very much).

I'm indifferent to schollies vs. grants and about funding - I'm going to assume for this analysis that can be worked out before any expansion/completion were to occur.

I don't want to expand the footprint unless absolutely necessary - these kids are supposed to be students first, and I don't want some Holy Cross tennis player to have to get to Ohio for a Wednesday afternoon match.

With that established, I looked at US News & World Reports school rankings. The PL schools are on 2 scales - some are universities, some are colleges (and I don't understand the split), but here are the rankings (Army and Navy don't appear to be ranked, but I didn't look that hard for them either)...

"Uni's"
Georgetown - 23
Lehigh - 32
Fordham - 68
American - 85

"Colleges"
Colgate - 15
Bucknell - 27
Lafayette - 27
Holy Cross - 32

With that in mind, there really are only a few schools that currently play I-AA football that make any sense to me:

Universities
Villanova (#1 on the Masters list)
William and Mary - 31
Delaware - 66
Stony Brook as a RIDICULOUS stretch at 97
Marist is also #16 on the Masters list, but I'm not sure how that calibrates with the rest of the University list
Colleges
Richmond - 34
Furman - 41 (and they're outside of the current footprint, but with their academics, I could make this exception)
Wofford - 55 (also outside the footprint, but solid academically)That's it - and frankly I don't see how any of those schools would work, unless something massive and odd happens with the CAA and/or the Southern Conference...

I may be shortsighted here, but I don't see how the PL can expand without deluting the academic standing...

I will be a snob too. I wouldn't want another American in the PL. We only needed them to save our existence and they don't contribute anything to football. I'd say once we expand with some quality programs, we boot them out to the CAA. You are what the company you keep. I'd also be wary about going outside the geographic footprint, but then again we had Davidson in our league back in the day.

I think Virginia would be as far as the PL should expand, and as west as Pittsburgh. Of those schools, I'd love to see the Tribe in the PL, the same with Richmond. If we tag both of them, their rivalry could be preserved. I'd also love to see Marist. But then again, would Richmond and William and Mary ever want to leave their league?? It seems like they have a nice setup, and yes, this is all contingent upon football schollies. So we are talking PL 2012-2013 here... yikes I feel old.

(And I think our USNWR ranking will go up alot, thanks to D.W. :) )

So here is my super football Patriot League.

Patriot League 2012:

Blue Division
Colgate
Holy Cross
Marist
Fordham
Bucknell
(Duquesne? long shot)

Red Division
Lafayette
Lehigh
Richmond
William Mary
G'town
(Hopkins? long-shot..)

And could we get Hopkins on board?

[JoltinJoe]

I'm not so sure about that. The MVC has steadily increased its profile over the past several seasons. You have Creighton, So. Illinois, N. Iowa, that have been consistently good. Wichita St. finally got over the hump.

What credibilty does the A10 have? St. Joseph's in 2004 was an anomaly. Xavier's run was magic. But after that, the league has seriously been only one or two team worthy. GW was a prime example of how weak the A10 is. They tear through the conference with a guady record, struggle in close games at the end of the year, and bow out in the NCAAs. Nobody else in that league was competitve. St. Joes got beat by Bucknell.. again.. Temple has played with a whimper. Cheney is gone. No team strikes fear in the A10. I'd be more fearful and pumped to play if an MVC team came to town.

What credibility has the A-10? Two teams in the NCAA Elite Eight in 2004, and a long-term RPI rating placing it as the 7th most competitive conference in the nation.

As for GW, you overlook that the Colonials lost one of the best players in the county, Pops Mensah-Bonsu, to a serious kneww injury in February. Although he returned for the NCAAs, he was nowhere near 100%. Also, GW won a first-round game before running into No. 1 seeded Duke. If GWU had been seeded properly (the excuse given for the No. 6 was that GW was down toward the end of the season due to the injury to Pops), the Colonials would have found their way into the Sweet 16. But because of their seeding, they drew a second-round game with Duke.

[Pard4Life]

What credibility has the A-10? Two teams in the NCAA Elite Eight in 2004, and a long-term RPI rating placing it as the 7th most competitive conference in the nation.

As for GW, you overlook that the Colonials lost one of the best players in the county, Pops Mensah-Bonsu, to a serious kneww injury in February. Although he returned for the NCAAs, he was nowhere near 100%. Also, GW won a first-round game before running into No. 1 seeded Duke. If GWU had been seeded properly (the excuse given for the No. 6 was that GW was down toward the end of the season due to the injury to Pops), the Colonials would have found their way into the Sweet 16. But because of their seeding, they drew a second-round game with Duke.

Ah right the Pops injury. Even so, if the Colonials were from a more powerful conference and carried the same profile, they definetely would not have been an 8 seed even with the injury.

But back to football... would Fordham be on board with scholarships in the new PL? I know the other school's positions... I just can't remember Fordham. I'd guess they would be in favor.

[Fordham]

yes, Pard, we support it.

[Pard4Life]

yes, Pard, we support it.

So, the only ones not on the scholarship boat from what I discern are Holy Cross and Georgetown.

What do people think of the "Super Patriot League 2013"?

Red:
Bucknell
Colgate
Holy Cross
Fordham
Marist

Blue:
Lafayette
Lehigh
G'town
Richmond
William and Mary

[Go...gate]

Red and Blue Divisions are nice, but in keeping with the "Patriot" theme, I prefer the "Patrick Henry" and "Paul Revere" Divisons (or perhaps the "Samuel Adams" Division) :smiley_wi xprost2x xprost2x :smiley_wi

[Fordham]

So, the only ones not on the scholarship boat from what I discern are Holy Cross and Georgetown.

What do people think of the "Super Patriot League 2013"?

Ballerina:
Bucknell
Colgate
Holy Cross
Fordham
Marist

Lil' Sissies:
Lafayette
Lehigh
G'town
Richmond
William and Mary

Hmmm ... no knock on Marist, but where did they come from? Is there a reason you have them in there as opposed to someone like 'Nova?

[colgate13]

William and Mary is a serious stretch. Drop Marist and trade W&M for Villanova and you've got a nice 9 team league w/o divisions. That would be ideal. With scholarships that's a league that could make some noise nationally.

[colgate13]

So, the only ones not on the scholarship boat from what I discern are Holy Cross and Georgetown.
Yes, Holy Cross is off the boat right now. Georgetown is still an unknown, to me at least. I guess you could make an arguement that Georgetown could be in favour of them. Just because they spend less than the rest of the league doesn't mean they wouldn't want to spend what they do cough up in a more efficient manner that could land them some better recruits. :twocents:

In that scenario, the rest of the league could be living on 55+ scholarships and G'Town is living on 20. Still an inequity, but there is nothing per se that they wouldn't want at least the same options as the rest of the league, just having less opportunity.

[Pard4Life]

William and Mary is a serious stretch. Drop Marist and trade W&M for Villanova and you've got a nice 9 team league w/o divisions. That would be ideal. With scholarships that's a league that could make some noise nationally.

I agree with the national noise sentiment. I know William and Mary is a stretch but it was passed along as super-speculation, and they would fit very nicely into the PL.

I noticed you said 'nine' team league.. so that is Bucknell, Colgate, Holy Cross, Georgetown, Lafayette, Lehigh, Fordham... 8. Richmond 9. Villanova? That would be a very dangerous league, definetely a national top 5 conference.

[colgate13]

I noticed you said 'nine' team league.. so that is Bucknell, Colgate, Holy Cross, Georgetown, Lafayette, Lehigh, Fordham... 8. Richmond 9. Villanova? That would be a very dangerous league, definetely a national top 5 conference.

That is the current football dream my friend.

[Pard4Life]

Hmmm ... no knock on Marist, but where did they come from? Is there a reason you have them in there as opposed to someone like 'Nova?

Many people seem to speculate Marist and I could see why it is logical... small school, respectable academics with a rising profile, and they play several PL teams and many throughout the past years. Marist has played Lafayette, Holy Cross, and Bucknell recently.. and I can't recall G'town or not.

Villanova.. I don't know. I know people pass their name around but I am not sure how they would fit into the PL if they would want to be in the PL. Marist makes more sense.

Also, the there is another thread that is saying Villanova could make the I-A jump too. Talk about paradoxes.. I-A or Patriot League..

[colgate13]

Villanova.. I don't know. I know people pass their name around but I am not sure how they would fit into the PL if they would want to be in the PL. Marist makes more sense.


Disagree. Villanova is much more a national school with better academics (I believe).